To think Camilla should be queen?

[Brian9600]

Just interested in people's views. The whole Charles/Diana/Camilla thing was grim but it's also grim that she's the one treated as responsible rather than him. All water under the bridge as far as I'm concerned.

(Obviously some people would get rid of the lot of them, and fair enough.)

Vote YANBU for Queen Camilla
Vote YABU for Never Queen Camilla

@LemonBreeland

I think Camilla should be Queen. I don't agree with the behaviour of her or Charles, but they are married, and that is the title of the wife of the king.

I'm astonished people think that Charles will step to the side and let William be king. Charles has waited his whole life for this. There is no way he will not be king.

Quite apart from the fact that it would require an Act of Parliament to do it...Despite what many on here are saying, I also think most people don't actually want this. It would be seen, rightly or wrongly, by many people as him flicking two fingers at the job, the institution and, by extension, the people.

Much like Harry and Meghan, who were never even going to take the throne anyway. They're apparently doing what many people want them to do: fucking it all off as much as possible and doing "real" jobs. But people hate them for it, and still have a very clear idea of how they think they should be doing it...and surprise surprise, they're being found wanting at every turn. I'm actually quite supportive, but I do believe that many people see it as a rejection and a dereliction of duty.

Also any talk of him abdicating ignores the impact that would have on William, and in particular George.

The longevity of the Queen has meant William has been able to live until his thirties as the heir to the heir. He's not had the full on pressure of being the heir. So he was able to live on Angelsey, do his SAR work and then live in Norfolk when his children were very little. Only in the last few years has his full time royal duties been stepping up (and they've still got a way to go before they are at the level of Charles or the Queen's has been). Kate has been eased into royal life bit by bit.

If Charles steps aside in say the next ten years then George becomes the heir in his teens. There will be much less privacy for future partners of his with the way of social media, but if he's the immediate heir there will also be much less wiggle room for him to have a quiet life for a few years like his parents had. His parents will also be around much less as their workload will increase dramatically.

Not only, imo, would Charles not want to give up the chance to do the role he's been waiting for his whole life, but William (and probably Charles) wouldn't want that extra demand to be put on George for as long as possible.

Charles will be king and Camilla will therefore be queen.

I don't think it's a fait accompli. I imagine the republican pot will be stirred after the Queen dies. Ultimately, a monarch serves at the behest of its people.

Oh absolutely. I completely agree.

What I mean to say is that if the monarchy is to be in place and accepted by the people then that also comes with the acceptance of the line of succession and therefore the placement of Camilla as queen.

If it was as simple as "it is what it is" she would be known as HRH The Princess of Wales atm. The fact that she's HRH The Duchess of Cornwall shows that there can be shades of grey when it comes to how she'll be titled.

Agreed but think that was a one-off due to Diana's death and the uproar being fairly recent. I think the amount of time that has passed now will negate worries about that. Plus I can't imagine Charles was happy for Camilla not to hold that title but he wasn't in charge at that point. By the time she would be referred to as queen he will be number one and therefore the decision will be down to him.

I can't see him saying it's best if his wife is not known as queen in honour of his ex wife who's been dead potentially 20+ years by then.

Agreed but think that was a one-off due to Diana's death and the uproar being fairly recent. I think the amount of time that has passed now will negate worries about that. Plus I can't imagine Charles was happy for Camilla not to hold that title but he wasn't in charge at that point. By the time she would be referred to as queen he will be number one and therefore the decision will be down to him.

I can't see him saying it's best if his wife is not known as queen in honour of his ex wife who's been dead potentially 20+ years by then.

He's not stupid though, he knows that the Diana ghost is still a thing and, importantly for him, it's a thing in the older generations (people under 30/40 generally won't give a shit and some won't even remember the whole Diana saga) who are more likely to be in support of the monarchy.

