Anybody else DISGUSTED at the anti lockdown protestors!?

[Duemarch2021]

It makes me so angry that people are protesting about lockdown... yes its frustrating but it's being done for a reason... to try and prevent as many deaths as there would be without a lockdown... they are selfishly spreading covid and yhe police have to put themselves out there and risk their lifes to stop the gatherings! 😠 What do they think will happen!? That government will say ok- ok you win... go wild, have fun and mingle lets just forget covid now!?.....Does this make anybody else absolutely fuming at the human race!!!?

Good for them!!! This control is ridiculous - let's now access our own risk and get on with life!!

You mean the racist statues of slave traders and the like @epcot15? Damn right they should have been ripped down, it was long overdue!

Just like the end of the government covid shit show is long overdue.

@SunflowerButterfly

YABU, I'm absolutely delighted they protested and only wish more people would. Society is slowly turning into a horrible, totalitarian dystopia all for a virus with a 99.8% survival rate, based on dodgy data. It's complete madness. I can't believe it's taken people this long to start questioning it, and still so many think it's all totally fine. Thank goodness these people are standing up for our rights.

fullfact.org/online/coronavirus-vaccine-safety-death-rate/?utm_source=content_page&utm_medium=related_content

They do have a right to protest. What I don't understand though is people arguing we should just get on with it. Having spoken directly to people who work in hospitals - they've told me don't have a car accident just now. So the hospitals are at capacity. If we all just say forget the virus then more will be ill so regardless of why you need medical help - it won't be there.

I support their right to protest

But what is their agenda. End restrictions completely (we only need to look to Sweden to see how that hasn’t worked) that we have all been lied to (covid is a conspiracy) fear that we are becoming a police state

Problem is for the protesters there isn’t a clear message they are trying to get over and within this you have a large number of those that support the ridiculously stupid conspiracy theories and those whose fear of state control most people don’t relate to these fears (they accept restrictions are necessary at this point in time)

I think you need to think of it in a more nuanced way.
I won’t be protesting because lockdown is the only way we have of tackling the virus at present.
BUT I do understand that the protesters aren’t just protesting against this lockdown at the moment. They’re fighting for our right to freedom. It is a little alarming how dictatorial our government have become in the past year. Quite a disturbing trajectory.

I’d have agreed with you until the government released the completely unfair tiers this week. I’ve never protested in my life, but I’d be tempted to join in now!

"When tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty"

This thread demonstrates that stupidity seems to be spreading as much as the virus.

Hissy fits in the capital risk the health of those who have to deal with their idiocy.

@Biker47

"When tyranny becomes law, rebellion becomes duty"

This

The 'protestors' are either very selfish or hard of thinking. Lockdown works to suppress case numbers & viral spread. The UK has some of the worst numbers in Europe for Covid deaths & overall case numbers - and just because you survive Covid doesn't mean you won't be left with severe heath issues. As others have said, what do these people actually want? We can't just remove restrictions as that obviously will result in a huge number of deaths- look at the USA!
And anyone mentioning suicide rates please post a link to some 2020 stats (not anecdotes) as I've searched online & can't find anything for 2020 yet- the 2019 stats only came out recently.

[quote hopsalong]@MercyBooth talks a lot of sense. As far as the wider ethical argument goes, that's the part that keeps puzzling me. So you lose you job, your kids don't go to school for six months, they forget a lot of things. Your five year old is back in nappies (two children in my son's year one class!). You can't afford to move out of the two-bed flat you're in any more. You don't have a holiday. You don't see your parents. Etc. Maybe you can do this on behalf of people you've never met and fundamentally have nothing in common with. But it's a short-lived altruism. When people talk about WWII it seems the least reasonable comparison imaginable to me. No one, from the Royal Family down, was indifferent to being invaded by Nazi Germans. But lots of people are personally and privately indifferent to Covid. I've had it. So have many of my friends and students. My parents are dead. I'm the oldest person in my family, and I'm 41. I don't actually know a single person who was advised to shield and the oldest people I know are two colleagues (one has also had it and is fine) in their early 60s. I definitely don't want to live in a society where people are being piled into unmarked graves, but there are societies that I would consider more evil; they would include any regime where free speech and the right to protest was removed.

