To ask if you feel you morally deserve your wealth

[Nc1028]

No judgment, genuinely interested (and bored!)

Read about the idea that people want to have money but also want to believe that they morally deserve the money. For example, those who earned their wealth are more likely to believe they deserve it because of hard work, whereas those who inherited wealth are more likely to feel guilty. Stay-at-home partners also tended to feel guilty if their partners are high earners/have inherited wealth when they haven’t earned/inherited wealth themselves. Everyone try to emphasise on their productiveness, not wanting to be cast as “rich and lazy”.

Wondering what people think?
If you have money, do you think you deserve what you have?
Do you think people who have a lot more money deserve what they have?

(Light hearted. Yes your money is none of anyone’s business but money is such a taboo topic, fun to talk about)

@formerbabe I'm not saying you should feel guilty nonetheless inheritance does perpetuate inequality.

I grew up very working class, at a rough secondary school but worked harder, and attended more lessons than most of the kids in my school. I was one of only 3 kids out of the 270 in my year who went to uni and actually graduated. I now have a decent job with a good salary (e.g. I could just about afford private education for my own kids if I wanted to). Yes I think I deserve it.

It's not a case of morally deserving or not in my opinion.
Some people work hard in important jobs and would never earn in their life what someone who's inherited millions earns in a month not touching their investments.

But equally, I empathise with people who do say they worked hard for what they have and wouldn't take it as a slight on anyone who doesn't have it.

Eg. I'd say I've worked hard for what I have and what I have is a combination of hard work, decisions that paid off and focusing on long term.goals. I prioritised having a house over extensive travel and living a more carefree 20s. Some of my friends chose travel and wanted to live in nice rented flats in expensive cities. We just made different choices.

[quote boomshakey]@formerbabe I'm not saying you should feel guilty nonetheless inheritance does perpetuate inequality. [/quote]
Only at the very upper end really.

The the with inheritance tax is it's all very well when your parents die and you're established and well into your adult years with your own home. Anything you're left is a nice bonus.
However, my sibling and I were just out of our teens and totally screwed over by it.

I dont know about 'morally'deserve. But DH and I have made some sacrifices that we didn't much want to make in order to earn more. It's been a slog but we got where we wanted to be financially. I've worked hard, but I also had a supportive parent who encouraged and supported me to go to uni, which in turn has allowed me graduate opportunities. A mixture of luck, opportunities and hard work rather than morally deserving.

*the thing

No I don't deserve it. Yes, I am part of an immoral system.

I own my own business providing a white-collar service that I get paid quite well for, working from home. I work a lot of evenings and weekends. I put a lot of time and effort into my business and I'm proud of it. I get paid quite well. Nothing obscene, but very very comfortable.

From my home-office window I can see the mothers collecting cans from the dumpsters and rubbish bins on their way to drop their kids off at school (they sell them to recycling companies for a few "pennies"). Do you think I work harder than them? Am I more deserving than them?

It's sick.

Money is power. Morals are absent in the quest to achieve more of either.

Not wealthy by wealthy standards. Inherited life changing amount. Only feeling I have about that is I’d give back every penny to have my parents back. Miss them a lot every day.
As for other stuff like pension housing etc main feeling is anger at inequality of opportunity and reality and the widening gap between haves and have nots in U.K. Depressing. We used to be so much better as a nation no matter what your politics.

Morally? No, of course not. The same way I didn't deserve to be born in a first world country or in a time where women have the rights we do. It's pure chance and gives me an unimaginable leg up over others.

Sure you can make sacrifices etc but a lot of the time we are benefiting from privileges that were in no way earned.

Only at the very upper end really.

Not really, a 20 yr old who could get on the ladder in the 90s with a 20k inheritance will likely have done better than someone receiving 200k now.

It's like all tax though, most people think other people should pay more.

@boomshakey

Only at the very upper end really.

Not really, a 20 yr old who could get on the ladder in the 90s with a 20k inheritance will likely have done better than someone receiving 200k now.

It's like all tax though, most people think other people should pay more.

But they have paid plenty of tax on it over their lifetime.

I don’t think anyone ‘deserves’ anything - the question doesn’t make sense to me.
I studied hard & worked hard and I have managed to make a decent living... I may have earned this, but I don’t feel it was ‘owed’ to me on any moral level.
Perhaps that’s why we I am not a jealous person. I don’t begrudge friends their wealth or status - it’s a mix of hard work & opportunity.

Similarly I don’t feel I deserved the misfortunes I’ve experienced. I don’t think there’s some spiritual force punishing or rewarding me on a daily basis.

I'm not wealthy, but thanks to secure employment, some inheritance, and the sharp rise in property values in London, have enough money to live comfortably with DP (who has a lot more money than I do). I have been very lucky, and no more "deserve" it than anyone "deserves" to be poor. I don't feel guilty, though.

@boomshakey

Only at the very upper end really.

Not really, a 20 yr old who could get on the ladder in the 90s with a 20k inheritance will likely have done better than someone receiving 200k now.

It's like all tax though, most people think other people should pay more.

Well I think if the only taxable wealth is a single family home that others are still living in, then inheritance tax is morally wrong...but we're digressing from the thread somewhat!

I feel very lucky and grateful. To some extent I suppose I do feel it's "deserved" because my parents were immigrants who started out without a single penny or knowing the language. My childhood memories were happy but always with a feeling of not-quite-belonging. My parents encountered a lot of racism and never really managed to make friends outside of our (asian) community. They carried this feeling of anxiety and fear of being judged their entire lives despite their income and social status steadily rising.

