DP and shared house with sibling ! AIBU

[Istheyearoveryet21]

Ok - I am not new by the way but changed my name for this post. I will try to explain the best I can and no drip feed.

My dp and I have 3 kids between us ( me 3 him 1 )
Anyway I have my own house and he moved in.
Years ago him and his sibling got a mortgage on a house splitting the deposit and have been splitting the mortgage ever since.
This is a nice house in a nice area and his sibling lives in the house with partner and kids. . . DP has never lived there.
Now we have our own child, and he is living with me I don’t think it’s fair he is paying half a mortgage of a house he doesn’t live in or benefit from in anyway.
He said it was an investment and that it was meant so when he was ready to need a family home then he would take money out and have a deposit but of course this hasn’t worked because he doesn’t want to upset family.
So as it stands I am the higher earner but work much more hours. When it comes to finances we join money apart from this 500.00 he pays towards this other mortgage every month !
Now his sibling wants to sell the house and get another house using the money from the first house. I have asked DP to take his part money and to stop funding the mortgage also as we have our own family / house to pay for.
Am I being a total cow ?

But that is what happens to most people when they climb the ladder..... sell, use equity and another (often bigger!) mortgage.

They’re lucky they’ve not been paying your DP rent for his half all this time!

What’s the point in an investment if you get nothing from it?

I'm in a similar situation with a sibling who put 50% in cash into a property that I then lived in (I also put in some cash and the rest mortgage). However, our agreement was:

• sibling received a monthly 'rent' or return on investment from me
• I paid the mortgage
• We split any major bills e.g. work or repairs
• When the property is sold 50% of the sale price after costs (estate agents etc) goes back to my sibling so they get the benefit of any increase in price, as well as having had a return during the time
• We agreed an initial term of five years, and then agreed to extend a little. We're in the process of selling now
• This agreement was clear and we both went in with our eyes open.

It strikes me that your DH has been had - he hasn't received any return AND has been paying for his brother's lifestyle. It's so odd.

OP,
I feel so sorry for you.
Clearly you have worked so hard and achieved so much on your own and now have had a child and moved in a man who is using you like an unbelievable MUG.

They all can't believe their luck.
For christ sake don't make things worse by marrying this man.

He's stitched you up.
Moved into your house paying the bare minimum whilst he gains equity in another home which you are also subsidising because he contributes so little.

Hard to believe this is real. A woman like you, who has achieved so much on her own would allow such a scenario to happen.

You are going to regret so much throwing your financial independence away on a man who is focused on looking after another family, not his own.

Good luck to you.
You are going to need it, moving such a man into your home.

The arrangement was made before sibling met partner ( partner had 2 kids ) who sibling took on, because of the 2 kids it was agreed they lived in the house.
I am talking to him about it tonight when I get home from the hospital.
I am not a mug and his not Satan he is actually a really nice guy and been amazing to me in many other ways. This is something we have to talk about and as I said I won’t allow it so not sure why I’m being called a mug left right and centre.
Anyway thank you to the ones who were able to comment advice without the mug calling and stupid for having a baby comments like no one has ever made a mistake in their lives before.
Just like my other 2 DC the baby will have a great life no matter what’s the same way I made sure the older 2 have.

Best of luck op. Please think not just about his financial commitments but also how his family might impack your lives. There is a difference between being almost too nice and being spineless, and it could cause you great trouble in the future, if he is unable to say no to his family.

But please don't feel you are being a cow and don't worry what others might think, it's your and your dc's future .

Good luck OP.

Hope the conversation goes well and he sees some sense as its honestly a crazy situation.

He is weak and foolish. Foolish because he went into an arrangement without an exit strategy agreed by all, and weak because he won’t step up and work out that exit strategy now. The original decision to buy with his brother wasn’t necessarily a bad one though.

He maybe lovely in other ways, but I just wouldn’t get yourself financially wrapped up with someone who is weak and foolish about finances.

I say - buy a new house yourself. Take on the larger mortgage - interest rates have never been so low! You have your house, he has his. Well, his half, that he doesn’t have. Just don’t get tied into this nonsense. You’ve done incredibly well on your own - keep it that way.

As for his £500 - make sure that stays his responsibility. Don’t subsidise it. It comes from his disposable income. Don’t split your bills with him paying less because that’s one of his “bills”. It’s not a bill - subsidising his brother (or investing) is his hobby.