So you do all of those things. Then you have a dodgy mole, a lump in your breast, whatever. And there's no appointment. This is why my mother died of cancer in the summer -- diagnosed far too late, no one willing to see her in person, no operations unless they could be pretty sure of effecting a complete cure. There's a point at which people simply don't care enough, ie they don't care MORE about other people than themselves.

The part the puzzles me is the idea that our capacity for self-sacrifice on behalf of strangers should be infinite. We're not Jesus.[/quote]
Very articulate; I couldn't agree more.

[quote hopsalong]@MercyBooth talks a lot of sense. As far as the wider ethical argument goes, that's the part that keeps puzzling me. So you lose you job, your kids don't go to school for six months, they forget a lot of things. Your five year old is back in nappies (two children in my son's year one class!). You can't afford to move out of the two-bed flat you're in any more. You don't have a holiday. You don't see your parents. Etc. Maybe you can do this on behalf of people you've never met and fundamentally have nothing in common with. But it's a short-lived altruism. When people talk about WWII it seems the least reasonable comparison imaginable to me. No one, from the Royal Family down, was indifferent to being invaded by Nazi Germans. But lots of people are personally and privately indifferent to Covid. I've had it. So have many of my friends and students. My parents are dead. I'm the oldest person in my family, and I'm 41. I don't actually know a single person who was advised to shield and the oldest people I know are two colleagues (one has also had it and is fine) in their early 60s. I definitely don't want to live in a society where people are being piled into unmarked graves, but there are societies that I would consider more evil; they would include any regime where free speech and the right to protest was removed.

So you do all of those things. Then you have a dodgy mole, a lump in your breast, whatever. And there's no appointment. This is why my mother died of cancer in the summer -- diagnosed far too late, no one willing to see her in person, no operations unless they could be pretty sure of effecting a complete cure. There's a point at which people simply don't care enough, ie they don't care MORE about other people than themselves.

The part the puzzles me is the idea that our capacity for self-sacrifice on behalf of strangers should be infinite. We're not Jesus.[/quote]
I'm sorry about your mum. I'm terrified for both my parents, not just because of covid but because of this.

I agree with the OP. Protests are legitimate when they are about a political situation, but the virus transcends politics.
What exactly do the protesters want? For the government to say, ok then, mix as much as you like?
What will the same protesters think when they catch the virus as a result of their own stupidity, and there isn't a hospital bed for them?

Good for them for protesting about this ludicrous hysterical overreaction from the useless government. We're seeing that the cure is far, far worse than the disease. They should be applauded, not denounced in any way.

The right to protest exists independently of your / my opinion about the protestors' cause though. And I don't think ANYTHING transcends politics - our approach to Covid is a legitimate object of debate, just as our approach to climate change or social deprivation or general care for the elderly is (I'd argue that all three of this issues are much bigger deals longterm than Covid, but there you go). Of course different sections of society will want different things prioritised and MPs will squabble over it. Thats just how democracy works and its happening right now re Covid in every democratic country in the world. It might be deeply frustrating and imperfect but the alternative - the idea that normal democracy should just shut down every time a majority of the population decide there is an 'emergency' is really terrifying

@multivac

You know what - if there were a 1% chance of me winning the National Lottery, I'd be buying a ticket every fucking week.

Difference is - there no negatives to your life either way, aside from not winning

They're not protesting against the virus. They're protesting against the restrictions. I don't agree with their demands for lockdown to be lifted, but it's disingenuous to claim that they're protesting the virus.
But the restrictions are in place because of the virus. Not disingenuous at all.

People that are not happy with allowing others the freedom of speech regardless if you agree with them or not.
.
We’ll, you can’t argue with stupid.

@yawnsvillex
Indeed - people have a right to peaceful protest we have seen with all sorts of woke causes which do get reported.

First post but what a way to start!

It's natural to think that people are just being selfish but don't think this is necessarily the case. Unfortunately the gov are doing a great job of messing this up and lockdowns are a desperate way of covering up the fact that they're incapable of managing this in any way, shape or form.