He knows he needs public support. He's not going to be as popular as the Queen and her death will inevitably (imo) raise the question of 'should the monarchy continue' with some media outlets, so he'll not want to risk jeapordising everything over a known as title.

There are media outlets who will go to town on him going back on his word because he said when they married she'd be Princess Consort.

@lyralalala

Agreed but think that was a one-off due to Diana's death and the uproar being fairly recent. I think the amount of time that has passed now will negate worries about that. Plus I can't imagine Charles was happy for Camilla not to hold that title but he wasn't in charge at that point. By the time she would be referred to as queen he will be number one and therefore the decision will be down to him.

I can't see him saying it's best if his wife is not known as queen in honour of his ex wife who's been dead potentially 20+ years by then.

He's not stupid though, he knows that the Diana ghost is still a thing and, importantly for him, it's a thing in the older generations (people under 30/40 generally won't give a shit and some won't even remember the whole Diana saga) who are more likely to be in support of the monarchy.

He knows he needs public support. He's not going to be as popular as the Queen and her death will inevitably (imo) raise the question of 'should the monarchy continue' with some media outlets, so he'll not want to risk jeapordising everything over a known as title.

There are media outlets who will go to town on him going back on his word because he said when they married she'd be Princess Consort.

I haven’t met anyone in their 20’s or 30’s who even supports the concept of a monarchy! It’s the much older folk that seems to think it’s cute that our taxes support regular people living luxurious lifestyles whilst giving nothing back.

It’s the much older folk that seems to think it’s cute that our taxes support regular people living luxurious lifestyles whilst giving nothing back.

And it's those people who'd object to Camilla being known as Queen Camilla

Bibidy it will certainly be interesting to see how all of this unfurls. I imagine the Queen has a good few years in her yet if she is still riding a pony at ninety-four. Who knows how the public mood will hqve evolved in five years time? Will Scotland be moving towards independence? What effect will Brexit and Civic have on the economy? Will economic hardship make people lean towards republicanism or send them in the opposite direction?

I'm in my 30s. I wouldn't call myself a royalist exactly, but I'm not entirely convinced that the fallout, constitutional reform and logistics that would be required to wind the whole thing up would be worth it.

I couldn't care less either way, it just amazes me how strong some peoples negative feelings towards Camilla are.

IMO, as Charles doesn’t claim to be a Christian anyway and wanted to be ‘Defender of Faith’ rather than ‘the Faith’, he shouldn’t have those titles anyway.

I'm fairly sure Charles does identify as Christian.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/dec/04/prince-charles-calls-for-greater-understanding-between-faiths

He's Christian, but he's also known for doing interfaith work.

Charles should step aside and let William take the throne. I only hope that he is a better person and more honest than his Father

I wouldn't want to make any assumptions about that - he is after all a Windsor male born and bred, though the Queen's obvious guidance and the careful curating of his and Kate's might have helped to smooth out the worst bits

It also seems that even Charles doesn't really want to say if Camilla will be queen. Asked about it at some event it was "err, well - that might be - umm - we'll have to see"
Since dignity was mentioned, is that really the best monarchists can expect?

And MIttens it was reported that Charles has rowed back on the Defender of Faiths thing, and now accepts he'll be Defender of the Faith. Maybe he calculated that he's caused enough trouble for the CofE and that it would be unwise to push it too far ...?

Doesn’t matter to me either way. As for Camilla and Charles’ relationship, I’m glad they were finally able to legitimately be together. It’s very evident they completely adore each other and it’s nice to see Charles happy. If Diana was alive I would wish the same for her.

I like Camilla. Charles should have married her first of all rather than that poor kid.

What makes me laugh, is all the anti-Charles The Crown viewers falling over themselves to want William instead.

Can we just hang on for season 5, and see how The Crown decides to play his relationship with Rose Hanbury, for you to make your minds up?

