AIBU or is DH being unreasonable regarding career change

[Logiclady94]

Hi, I’m prepared to be told I am being unreasonable but I was only making a suggestion. DH and I had a massive argument this morning with regards to me suggesting a career change for him. He is a web developer/designer and has been doing it since we got together 4 years ago, when we met he’d lost his job and it took him about 6 months to get another.. he had enough savings to live on during that time. He had been in that job since 2017 until he got let go in June 2020 because his performance had dropped and he hadn’t progressed at all.

He has since got a new job but because he his progression hadn’t moved at his old job he got a new job at the same level he was on but for less money (£4000 less) he was told he would get a pay review in January 2021 when his probationary ended and if he met it he would potentially get the original job adverts salary (more than his last job)

So long story short I said to him this morning why didn’t he train to become a railway signaller like my dad? He could train as he has more qualifications than I do and he could freelance in his spare time if he still loved the web developer role and he blew up at all.

Saying that the only way I’d be happy is if we had more money.. it’s always about the more money. He told me I don’t respect him and that if I liked the money so much why I don’t study to become one like my dad. I told him I’m not smart enough, I don’t have any qualifications.. I earn more than him right now as I work in a good industry.

I only suggested it because my dads hours would work really nicely for the lifestyle he wants, he wants to do his hobby in his spare time (painting figures and playing war games) he also wants to do podcasts, paint other people’s figure for commission work, freelance web design and get married, move to a nicer area and so on and so on... it is a long extensive list which he would have more time to do all that as the job is 3 days on 4 days or 4 days on and 3 days off (I can’t remember what my dad said, he likes to work himself to death so he does a hell of a lot of overtime)

I feel awful for suggesting it now as I was just trying to be helpful as I don’t think the web developer role is working out for him. He has two lost two jobs and he hasn’t gained any progression in nearly 6 years. I feel like I lost a bit of respect for him when he lost that job because he didn’t even tell me he had been put on a warning or anything. He had been supporting me through two terrible pregnancies and one illness that required surgery. He told me his work understood and then during lockdown he had a meeting about it then when I asked him what was going on, he told me everything. He then got a call that afternoon to say he’d been let go. I didn’t know any of this and it made me have to return from maternity early which was stressful because with covid we didn’t have the childcare set up.

Was IBU to suggest it? And was DH being unreasonable for blowing up at me?

@MrsCBY- yes that was my post. I had said to him that I would not have tried to conceive our son if I had known about all the problems at work and instead I would have had him put all his efforts into getting him back to where he was professionally before looking at a 2nd child. I have returned to work and it isn’t working. We hired a nanny who didn’t work out and I got left handling the children on Friday and my work which that day was incoming phone based. If I had been able to stay on maternity longer than we wouldn’t have needed it.

I don’t want to keep playing the blame game though I want us to get back to where we were. I’m tired of us not communicating and not working together. He’s had a vasectomy since and we don’t have to go through all this hell again

He is gaslighting you massively. Massively.
I'm afraid I'm with @MrsCBY

OP - have you some good close friends in real life to talk to? There seems more to this than meets the eye. Forgot the change of caree, it's largely irrelevant, but it sounds like he's not very reliable and now you're blaming yourself for that.

I think you are being a bit unfair to your husband.
If I understand properly he lost his job when they shifted premises resulting in a reduction in workforce. Your husband was one of those let go as his work had been slipping and his timekeeping and attendance was poor.
This doesn't sound great, but a bit more digging shows that he wasn't on the skive but looking after you through difficult pregnancy and illness. Then it transpires that any spare time is spent building a house for your relative! He seems to be bending over backwards to help you and your family to the detriment of his work, yet you are saying you have lost respect for him - no wonder he was annoyed when you randomly suggested that he retrain in the same field as your dad.
He currently gas a job in his own field and I suggest gently that perhaps you could encourage him there, rather than try and turn him into a clone of your father

@Mydogmylife- no that’s not it, my DH is a web developer and he is building a website for my family in his spare time. He doesn’t build houses. He lost his job because he was put on an informal warning in January 2019 then he was put on a formal warning in September 2019 and then he was scheduled for a review in January this year which was put back because our son was born premature. He took even more time off and didn’t put the work in even during lockdown than he was let go in June.

