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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to have concerns about my husband's attitude to our children's safety?

278 replies

Kerals26 · 18/11/2020 11:27

Please can I ask whether you think I am being unreasonable to be worried about my husband’s stance/behaviour on these kid’s safety issues? When I’ve tried to raise these things with him I usually get told I’m being over-sensitive and very little, if anything, changes. Here goes:

  • Leaves dangerous things lying around – for example, antifreeze in a bottle without a lid on the other day (in a VIMTO bottle nonetheless, so very appealing to the kids). Other times – bottles of superglue, random car and or chemical stuff etc. When my eldest was a baby I asked him not to put a device with a button battery within reach in her room. He argued, put it out of reach and then moved it down a few days later without my knowledge. I then found her in said room with said item, with the button battery missing which resulted in an incredibly stressful 45 minutes on the phone to 111 and searching for the battery, worried that her insides could be being burnt by it, as per the BBC info-campaign I’d seen. I found the battery, but that wasn’t really the point.
  • Refuses to move his toiletries bag from within reach of the children – these contain his medication and scissors. On another occasion, our 20-month-old accessed his medication from his toiletries bag, after he pooh-pahed my concern about this. He then told me I was being paranoid about her holding his pills as she couldn’t get them out. I decided to let it run while watching her the whole time, to prove the risk to him – within minutes she had the pills out of their packaging and in her hand. He then had to come running through to get them away from her, as I was breastfeeding my youngest. Despite this incident, he still leaves his toiletries and medication in the same place, despite me clearing space for these items in an alternative place in the bathroom.
  • Leaves the children in the car alone – its hard to tell how long this is for and at what distance. I know he left both kids in the car when he was at a workshop recently. He told me he got my eldest out when she set the alarm off, and left the younger one sleeping. I think the car was in sight of the workshop. When they went of running errands recently my eldest also told me ‘Daddy left us in the car watching Peppa Pig’. I don’t know were they were or how long this was for but if it was for 2 minutes to pay for petrol while watching the car, I can’t see he’d have set Peppa Pig up.
  • Leaves fire starting materials in reach of the children – matches, firelighters, fire starting fluids (albeit with child proof tops), insecticide spray and poop-pahing me when I have said I want to move these out of reach.
  • Refused to get a fireguard when the kids were younger (and wont now, although there are older and more aware of fire safety).
  • Takes the kids to the park and leaves them in the enclosed area while he drives his monster truck adjacent to the park. The kids are 3 and 4 so I often end up ‘spotting’ or assisting them on equipment when I take them to the park. Him not being very nearby, to dive in if required, bothers me.
  • Installing locks on the children’s doors and locking them into their room to play, while he works in another room (‘supervising’ them on their babycam). I don’t like the ‘distance supervising’ or the psychological impact of them feeling ‘locked in’. They have told me they don’t like it.
  • Inadequate supervision when out – on several occasions my eldest has told me they got ‘lost’ or couldn’t find Daddy, when they were out. In the summer he had them all day at a public event and my eldest told me there were approached by a lady asking where their Mummy was. I feel they must have been out of his sight for a while on this occasion (he admitted to me they had ‘gone round the back of the tent’ at one point) as, as an adult, I tend to observe potentially lost children for a little while before approaching them , looking round for a parent who may be watching from a distance or frantically looking for them.

What do you think of these behaviours? AIBU to be really worried?

OP posts:
Chottie · 18/11/2020 16:59

@Motherissues2020

I would be worried about all of those things and also be worried about your husbands reaction to your concern.
This ^

x 1,000,000 times.....

MahMahMahMahCorona · 18/11/2020 17:03

@Kerals26 - I am the parent who couldn't cope with the neglectful behaviour bordering on abuse of our DC and our pets, and initiated divorce proceedings because of it. And now I'm the parent going through the motions trying to prove such insidious behaviour to a family court who are notorious for not wanting to understand what such behaviour does to emotionally damage our little human beings.

