To not be able to forgive myself for the way I treated my babies?

[Notmyusual80]

They're 11 and 7 now but when I think back to how I was when they were babies, I absolutely despise myself. Having young babies turned me into someone I didn't recognise- so angry, a control freak, completely and utterly obsessed with sleep.

To be clear, I never did and never would hurt them. But my god I used to shout a lot. And lose my temper. When they were tiny. My first was an absolute angel of a baby, so easy. But I didn't know that at the time as I had nothing to compare her to. I had a really hard few months getting her into a sleep routine and I'd lose my rag if she wouldn't go to sleep/ had unexpected night wakings. I was so obsessed with the knock on effect it would have if sleep didn't go just right. The poor little thing was and still is such a good girl.

I thought I'd be better with my 2nd but he was more hard work than my DD and I think that made things worse because I thought I'd know it all the 2nd time around and it would be easy. I frequently lost my temper with him. What an awful thing to admit. And I'd snap at my sweet DD who was a toddler as I was wound up. One time, the baby had been unwell with tonsillitis but was almost fully over it. He kept waking one night but rather than thinking he might still be feeling poorly and therefore being sympathetic, I got cross with him and was swearing and huffing. It was almost like I felt he was doing it on purpose?!!! My mum reminded me of it the other day and said she wanted to shake me at the time. Another time, I'd had a few really bad nights and the baby woke in the night and when i went to settle him, i realised he'd pooed and I said something like "great, you've pooed,course you have you dirty little xxxxxxx". My DH had a real go at me and rightly so - I apologised straight away. I feel so awful and ashamed admitting to all this.

I clearly remember when my second was a baby feeling really angry a lot of the time, where my whole body would be clenched and I'd be almost shaking. What the hell was wrong with me? I must say, I wasn't like this all the time - just when sleep was going badly and I was feeling anxious about it. I completely love and adore my children and I did and do show them a lot of love.

The thing is, there was so much about the baby years I absolutely loved - playing with them, taking them to baby groups, watching them interact with other babies and toys, just feeling like I had these little sidekicks with me. I'd give anything to go back and be the mum I should have been. It completely haunts me and I pray they don't remember any of it.

I spoke to a friend the other day who has just had her second (3 weeks ago) and she just sounded so thrilled and kept saying she can't believe how happy she feels. She was expecting it to be awful because her 1st was really hard work but this baby is really easy and she just feels so happy. I voucher cried remembering what a snappy, stressed, nasty cow I was at that stage with my two.

I'm scared to post this as I expect a lot of people will think I sound like an absolute monster. But i just need to know if anyone has had a similar experience at all and if so, how they've learned to live with it?

You should like a regular mum who’s candid enough to admit it’s bloody hard
The best way is to move forward,you acknowledge but don’t dwell on past
You recall what’s went well, those times. Don’t aim to fix the past,it’s done
You don’t need to be perfect, just be good enough

I’ve not read through but you might want to google PND and anger. I had PND and one of my symptoms was just rage. Rage and anger like I had never felt before. There were other symptoms too obviously, but when I got better, it disappeared. Others have experienced the same. Is it possible you were experiencing undiagnosed PND?

Durrr auto correct You sound like a regular mum who’s candid enough to admit it’s bloody hard

Of course it's not OK - the OP knows this only too well - that is the crux of her problem. But she cannot turn the clock back and what she has done since that early difficult time and what she does in the future are what matter NOW. She needs to forgive herself and move forward. Parents are not perfect. She can create happy memories for them right now.

There is such pressure now for people to be perfect parents - no-one can be that, nor should they be asked to. Life is full of imperfections of all sorts and we either knuckle down and accept that or our lives, and those of our children, will be miserable.

@audweb I really do wonder about that now. I think anyone else who is reading this and feels the same - talk to someone, please. I just assumed it was just the way I was and I was just a nasty person deep down and didn't know it. I probably would've been to afraid to admit my behaviour to a health professional. But maybe it would've helped me.

I don’t think you’re nasty at all. But I am concerned at how many people are wanting to say child abuse is normal.

@pennypinchh, take your I'll informed nonsense and question marks and fuck off. nobody let alone OP is interested in what you have to say.