His work had been discussing before we had our DD in 2018 about merging his web developer team at his office with one of the two main offices in a different city. He was the only web developer left at his particular office so I guess when his work slipped they decided that it wouldn’t be worth the pay increase to him so they cut the idea

He’s building a website worth £3000 and charging your family £200 according to your other thread.

He needs to bin that off.

I will also look into continuing what I was going to do in my current role which was going to be starting training for HR as I have had some previous training in a previous role.
The HR will mean if I don’t want to continue in Housing than I move my qualifications elsewhere.

Are you thinking of formal qualifications in HR? I'm just asking as this is my main career and depending on the level of training you do, your potential salary may not be brilliant, but I don't know what your current salary is.

You mentioned that you don't think you're smart....are you looking at an Administrator type of role in HR...because a lot of organisations want you to be CIPD qualified

I've worked in HR for over 20 years and have a postgraduate level qualification in HR....your qualification/experience will reflect your pay on entry.

I'm happy to answer any questions if you want to PM me.

@Kcar- he’s building it for free now as he wants to use it for his portfolio

[quote Logiclady94]@Kcar- he’s building it for free now as he wants to use it for his portfolio[/quote]
No harm but that is a terrible idea.

Wow there is so much in the background that the career suggestion thing feels irrelevant.
OP’s husband is not career minded and likes to spend time with family, he lost two jobs because of poor performance and attendance, he is doing animation free work for OP’s family, OP is hugely influenced by her own family’s career choices, OP thinks she is not smart, OP herself doesn’t know what she wants from her own career, she thinks is suffering from depression.
OP, you both have very different ideas of how you want to plan a major element of lives going forward. Someone has to compromise. You need to accept that he is not career minded and focus energy into your own progression, if he can do it, so can you, at least you have control over your own choices. And that sense of achievement without always looking to someone else will set you up for life.

I'm also not quite sure why you are thinking of changing career- or at least not right now with a older baby and a toddler, I would think housing if that's council services is a good place to stay at the moment, especially if you have had a lot of time off. I think HR in a private company may be far more ruthless and not pay brilliantly unless you have quite a lot of qualifications (which cost to obtain). Unless you can move from housing to HR within the current service.

I'm not saying thinking about having a career isn't important, but right now, the least change the better to let things settle- and to get your husband to January and to a better wage.

His not telling you about his work problems and then you getting pregnant sounds deeply wrong. I can only guess you have decided to keep going with the marriage, and in some ways at least you have had the two children you wanted close together, and now no more (if he's had a vasectomy).

I think sitting tight is the order of the day here, not jumping around.

Thanks to the poster who spoke about signalling as a job- sounds incredibly stressful when you put it like that, so much responsibility to get it right.

@Bluntness100

So long story short I said to him this morning why didn’t he train to become a railway signaller like my dad

I’m sorry but that made me laugh out loud. I can see why he wasn’t delighted

Did he ask dor your suggestion on a career change for him? Or has he ever suggested he wishes to emulate your father?

Me too!!

@Logiclady94
OK thanks for the clarification - however he's still working for free /reduced rates for your family - is that correct?
You both really need to have a good long think about what you both want going forward then a discussion between you to make that happen.

He had been supporting me through two terrible pregnancies and one illness that required surgery

So he supported and looked after you to the detriment of his job. He managed to get a new one in a terrible employment market and it still isn’t good enough for you? You really don’t deserve that man.

it sounds like he doesn't want to work and thinks it will be easier to look after the kids. Forcing him to work in a field he's never thought to do himself is a disaster.sounds like he's work shy.

The average rail salary in the UK in 2019 is £45,472 per annum and the average hourly rate is £12.27. Salaries paid annually range from £41,667 for a Construction Manager to £66,750 for a Project Director. - 19 Feb 2020

Railway jobs are well paid, and yes the demand for them is very competitive.