Your DH won't change. It's almost like a game to see just how far he can push your instinct - as their mother - to protect your children. And he will break you with it, and when you ask him to leave, and he gets them on his own, he will continue to break you by breaking them.

I don't know what to add other than document everything; evidence is stale after 6 months; report what you can to the police - get it down in writing, get them to take it seriously. They'll take it seriously if he has ever damaged any animals, by the way.

I really feel for you. It is hateful. I'm so glad you are seeking support from the various agencies out there - your emotional stability is vitally important. I would urge you also to see your GP, document it all - take this initial post up top to your GP, tell them about your fears, write them an email afterwards to say this is what we discussed. Send the email to your DH, tell him you are majorly concerned about his behaviours. Dance like nobody is watching. Write emails as if one day they will be read out in court. Good luck.

MahMahMahMahCorona · 18/11/2020 17:06

@Confrontayshunme

Funny to ask, but is DH possibly on the autism spectrum? A friend of mine's DH (with autism) had some very similar problems, and her DH just could not visualise the risk to their children. It took a GP AND health visitor sitting him down and saying "These are the expectations for safety for your children. If you lock them in a room, they will die if there is a fire. If you do not watch them in the park, they will fall off the climbing frame." They had to schedule time for his gaming and hobby at specific times and set him a timetable for "supervised childcare". We all found it really strange, but he needed a professional to believe it wasn't just his wofe being overprotective and trying to change his routine.
I find it ironic that you might attribute these sorts of behaviours to someone on the spectrum. I had the very same experience - someone suggested my XH potentially had Aspergers hence why he was being cruel to me and the dog, and latterly to the children.

My theory is more narcissistic sociopath. His own DM contributed to the theory by saying "his father is essentially Harold Shipman: the difference being he's never killed anyone." 😐

UniversalAunt · 18/11/2020 17:07

You need to act.
When I realised that you have recently posted about Oh & his behaviours, I see the overall pattern is of him as an abuser & minimiser.
The children are directly being affected by his placing them at risk

You have a duty to protect your children from harm.
If this means getting him out of the house & then in extremis his only seeing the children on supervised visits, then so be it.

Women’s Aid for support.
Family law specialist lawyer for advice about separation & divorce, & applying for legal aid on the grounds of domestic abuse.

Keep notes, fill in time lines.
Take photos of scenarios as you find e.g. easy access to chemicals in domestic containers.
Tell your GP, Health Worker & family/friends what is going on.

Billben · 18/11/2020 17:10

He is an idiot for doing all the things you have listed. But I would go mental at anybody who locks my children into their bedroom. WTF is wrong with him?

Onjnmoeiejducwoapy · 18/11/2020 17:23

Could someone please explain to me how putting antifreeze in a VIMTO bottle and leaving it open with children there is anything other than a case of attempted murder? How could this situation arise in a way that only amounts to JUST negligence?

OP?

Handsoffisback · 18/11/2020 17:31

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request.

spotlovesbedtime · 18/11/2020 17:31

I couldn't finish reading. You are not being sensitive, he is totally out of order to the point where I wouldn't be letting him be alone with his children. So many things are easily avoided but he still does? Accidents can happen in the safest of environments.....he's not even remotely trying to create one. These aren't things where kids will learn not to do again either......drink antifreeze, eat a battery....... however if you leave will he have access alone to kids?

GalaxyCookieCrumble · 18/11/2020 17:39

@MedusasBadHairDay

He's police?! FFS. Run OP, run and don't look back.
Exactly, I would start making plans to leave, problem sorted because Police know how to play the system, not being awful but honest.
TatianaBis · 18/11/2020 17:43

He’s a lunatic OP. You may recall me from your other thread.

Conscientiously, laboriously document everything - incident diary, paper trail with GP and SS. You may be able to use that later as evidence if you need legal aid.

ilovebagpuss · 18/11/2020 17:47

Aside from all the dangerous stuff left around and the locking in bedrooms which in itself is all wrong the leaving them on their own at the park at 3&4 is insane!
Also when your little ones tell you daddy has left them or they “lost” daddy it must have been scary and they are trying to tell you so you can make it right and safe.
Do not leave them with him again.

