Vaccine fairness

[MozzchopsThirty]

AIBU to think we should be vaccinating all those of working age, BAME communities, younger vulnerable and healthcare workers first? Not in order of age

not care homes, halls of residence.

It does transmit fast among care homes too, but they are first in the queue!

I have just been in hospital with this, it is absolutely terrifying to be be fighting for your next breath. I am out of hospital, still struggling, but nowhere near as bad as I was. In hospital, I gave most of the other patients 20 years as I am fairly young.
As I got slightly better i could hear patients in the other rooms fighting for their breath, some of them on cpap. It was so disturbing to hear people who were where i was, but not getting any better. You absolutely need to vaccinate the old first, or you should go and stand in one of these wards and hear them fight for their breath. It is a vile and frightening disease that needs the old need to be protected from it.

@cologne4711

Students mostly don’t have serious symptoms anyway, so what would be the point in prioritising them

Because it transmits fast among care homes, adds (a lot) to the statistics for a particular location and can result in tier-related lockdowns. Stop students getting it (and prisoners) and you reduce the raw numbers.

There aren't high numbers in student areas any more. In many parts of the country cases are lower than in the general population now . The rise was quite transient and may not happen again with better testing. Considering that they are low risk and don't mix much with the local population, there is no reason to prioritise them.

@cologne4711

Students mostly don’t have serious symptoms anyway, so what would be the point in prioritising them

Because it transmits fast among care homes, adds (a lot) to the statistics for a particular location and can result in tier-related lockdowns. Stop students getting it (and prisoners) and you reduce the raw numbers.

Yes I was agreeing with you. If it was proven that the vaccine stopped transmission, I would entirely agree with prioritising students. But that isn't currently the case, is it?

Yes I was agreeing with you. If it was proven that the vaccine stopped transmission, I would entirely agree with prioritising students. But that isn't currently the case, is it?

There is also no evidence that students are more likely to increase transmission in the wider population.

They’re vaccinating frontline health workers so we don’t spread it to vulnerable patients.

I'm glad you're not making the decision. So will all those apparently dispensable vulnerable elderly, presumably.

Thanks very much to those who linked the JCVI document. It answers pretty much every question on this thread, especially the BAME considerations. Obviously not everything is known yet so they will probably have to think again further down the line. But I wish people asking the same question over and over again would just RTFD. It's all in there, and not at such length nor in such technical language that it's hard to make sense of.

@HikeForward

They’re vaccinating frontline health workers so we don’t spread it to vulnerable patients.

We don’t yet know if the vaccine reduced transmission.

It seems fair to me to vaccinate those of us most likely to die in order of that likeliness. I didn’t leave my house for five fucking months, I rarely leave it now. I’m still happy to wait my turn for those more vulnerable than me (I’m cev)

Only time will tell if it works.

The simpler it is the more people will actually take it. Stick loads of criteria in and people will get confused and not get it. And if you say yes to one group then there will be pressure for the next.

From what I’ve read I’d rather having the Oxford vaccine not sure if that makes me terribly ungrateful. I’m not particularly vulnerable but I’m still breastfeeding. Not sure how that will work and when it will be available though.

@Anothermother3

From what I’ve read I’d rather having the Oxford vaccine not sure if that makes me terribly ungrateful. I’m not particularly vulnerable but I’m still breastfeeding. Not sure how that will work and when it will be available though.

If you’re young enough to be breastfeeding, your vaccination is a long way down the line. Are they even bothering with healthy under 50s?

Some very disgusting and disturbing thoughts have been expressed on this thread.

The "list" of the groups who will receive the vaccine first have been well thought out by experts who will have looked at every minutiae of how this will impact on the NHS.

People like the OP and some others on here have shown their true colours and how they value human life.

Long live for as long as they can all the Mildred's and Bert's. Human life is sacred at any age.

The "list" of the groups who will receive the vaccine first have been well thought out by experts who will have looked at every minutiae of how this will impact on the NHS.

Considering that they keep changing their minds every half hour I'm not sure how well thought out it all is. I wonder how much the lists are influenced by political pressure. Apparently even NHS workers aren't a priority now so I'm not sure how much the impact on the NHS is influencing the list. Certainly, many care home residents wouldn't have gone into hospital with Covid anyway. I can't get my head around the idea that a 90 year old with dementia will have priority over a 20 year old on the clinically extremely vulnerable list.

@Redcherries

It seems fair to me to vaccinate those of us most likely to die in order of that likeliness. I didn’t leave my house for five fucking months, I rarely leave it now. I’m still happy to wait my turn for those more vulnerable than me (I’m cev)

That's fine you but some clinically vulnerable people have to go to school or work or they live with people who work or go to school.

I don't see teachers on this list....I would very much like the staff in my son's school to have the option. They must be elevated risk surely??

@BatleyTownswomensGuild

I don't see teachers on this list....I would very much like the staff in my son's school to have the option. They must be elevated risk surely??

They might be at elevated risk of catching it but whether or not they are a priority would depend on how vulnerable they are or how vulnerable the children they look after are.

As far as I know this vaccine is one which prevents serious illness following infection, but they didn't look at whether it prevents or reduces transmission. Therefore it is correct that it is given to people who are at most risk of getting seriously ill - like care home residents who have not seen their families for most of this year. And other cev patients who have also been locked up most of this year.

No one should die the horrible death that Covid causes. No one of any age. It's disgusting that people on here can judge the worthiness of someone's life and right to life by how useful they are perceived to be to society.

We want NHS staff to get a vaccine that will protect their patients from them transmitting the virus. Therefore it's better that they wait until one of the other vaccines are approved.

Of course there are concerns over the storage, splitting of the packs and the logistics of delivering the Pfizer vaccine to care homes.

We don’t yet know if the vaccine reduced transmission

Surely if frontline NHS are vaccinated, they cannot catch it and accidentally give it to patients? Eg they can’t be asymptomatic carriers if vaccinated?

My cousin works with chemo patients in Manchester and she’s getting vaccinated next week.

As far as I know this vaccine is one which prevents serious illness following infection, but they didn't look at whether it prevents or reduces transmission. Therefore it is correct that it is given to people who are at most risk of getting seriously ill - like care home residents who have not seen their families for most of this year. And other cev patients who have also been locked up most of this year.

It has been shown to reduce the number of cases not just the severity of infection. If people are not infected they will not transmit the virus.

It is terrible that care home residents have not seen their family for a year but that is because priority was given to keeping them alive at all costs rather than considering their quality of life. I'm sure that many residents would have rather have taken the risk of Covid so they could see their family but it seems they were not given the choice.

@Belladonna12 You know that CEV are all at work if they have jobs too? And their risk is higher than clinically vulnerable? You think the CV should be vaccinated over the CEV who are also at work, many are frontline, teachers etc and have been told they will almost certainly die if not have huge implications. There is no shielding in place at this time.

[quote Redcherries]@Belladonna12 You know that CEV are all at work if they have jobs too? And their risk is higher than clinically vulnerable? You think the CV should be vaccinated over the CEV who are also at work, many are frontline, teachers etc and have been told they will almost certainly die if not have huge implications. There is no shielding in place at this time.[/quote]
What are you talking about? I wasn't suggesting that the extremely clinically vulnerable don't work. Why would you assume that when I said clinically vulnerable I was excluding those who have been designated extremely vulnerable?