As a child/teen I was quite insecure and saw money as a form of acceptance. Even though this was before the days of social media, it was clear that being rich is way of gaining respect in society. Wealth is more than just the (arguably) deserved fruits of hard work but a ticket to a different way of existing. People are suddenly nicer, everything gets easier and the edges of racism or sexism are greatly softened. Instead of feeling rejected or judged by society, you are suddenly welcome everywhere and strangers know your name before you even show up.

From an early age I dreamed of being rich, not just to have nice things, but to have a happy, solid place in life without the constant feeling of being sidelined or rejected. Many people might argue you can have this regardless of your income but it's really not the same thing for people who were born & grew up in their native country with generations of family and friends all around.

Long story short, my parents worked hard, lived modestly and spent all their savings on property. I was given a small flat which was a huge privilege. I met DH when we were both students and later started my own business that took off. This helped pay for our wedding and second home (first being the one gifted from my parents). DH's career needs a long build-up time but after 10 years together his earnings have started taking off. I cut down on work to be a SAHM to our DD until she goes to nursery. We have a very comfortable life and it's everything I dreamed about as a child. I'm grateful that money has given my parents a family and stability in a country that never really welcomed them.

dailycandy I feel exactly the same. Have never felt jealous of anything or anyone in my life.

@formerbabe I'm not sure how I feel about it tbh & yes you don't want children without a roof but I know it definitely perpetuates inequality. As you say we are digressing, I only mentioned it as so many posters said they have received it which I think rather proves my point.

@MrsMiaWallis

But they have paid plenty of tax on it over their lifetime.

Paid tax on what?
My DHs family home is "worth" more than 2m, it cost 40k in the 80s.

Pensions are another way of reducing tax liabilities.

No, I think I've been lucky. Didn't inherit anything but worked and saved hard for it but plenty of people work their arses off for a lot less.
DH was somewhat horrified that I voted Labour at the last election given what Corbin was promising for higher rate tax payers and the impact on us. Figured we might not have a holiday but we certainly would still be able to pay for essentials.
I'd rather give my money to Corbyn than bloody Boris though Rishi Sunak has been a pleasant surprise. The school lunches thing though - wtf??

No. I don’t morally deserve any of the money I have. My parents worked incredibly hard to earn, but even they had the advantages of good education and luck.

I am very lucky and try to remember that. I do feel guilty sometimes. The only thing for me was that my parents were often working so less family time.

I am employed but my situation has meant that I have not had to take jobs when I was ill and jobs that take into account my disability. Maybe I delude myself that some of it is balanced that I also did not morally deserve my disability. My practical experience with disability is much better due to the luck of having money. I still hate being financially/emotionally/physically dependent on others. All I can do is donate to charities and try to do good for other people with money as well as myself.

It's best not to dwell on questions of "deserved" versus "undeserved" wealth, though we all do anyway.

It makes little sense, if you think deeply enough about it. Even people who are entirely self-made, achieved what they achieved though endowments of various aptitudes and characteristics that are likely inherited or genetically predisposed. Temperament, character and attitude have genetic and environmental components. Intelligence is hugely heritable. Looks are largely genetic.

I think of all this, and I don't quite feel so ready to claim that everything I have done / achieved is mine and mine alone. I simply think I was lucky to be born reasonably well adapted in temperament and abilities to the demands of the time.

People can think what they want about what they've got, but I know that when I meet someone who doesn't have any sense of luck / gratitude about whatever natural endowments they started off with, I tend not to like them!

I often think people who begrudge people that get top up benefits, feel they don’t work hard enough and therefore should go and get a better job.....

That boils my pi&s. Whether you work in a corner shop or an investment bank, you both work full time, both spend time away from family/children, both didn’t get as much free time as you like...

If you work, you work. It doesn’t matter what job, imo they are all equal in terms of how hard someone works.

So anyone that works is deserving in my opinion.

Interesting question OP. This is perhaps straying away from your original question but I feel I deserve certain aspects of my success / wealth, and only relative to other people rather than to society at large.

For example I did well at school and went to university. I recognise that as MC privilege and luck. But I studied law even though I didn't really want to (I wanted to do languages) and even though I knew it would be harder and a lot more work. It was. I did it solely because I and my parents thought it would give me better (i.e. more lucrative) job opportunities, which it did. I do have friends who followed their hearts and passions and then struggled to get onto a graduate scheme and have had to retrain / requalify which has set them back quite a few years. I certainly don't feel I deserve my professional success more than Joe Bloggs in the street, but I do (quietly and privately) feel I deserve it more than my best friend from school as my dull, sensible choices paid off.

Similarly we bought properties in greater london when we were young, with short term loans (repaid in full) from my parents for the deposits. That again is sheer privilege and I accept that. But we bought in extremely gritty areas that wouldn't even be described as up and coming by the most optimistic Estate Agent! Our friends teased and pooh-poohed the area, insisted they wouldn't live there in a month of Sundays and were happier renting lovely houses in Clapham / Fulham / Islington. But our shitty properties transpired to be very sound investments and have enabled us lots of financial freedom and the ability to take risks and opportunities and have probably accelerated our financial position by 10 - 15 years. Again I don't think I deserve that unearned wealth compared to other millenials in general, but I sort of do feel I 'deserve' it compared to some of my friends who could have had similar opportunities but didn't want to compromise on living in a nice area.