Storyoftonight · 18/11/2020 18:00

OP, without even needing to add to what you know is outrageous behaviour , you have spoken to a social worker and still haven't just left him?

Not sure I agree with the allowing a dangerous situation to play out to prove your point.

Make the right decision and go.

GalaxyCookieCrumble · 18/11/2020 18:03

@AintOverUntilTheCatLadySings yes we would

Kerals26 · 18/11/2020 19:06

So supported by the Mumsnet outrage I summoned my courage and tackled him this afternoon about his behaviour. These were his defences/responses.

  • Leaves dangerous things lying around – he admitted he shouldn’t have left the anti-freeze out and said he won’t do this again. Let’s see. I find this hard to believe as when I highlighted the lid less bottle to him (not knowing it was anti-freeze) he still didn’t dash downstairs to address it. I’ve been raising various examples of dangerous things left out for years it hasn’t stopped him in the past.
  • Refuses to move his toiletries bag/medicines from within reach of the children - he has now moved these but couldn’t provide an adequate explanation for why he has taken years to do so (moving the medicines and scissors would have taken seconds). I haven’t moved them as I get ripped off a strip for moving his stuff. I’ve just tried to supervise them in the bathroom and check they’re not getting into his stuff.
  • Leaves the children in the car alone – he claims both the incidents (that I know about) weren’t for that long and that he was in sight of the car.
  • Leaves fire starting materials in reach of the children – he has now said he will get a lock for the cupboard.
  • Refused to get a fireguard - now in agreement to get a fire guard.
  • Takes the kids to the park and leaves them in the enclosed area while he drives his monster truck adjacent to the park - reiterates his rationale that he can see the kids all the time and doesn’t need to be inside the playground to adequately supervise.
  • Installing locks on the children’s doors and locking them into their room to play - is of the view that this is a better level of care than what I provide when I am buzzing between rooms moving laundry, cooking dinner etc. Doesn’t see that this causes psychological damage.
  • Inadequate supervision when out/losing children - claims he has ‘heard my point’ and that it ‘won’t happen again. I severely doubt this - the next time he gets distracted when out and about, they will wander off.

I also got criticised for ‘not saying anything positive’ during this conversation about the kids safety (incidentally a criticising that’s been levied at me after marriage counselling sessions) - and told that I had put the children at risk because I left a Johnson’s lavender hair wash out which said ‘keep out of reach of children’ in the small print - and because our eldest once fell off the back of the sofa when I was out of the lounge. Apparently she could have died.

While he appears to have taken a number of points on board, I despair of ever having to make these points (and that I’ve made them in the past and they have been ignored). I am also a bit WTF about trying to claim I have put the DC at risk by having shampoo at the side of the bath (anyone else do this) and because our eldest once fell off the sofa when I was out the lounge. This smacks of his usual gaslighting/blaming me strategy/well you do it strategy.

OP posts:
PrincessNutNut · 18/11/2020 19:08

@Kerals26

So supported by the Mumsnet outrage I summoned my courage and tackled him this afternoon about his behaviour. These were his defences/responses.
  • Leaves dangerous things lying around – he admitted he shouldn’t have left the anti-freeze out and said he won’t do this again. Let’s see. I find this hard to believe as when I highlighted the lid less bottle to him (not knowing it was anti-freeze) he still didn’t dash downstairs to address it. I’ve been raising various examples of dangerous things left out for years it hasn’t stopped him in the past.
  • Refuses to move his toiletries bag/medicines from within reach of the children - he has now moved these but couldn’t provide an adequate explanation for why he has taken years to do so (moving the medicines and scissors would have taken seconds). I haven’t moved them as I get ripped off a strip for moving his stuff. I’ve just tried to supervise them in the bathroom and check they’re not getting into his stuff.
  • Leaves the children in the car alone – he claims both the incidents (that I know about) weren’t for that long and that he was in sight of the car.
  • Leaves fire starting materials in reach of the children – he has now said he will get a lock for the cupboard.
  • Refused to get a fireguard - now in agreement to get a fire guard.
  • Takes the kids to the park and leaves them in the enclosed area while he drives his monster truck adjacent to the park - reiterates his rationale that he can see the kids all the time and doesn’t need to be inside the playground to adequately supervise.
  • Installing locks on the children’s doors and locking them into their room to play - is of the view that this is a better level of care than what I provide when I am buzzing between rooms moving laundry, cooking dinner etc. Doesn’t see that this causes psychological damage.
  • Inadequate supervision when out/losing children - claims he has ‘heard my point’ and that it ‘won’t happen again. I severely doubt this - the next time he gets distracted when out and about, they will wander off.