Lockdowns don't work. I appreciate the first one may have been necessary as no-one knew what we were up against. However there's much more data now and even the World Health Organisation advocates AGAINST lockdowns.

You can tell it's out of control when counties/regions were previously tier 1, have been forced into lockdown and will be coming out of lockdown on higher tiers than they started on; despite seeing no more cases/deaths.

You can tell it's out of control when local shops have been forced to close, yet the main supermarkets are allowed to sell the same products. Management of shoppers in supermarkets has been non-existent. Yet many local shops have enforced strict customer numbers and done excellent jobs of isolating people. These small businesses are the tax payers that will help the economy get back on its feet. Yet Amazon is booming and will pay zero tax to bring the UK back to normal. I appreciate some large companies will suffer but no way as much as all the small businesses and individuals that genuinely pay their fair share of tax.

The gov are scaring us to believe lockdowns are the only way but this is just distracting us from their failings. They want us to debate and shame people into feeling irresponsible (through division) as this shifts the focus from them. The WHO are advising all governments to avoid lockdowns and to use smarter methods so we can stop the poor getting poorer and our economy disintegrating. I can guarantee that women will bear the brunt of further poverty and we shouldn't allow this to happen.

The YouTube video below is long but the salient points are from 25 minutes and 30. I don't blame anyone for believing lockdowns are the only solution but they're really not.

Lockdown works to suppress case numbers & viral spread. The UK has some of the worst numbers in Europe for Covid deaths & overall case numbers..........We can't just remove restrictions as that obviously will result in a huge number of deaths- look at the USA

Yet despite two lockdowns, ever tighter restrictions, we have not controlled CV, have a death rate to match the USA, ruined large sections of the economy, overwhelmed the NHS - twice! & wrecked the education of our children.
Let alone the extra deaths as a side effect of lockdowns.

AND we are now going to relax restrictions over Christmas which will cause a spike of infections and deaths in January!

Either restrictions work for our overall benefit or the government has totally fcuked up the handling of this pandemic.

People have the right to protest or we become China/Russia.

YABU. They have a right to protest. I don't agree with all they say (Covid hoax, 5G masts etc) but do agree that lockdowns just kick the can down the road. And I am extremely worried about the erosion of our civil rights.

I was up in London for the weekend yesterday and went to Oxford Circus for a "quiet" look at the Christmas lights - only to be confronted by numerous riot vans and police when I got out from the tube! Way too heavy handed IMO.

@Tolleshunt

The govt have had 9 months to increase capacity of the NHS to cope with the increase. Instead of doing this, they’ve chosen to spend stupid amounts of money paying businesses not to open and people not to work and put the population under house arrest. I’ll be joining them and lobbing my MP to vote against this latest round of insanity

Yes, why have we not increased capacity in the NHS in that time?

Because you can't train doctors and nurses overnight, perhaps?

I don't really understand the protests. If we come out of lockdown, the nhs becomes overwhelmed and we are back to the trauma of March (already a reality in some areas). I do understand that people's lives have been devastated by the lockdown. So I could understand a (socially distanced and mask wearing) protest for more money for people who are struggling. Some companies, such as Amazon, have made a shocking amount of profit from this lockdown. I'd be eyeing profit such as this to be funding people who are desperately struggling.

I'm no fan of the government but it must be so difficult to be trying to balance the risk of virus deaths with the risks of an economic crash. I do think many of their decisions led to spiralling death rates though, and the spread of the virus getting out of control at the start of the year.

One thing I find strange is that the argument that this virus "only" kills 1% of people, as if they're all expendable. The problem is that if most people get it, 1% is such a huge number. I also see people saying things like "as many people died of flu last year and we didn't wear masks then." (Don't think it's been said on this thread). A quick Google shows that this statement about numbers is complete nonsense.

I agree with the OP, in that I don't get what protesters fighting against lockdown want as an outcome. What do they think will happen if we stop the lockdown? That the virus magically disappears and we all get back to normal. Isn't it a given that this isn't going to happen? Or am I reading different science research/ news?