I do think he should use this opportunity to get his money out - if not now, with a house sale and his own child as massive triggers - then when? But - don’t make it your issue.

And please god, don’t marry him!

He's not a really nice guy though is he? He's happy to have you fully financially support the child you have together while subsidising both him and his sibling's family. He confirmed this when he told you that your high income meant he could continue financially supporting his sibling.

He will probably change his tune and agree to stop taking the piss when he realises the cushy setup he has is in jeopardy. But I still wouldn't buy a house with him and if you do please at least seek legal advice and make sure both of your deposits are ring-fenced so you can each walk away with what you put in.

4. Thread after thread tells women not to be paying rent to a man or paying towards the mortgage on his house unless she is on the deeds. I wouldn't expect her DP to be paying her rent either because the same principle applies.
However, he should be paying his share of bills plus part of his child's.
Umm not exactly because the op is on mat leave. She is not working because she had their baby. Every decent man pays more during this period (or agrees to quit their job to look after the baby).
Also, there is a serious risk he never gets his equity if he’s the doormat he seems to be with regards to his sibling. The house is only an investment if he will get a return on it! If he’s never going to see a penny on it’d it would literally be cheaper for him to sign it over now and save 500 a month.

From your opening post OP:

it was meant so when he was ready to need a family home then he would take money out

That time has come. He needs a family home because he now has a child with you, and it has to be big enough to accommodate his DSC, too. His sibling and his/her partner need to step up and pay him his share.

They've had their housing costs subsidised by your DP for quite long enough. And if they're in a position to take out an increased mortgage to move to a bigger property, then they're in a position to take out a bigger mortgage to repay your DP his investment, or at least a significant part of it.

Apologies if I've overlooked it, but have you actually suggested that he releases the capital built up in the house he owns with his sibling? And if so, how did he react?

And I agree with PPs, you've been subsidising the sibling's lifestyle too, as by the sounds of it your DP hasn't been paying an equitable contribution to the house he actually lives in.

I can't believe your DP has let this go on for so long. Fuck knows where he'd stand if his sibling married the partner, who might then have some rights towards the house your DP owns half of.

This is bonkers op!

Is the siblings desire to move a status thing? A friend of mine had an older sibling who always had to have bigger car/house/holiday than them just to feel that their status as eldest child was maintained.

You do need to ask your dp when they think they might ever see the investment in their siblings house realised. No one knows what the future holds and he needs to think about that, not just in terms of the current situation but other situations too. If you split up in the future how would he afford to pay their mortgage and pay for his own accommodation? What if you were run over by a bus? What if he lost his job and couldn't get another one that paid at least as well as his current job?

If it was clear that your dp either wants to be bought out or for the property sold and the profits split, like most people I suspect that the sibling will abandon their plans to move. Where does dp stand if sibling marries? If they stay long term will they be moving towards buying dp out or do they expect to have subsided accommodation for ever?

If dp doesn't have clear answers to all these questions it would probably help if he moved in with his sibling for a few months (whilst paying you support for his child which with the current 5/1 split he isn't doing at the moment) to give you all chance to think about the future. It could be the wake up call they all need.

YANBU at all. He has assets that he is not willing to bring to the relationship and he is happy to let you provide despite this significant contribution he could make.
He now has a family - time to behave like it.
Good luck with the chat.

If they sell the house and keep his money then put it into their new house he wont be entitled to anything from the new house automatically. His money will essentially become their money. He would have to take them to court to prove that the money they put into their new house came from the old house sale and that he had put £ into that house. It would be very messy.

Them wanting to sell is the perfect opportunity for him to take his money back out. If they both put in half the deposit and both have paid half the mortgage then he's entitled to half the proceeds after the bank have taken their mortgage out of it.

Also, from SILs point of view, why on earth would you want your BIL to own half your house?

As others have said, DO NOT MARRY HIM.
Protect your assets that you have worked so hard for, for yours and your childrens security.
If you ever buy another house with him make sure your equity share is well and truly protected, because otherwise your eldest 2 might end up with nothing.

The arrangement was made before sibling met partner ( partner had 2 kids ) who sibling took on, because of the 2 kids it was agreed they lived in the house.

She is one cheeky fucker. As is his DB. She has had a subsidised house for years and now expects your (mug) DP to pay for a bigger one.