I also got criticised for ‘not saying anything positive’ during this conversation about the kids safety (incidentally a criticising that’s been levied at me after marriage counselling sessions) - and told that I had put the children at risk because I left a Johnson’s lavender hair wash out which said ‘keep out of reach of children’ in the small print - and because our eldest once fell off the back of the sofa when I was out of the lounge. Apparently she could have died.

While he appears to have taken a number of points on board, I despair of ever having to make these points (and that I’ve made them in the past and they have been ignored). I am also a bit WTF about trying to claim I have put the DC at risk by having shampoo at the side of the bath (anyone else do this) and because our eldest once fell off the sofa when I was out the lounge. This smacks of his usual gaslighting/blaming me strategy/well you do it strategy.

This isn't good enough.
Kerals26 · 18/11/2020 19:10

@BoyTree

That all sounds really worry, not least because it's all to facilitate him doing what he wants at the expense of basic safety precautions. But he won't acknowledge your concerns or accept that he needs change so I guess that leaves you doing all the child care yourself if you want them to be safe. I would remove locks from their doors though- we moved into a house with locks on the kids' doors and removed them on the first day because the idea was so miserable. Do you think you can get through to him?
Tried this afternoon @BoyTree. See what you think of it in the update.
OP posts:
Kerals26 · 18/11/2020 19:13

@Bananalanacake

I don't understand why he moved the item with the button battery in her bedroom where she could reach it. Why could it stay where it was.
Probably to make a point to me that he's in control. It was a digital thermometer and could be read from the top of the wall unit where I put it - but no, he had to move it to the low level windowsill within her reach.
OP posts:
Onjnmoeiejducwoapy · 18/11/2020 19:13

Sorry OP but what the hell are you doing?!? Why are you posting these threads and then going to chat to him about it when what you need to do is take action? Why do you want advice from people when you go and do the opposite?

You realise that if an outside observer calls this in, you could lose your children? You are allowing him to abuse them and put them in harms way, YOU are being negligent and abusive by doing this.

Seriously! Precisely nobody has told you the best idea is to have a chat with an abusive and dangerous man about this while your children continue to be subjected to it. This is not ok. If I knew your identity I would absolutely call social services on you right away.

Handsoffisback · 18/11/2020 19:14

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request.

Kerals26 · 18/11/2020 19:14

@Rainbowsoup

Awful and neglectful.

Why have you allowed him to install locks on the doors? These need to be removed immediately. I wouldn’t trust him with the children alone

There is no 'allowing him'. He would not tolerate me taking them down.
OP posts:
Onjnmoeiejducwoapy · 18/11/2020 19:15

There IS allowing him OP—you are allowing your children to be subjected to this. YOU.

Handsoffisback · 18/11/2020 19:17

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request.

Handsoffisback · 18/11/2020 19:17

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This has been withdrawn by MNHQ at the poster's request.

endofthelinefinally · 18/11/2020 19:17

All those demanding to know why OP hasn't left, unfortunately the courts insist that children must be left alone with abusive men for extended periods of time.
This is why mothers are trapped.
It is shocking, but it is what it is.

Kerals26 · 18/11/2020 19:17

@ChaToilLeam

Just saw your update re social services: that’s unacceptable and needs taken further, have you followed up on your complaint since?
No - they have had very little interest in dealing with it.
OP posts:
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