Not only, imo, would Charles not want to give up the chance to do the role he's been waiting for his whole life, but William (and probably Charles) wouldn't want that extra demand to be put on George for as long as possible

I agree, but barring disasters George is unlikely to be a young king
Hopefully the Queen's got a few more years yet, and while I'll be very surprised if Charles sees eighty, William should have a fair few decades at it - which would mean George being fairly mature by the time his turn comes

Is the civil marriage of Charles and Camilla sufficient? If he’s to become head of the Church of England as King but has not married his wife in a church service how does that work?

@Amammi

Is the civil marriage of Charles and Camilla sufficient? If he’s to become head of the Church of England as King but has not married his wife in a church service how does that work?

Yes, the type of marriage has no effect on this.

Charles and Camilla had a church blessing after their register office wedding, in which they each expressed repentance for their sins - that probably covered the situation from a C of E point of view - as far as I recall (though happy to be corrected) in C of E doctrine it's fine to 'sin' as long as you genuinely repent afterwards.

Is the civil marriage of Charles and Camilla sufficient? If he’s to become head of the Church of England as King but has not married his wife in a church service how does that work?

The answer is that we simply don't know; this was raised at the time, but the legal guidance about the position (and the deal that was done?) has been conveniently sealed for Charles's lifetime

Strange, really - if it completely validated his choice you'd have thought he'd be only too pleased for it to be available

@Pacif1cDogwood

Would she not only 'qualify' to be King Consort? Just how Prince Philip is not King?

#NotARoyalist #NotBritish

I don't really have strong feelings, either way, but did have to remind myself when watching The Crown that it was not a documentary!

Female spouses can be titled Queen because that's a lower rank than King.

Male spouses can't be titled King because that out ranks Queen. Male spouses are Prince Consort.

So if/when Charles becomes King, she could use the title Queen but has decided to use Princess Consort instead which I think is a wise choice.

@Puzzledandpissedoff

Not only, imo, would Charles not want to give up the chance to do the role he's been waiting for his whole life, but William (and probably Charles) wouldn't want that extra demand to be put on George for as long as possible

I agree, but barring disasters George is unlikely to be a young king
Hopefully the Queen's got a few more years yet, and while I'll be very surprised if Charles sees eighty, William should have a fair few decades at it - which would mean George being fairly mature by the time his turn comes

I was talking about the demands of being the direct heir.

While he's heir to the heir he has a lot more freedom than he will if he's a young heir. Willam had much more freedom in his teens, twenties and early thirties than Charles had because of that one step back.

George will be the heir younger than William will be, but they still won't want it to be unnecessarily young.

When they first met each other many years ago ,She was not interested in the "Royal " thing and married her husband rather than Charles .She seems to me to be a nice woman ,down to earth and loves dogs /horses and so on.This thread reminds me of all the thousands of Stepmums on here who complain that their RL with their DSC is difficult!

I was talking about the demands of being the direct heir

Ah - I see what you mean Lyra (and yes, that's a very valid point)

An expensive cosmetic makeover has helped too

It wasn’t money well spent if that’s true, which I very much doubt. I’m a very big Camilla fan but her looks were never and still aren’t anything other than typical of a woman her age. She strikes me as someone who’s secure enough in herself and sufficiently comfortable in her own skin not to care unduly what she looks like. That’s probably a significant part of her appeal to her husband.

@Itsallpointless

They shouldn't have been allowed to marry, let alone her be queen! Their behaviour was utterly disgraceful, and continued right under Diana's nose.

He wasn't allowed to marry her, so he (and she) should've left well alone.

They should've left the bloody monarchy when they got married, they've both basically got away with their shoddy behaviour. Who wants a King and Queen who are deceitful and untrustworthy??

And of course Diana was such a saint and paragon, wasn't she? At least Charles stuck with Camilla, not the long list of Diana's men, many of whom she tormented and their wives. Time to let it go for the sake of the next generation, what will be achieved by dragging bitterness into the lives of George, Charlotte and Louis?