OP, how,old,is your DD? I'm beginning to sense that she's newborn. In which case, go easy. Maybe (when you've got a quiet 20 mins) put all of your concerns down on paper. Then list all of the options you see going forward. Maybe do some calculations to show how much money he has invested in his sibling versus how much he's planning to contribute to you and his DD. Once you've got clarity, then tackle DP. Otherwise I can see him bulldozing you and trying to make out that you're being unreasonable and thereby delaying a resolution.

OP,
Please try and realise poster's are appalled on your behalf.
Genuinely appalled.
You have worked so hard and achieved so much on your own.

He may be a lovely man but that does not mean he is not taking you for a dope/mug.

You are being TREATED like one.
It doesn't mean you are one.

He has you subsidising him and his family and he thinks that's fair because you earn well.

If this was reversed I would say the very same thing.

You do not owe his sibling anything.

Please keep your financials separate.
Do NOT marry him.

He needs to pay his way and he needs to pay rent to YOU if he lives in YOUR home.

The fact that he wants to give his sibling £500 whilst you pay for him does not mean he is the lovely man you think he is.

Honestly I have never heard the like of it.
They can't believe they are getting away with it.
What if his sibling gets married?
This is now so messy.

If he refuses to realise the profit on his property, well you can either see it for what it is or carry on being taken advantage of by his family.

Most women would run away from the sounds of his free loading family.

Your children need you to continue to be the strong, wise, financially shrewd woman you have always been.

Wishing you the very best.
Mind and protect yourself.

You know that he will end up signing over his share of the house to his sibling, don't you? I'll spare you the full story, but something similar happened in my family. At the time, the person signing over the house and farm thought it was the only way to get out of the situation, but it actually didn't stop the demands or entitlement.

Nobody with the level of entitlement this thread is discussing is going to be happy with getting what they want, because they will just go on to want more.

I really think you will be faced with a choice between this level of blood-sucking CF-ery for the rest of your lives together, or splitting up. these people have decades of experience in manipulating your partner- they have had time to get really good at it! I hope I'm wrong and you can work through this, but I'd strongly advise you not to buy a house together.

Also worth thinking about is that even if he is a truly nice guy and it's not his intention/motivation, their current plan would result in him owning 50% of an asset that you have subsidised but have no legal rights to. And unless he's suggested ringfencing your money he clearly thinks you will be splitting your substantial asset down the middle with him as well as paying more towards the mortgage while his asset is legally protected from you.

I confidently predict if he raises withdrawing from this agreement when the house is sold the sale will be off.

And I would consider that gross cheeky fuckery on the siblings behalf. Hope I'm wrong.

He's not really thinking about this as an investment, is he? If you invest in a house you don't live in, surely the idea is to rent it out? Otherwise, the total youve paid back in mortgage payments is ridiculously more than any increase in value? Because the sibling is living in it rent free, your DP is losing the rental income. It's costing him money to have this 'investment'.
He really needs to either sell up and get his money out and stop this £500 a month cost, or get sibling to pay rent, or sibling move out and get a tenant in to make this a proper investment.

I confidently predict if he raises withdrawing from this agreement when the house is sold the sale will be off

Yep. Then he can tell his brother to buy him out.

I apologise as I've clearly offended you by how I've expressed that - the point is, you are living as one family unit. You make decisions as a family. But his sibling seems to be very much not a part of what you consider to be your family unit

Are you actually on glue? Dude is living rent free with OP, paying for almost nothing, while paying half his siblings housing costs. And you think OP is somehow unreasonable?

Wow, you must be a massive CF to have such an attitude.

timeisnotaline
It's complicated by her being on maternity leave and he should be covering more of the bills during her leave, but on the mortgage and paying rent towards the mortgage then I still think he doesn't because I would always advise a woman not to pay towards a man's mortgage when she isn't on the deeds. I'd advise her to pay for her own investments in her own name whilst covering her bills in a man's house.
It would be hypocritical of me to then say that men should pay to a woman's mortgage and pay her rent towards a property he has no claim to.

Either it's entirely reasonable for the partner moving into someone's house to pay towards the mortgage of a house they aren't on the deeds for, or it's unreasonable. There can't be having it both ways where a woman shouldn't pay towards a man's house but a man has to pay towards a woman's house.

I don’t think you’re a mug op, it’s a bizarre situation that started before you were together, what your DP needs to do is make a decision on what is important to him.