OP, the fact you care about this shows you're not a monster. It sounds very much as if you were struggling with PND. Please don't compare yourself to other people. Lots and lots of people have been through this but are scared to talk about (in part due to clowns like the above sticking their two pence in) but you are far from alone. I'm not condoning your behaviour but neither are you. give yourself a break.

I think most people did this.

I think it’s normal

Have you heard of ‘Go the fuck to sleep?’

My ds was an angel baby. I lost it with him once or twice. He’s 26 now. Still an angel adult. Good tempered, calm, kind, loving. He survived.

Dd was much harder, but l had much more support. So she didn’t get it in the neck as much. She’s still hard work 14 years later😖

I get the guilt, l think back and cringe. But life is about survival. And they will be fine

Let it go OP, regret eats you up inside and ruins your life and we are all just human. There were times when I was tired from work and just not in the mood for a non sleeping child, the noise and the whining and just let rip.
I used to hear my next door neighbour who is the sweetest person shouting "For fucks sake go to sleep will you" and looking completely dishevelled the next day, her daughters grew up just fine.
In the 60's our mothers used to regularly put us at the end of the garden in our prams with nets over and just leave us there to shriek - it was their way of coping. Everyone did it. The excuse was the fresh air would help us sleep but that was just an excuse.
Let it go.

@MsTSwift

Sorry I disagree about the supposed “sexism” in responses. It is hugely more likely to be the woman that takes the no sleep hit and has had all the physical and mental changes of having a baby. So in this circumstance I would judge the behaviour differently and be more understanding to the mother losing it than the father.

Me too. DH once lost it with DS and shouted at him when he was about eight months old and had been crying because he needed a nap but not going to sleep whatever DH did for about two hours. I know because DH burst into tears and told me what an awful thing he'd done as soon as I got home. The thing is, at that point I was back at work (we did shared parental leave) and DH was doing most of the nights and obviously all day. I got it, I told him it wasn't good but it didn't make him a terrible father either, I reminded him of all the ways he showed DS how much he loved him every day. But I'd have felt very differently if it had been in the first six months, when I did almost all night waking (because I did all feeding) and all care during the day - I'd have had a lot less sympathy then. It's not a man/woman thing it's a primary carer thing - it's a lot more understandable to have a temporary blip if you're doing almost all the care and doing it well nearly all the time, it's less so if you don't do that much. Realistically, the vast majority of men aren't primary carers.

Because of the confusing way that you’ve posed the question, the poll results are skewed in the opposite direction - so disregard them - everyone knows it’s really really hard when they’re first born.

Learn not to be so hard on yourself.

@fuckingterriblemum what a brave, honest and heartbreaking post. I hereby rename you @fuckingawesomemum. PND strips you of the ability to be yourself. So how can you blame yourself when you are not yourself? To you and to OP I hope you can forgive yourselves. Your children sure as hell will and I would put money on them thinking you are the best mums in the world.

Firstly, I think you'd really benefit from some talking therapy to help you with the feelings you're getting. Secondly, it sounds like apart from the sleeping issues you were a loving and playful mum, which honestly would have outweighed any shouting at bedtime. I'm sure if you look at your children now they are happy and unaffected by the frustration you felt?

You sound like a normal mum struggling to me!

I've had my fair share of shameful moments with DD and she's only 1. The other day whilst still recovering from Covid, with no energy, a clingy toddler who kept on whining all day, I fully lost it and screamed at her to shut up. She looked so shocked that I immediately felt awful, apologised and gave her a hug.

We're only human and I think it matters more what you do after those moments where you mess up.

I don’t think you’re nasty at all. But I am concerned at how many people are wanting to say child abuse is normal.

That's because most people who are ridden with guilt can't think objectively. In reality, the OP probably lost her rag a few times and snapped when she was burnt out! That's not child abuse!

Oh god, didn't mean to add a poll to it! @WootMoggie

Totally agree with @SummerHouse re @Fuckingterriblemum

Sounds like untreated PND to me. It often presents as explosive anger.