If my DH picked a career out of thin air.and.suggested I change to that, i would think he had lost his marbles

I didn't see your previous thread. With your updates it appears he is not just a nice supportive guy who was unlucky enough to lose his job due to time off work for OP's appointments & medical issues etc. He was underperforming at work before January 2019 if he was given a warning, so this is not due to COVID or OP's pregnancy complications, though those won't have helped.

As MrsCBY puts it so well, he witheld information about his problems at work so OP would agree to try for another baby, a decision she took, believing they were financially secure to do so and a decision she says she wouldn't have taken at that point had she known the truth.

OP's suggestion of a career change for him is just skimming the surface here about honesty, communication, mutually agreed goals and shared values.

He has even said a couple of times that if this job doesn’t work out he will give up web work and stay at home with the kids... - this stood out to me. This is fine if it is what they both agree on but it doesn't sound like OP would want that. After a number of health issues and now she says possibly depression, is she ready to be the sole wage earner and even if she is does she earn enough to support the lifestyle she wants? If the marriage ends, he will have positioned himself as the main caregiver for the children too.

If my DH picked a career out of thin air.and.suggested I change to that, i would think he had lost his marbles

But it's not out of thin air.. she knows how well it pays and how good the hours are..because her Father works the Railways..

@VinylDetective

He had been supporting me through two terrible pregnancies and one illness that required surgery

So he supported and looked after you to the detriment of his job. He managed to get a new one in a terrible employment market and it still isn’t good enough for you? You really don’t deserve that man.

This is such a cruel and irresponsible post.

He lied to OP over and over again. He wouldn’t have had to support her through her second, very difficult, pregnancy and their son’s subsequent health issues if he had been honest with her because she wouldn’t have been pregnant. He made these choices and he made them alone, not in partnership with the OP as he should have done.

OP is already blaming herself unfairly for his actions, as those who are subject to gaslighting often do, and you are encouraging her to blame herself more.

That is effectively enabling emotional abuse. You should be ashamed of yourself.

OP's suggestion of a career change for him is just skimming the surface here about honesty, communication, mutually agreed goals and shared values.

Absolutely, JennyWoodentop.

This is one thread where it really would help if people RTFT before posting.

I totally agree with everything @MrsCBY has said.

I don’t want to keep playing the blame game though

OP you say this but you are still playing the blame game. You’re just blaming the wrong person: yourself.

You say:

I know I am partially to blame why he lost his job in June (which is just not true)

and

It is me that needs to change not him (again not true)

I suspect it’s easier for you to blame yourself than to recognise the full extent of how badly he’s let you down, betrayed you even.

I can understand that. It’s quite a common response to being treated badly by someone who’s supposed to care for you, who you really want to believe cares for you.

But it won’t work long term. It will create more and more MH issues - not because there’s something wrong with you, as your (and his) current narrative seems to be, but because it is depressing to be treated like this and to suck it up and make out it’s your fault, and it messes with your head really badly.

I want us to get back to where we were. I’m tired of us not communicating and not working together.

Then you have to challenge him to put the work in to make this happen. This is his mess and he needs to fix it. If he really is the good guy you say he is, he will rise to the challenge and acknowledge that he fucked up, really badly, and it’s on him to make it right.

At the moment you’re taking responsibility for his actions, and it’s destroying your MH. He needs to take responsibility for his past actions, he needs to stop gaslighting you, he needs to stop hurling hurtful accusations at you like he did today when you tried to make a suggestion you genuinely thought might work well for him.

If he is willing and able to do that, then maybe you really could get back on track. If he isn’t, you can tie yourself in knots all you like but it won’t change things because it’s not you who’s the problem.

he’s building it for free now as he wants to use it for his portfolio does he not already have a portfolio?

Then you have to challenge him to put the work in to make this happen. This is his mess and he needs to fix it. If he really is the good guy you say he is, he will rise to the challenge and acknowledge that he fucked up, really badly, and it’s on him to make it right.

• He lost his job.
• He's got another job.
• What's the mess? A drop in salary?

One person cannot fix a marriage and thinking it will, won't get you anywhere fast.

People are acting like he's committed a cardinal sin.

@pinkyredrose- no his previous web career is improving existing websites for companies do he never built any from scratch. This what he is building for my family is completely from scratch and without any design idea to work with