Please don't be hard on yourself
Nobody can prepare you for how much your life changes. Sleep deprivation is awful and motherhood can feel very lonely. When my oldest were babies i became a regimented control freak and constantly tense and annoyed and i think when you feel you've done everything right and they are still screaming and you are so tired routines can almost become obsessive. I remember locking myself in the bathroom crying to try to drown out the noise and get away.
My youngest is alot younger and i wasn't as bad with her and quite alot older but we are all human beings and we all make mistakes and as long as we are always learning then i wouldn't beat yourself up. My adult children have turned out fine and they know I'm very dedicated to them.
Im sorry but anybody who says they haven't lost patience or made wrong decisions are down right liars. Id rather be like you and i and admit to our faults! Xx

When sleep deprived,and or stressed reflection is impaired and one becomes overly self critical . Your subjective interpretation becomes harsh and a skewed

I don't think they will remember the anger, just the love. You didn't physically hurt them.
Please don't be so hard on yourself - you were probably very depressed.

@HazelWong

There's a time and place for "no one's perfect" - that, for me, is for when someone is all "I put my kids in front of the TV on a rainy day rather than doing improving crafting" not for when someone is shouting and swearing at a tiny baby.

It's not that I don't have some sympathy - but I do also think that what happened is being minimised by some posters.

Because it is minimal.

I'm going to against some people here, and say no it's not really normal to be that full of rage that you're angry with a baby for having a poo or being poorly. But I say this from a (hopefully) kind and understanding place. I felt the same as this with my first, and I'm pretty sure I had undiagnosed PND/postpartum anxiety. My husband worked away sun-Friday and I felt so isolated. I'd feel bursts of rage when my little boy woke in the night; I'd dread going to sleep as I was so scared he would be poorly and I'd have nobody to ring for help. It took me a couple of years to even talk about having another baby without crying
I've been like a different person with my second, but I do sometimes struggle if there's too much noise/shouting/crying and have to remove myself for a minute or I can feel it bubbling up. Please be nice to yourself, but also recognise that other things may have been at play

My mother I think felt overwhelmed a lot and could be explosive at times. Her own mother was the same. My mother had a lot of grief to manage too as she lost a child.

I do remember the impatience and explosiveness and it has affected me - I think people are right to say that you shouldn't wipe screaming at children under the table.

But at the same time she was very supportive - thoughtful - there for me - and encouraging. She still is. She wasn't abusive. She just struggled to contain her feelings sometimes. She always apologised to me.

I have been able to get on well in life and that must be because of all the good she gave me. I have some difficulties, yes, with managing my own emotions and wish to be connected - which I can and am working on - but the good outweighed the bad a lot.

I don't think I have screamed at my children (though have certainly felt like it!) and I think that is because my mother gave me a better experience than she herself had.

I am hoping what I have been able to give my own daughter and son with my mothers help and my DHs help) will stand them in good stead if they have children.

If you think of it generationally, each generation needs to do the best they can with the resources they have.

Lol what the fuck?!

“Women who don’t exclusively breastfeed are crap parents. No offence.”

@SuperAlly

how you've managed to shoehorn in some 'breast is best' propaganda on a thread like this must've taken some mental gymnastics. So any spiteful posters on here are in the 'oh well they didn't breastfeed their babies'. Have a think why you would come to that conclusion or how it would even occur to you. Speaks volumes about you.

@goldielockdown2

No, that isn’t what I meant. Perhaps I should have mentioned that I didn’t exclusively breastfeed for the first six months, so if mothers who don’t EBF are crap, then I’m crap.

My point - which I made in my first post but SuperAlly judiciously cropped out - is that absolutely NOONE is an impeccably perfect parent. Breastfeeding is just an example. 99% of women are imperfect mothers in the first six months - we know what the recommendation is and 99% of us don’t follow it. For many and varied reasons, all valid.

But I wonder how many people who are making vicious comments to the OP are prepared to acknowledge the imperfect aspects of their own parenting or would enjoy accepting some nasty criticism for it. I’m guessing none.

OP I've been there and mostly I've made peace with it. If you are a monster then so am I.

I'll make sure when my children are older I talk to them honestly about being a parent and I will be there for them.

I also know that my D Grandmother was physically and emotionally abused, my DM is obviously carrying some trauma but is also emotionally immature, didn't teach us how to manage of emotions, is chaotic and has no concept of hers and others boundaries.
She also loves us all fiercely and did her best with the limited tools she had.

If I had realised this before having children I would have worked through the legacy. As it was I didn't so not only did I have to learn how to get my shit organised, I had little humans relying on me and of course I didn't cope well at times although most of the times I did.

All you can do is be compassionate to yourself and move forward