DS bullying a child at school

[orangesalad]

Posting for traffic and name changed as potentially outing.

Found out today that my ds13 has been nasty to a child at school today... throwing food over the child's head, making a laughing stock out of the child's dandruff (which was caused by the food my ds dropped on him) the child was also pooped on by a bird and due to that and my son throwing food over them the child threw their blazer in the bin at school. My ds13 seems to be having a good laugh about it with his friends over WhatsApp which is how I've found out and what bothers me also is my DS was telling both myself and my DH about how this 'crazy' kid had thrown their blazer in the bin at school today. We asked why and he just said he didn't know and the conversation moved on.

I'm going to speak to DS in the morning and see what he says but I've already seen what happened via his phone. I will also call the school first thing Monday but I just feel so disappointed and sorry for the child this happened to. Having been bullied throughout my school years I understand what impact that can have on a child and so I've spoken to my kids many times and encouraged them to be kind. Wwyd

oakleaffy gypsy
The reason that hitting back worked is because bullying is all about power imbalance. The bully perceives that they have more power. Kids who are repeat victims of bullies are those who show by their responses that they perceive themselves to be less powerful. This can be through getting wound up, crying, shrinking, etc. (None of this makes it right or acceptable btw; just sharing the research). By hitting back gypsy's ds reclaimed his power. For other kids, acting unbothered works. When I was bullied I instinctively played along and gained social currency as a "good sport" with a sense of humour. They never knew they disgusted me.

Teen years are a mine field.

We're not the strictest parents in the world but we aren't lenient by any means. DS always seems to not care about any rules set by us or the school. If he thinks he can get away with something he will just do it which really worries us

He sounds drunk on his own image, OP, playing the role of cool, daring prankster or similar at school. I’d seriously consider moving him to a new school or at least warn him that that’s an option you’re considering. He’s playing to his audience and without that audience, he might reflect more on himself and his behaviour.

I’d remove his phone and set him chores to do as punishment. Id limit or remove any ‘high status’ items eg clothes, games, etc. I’d speak to the other child’s parents and ask what they think is best rather than deciding to get a new blazer or take your son round to their house. That might not be the right thing for the bullied child.

I’d also speak to school and see if your son could be temporarily removed from all the situations in which he bullies. So, a later or earlier lunch away from his peers, being kept in at break or limited to an area away from this child and your son’s peers, even leaving school 10 mins later if that’s an option.

Not necessarily. I was badly bullied about my appearance throughout school by boys in the year above despite always outwardly seeming very confident. I never shrunk away or anything like that and don't look timid and definitely have an air of confidence. Always had tonnes of mates. Perhaps that is why noone who knew me (eg same year group) bullied me. It didnt stop the boys in the year above tho bullying me every time they saw me about my appearance. Maybe its different for different types of bullying.

I would perhaps contemplate getting his blazer, lobbing something milky up the back and chucking it in the bin / letting him go to school with “milk” stains up the back. He needs to learn empathy and unfortunately at his age I don’t think taking away phones etc works. TBH I have never found that sort of punishment works. I just talk to my kids about why and they behave really well.

many bullies at this age are children who are powerful and "cool" with high social capital. These are not unpopular losers. They are successful youngsters and their behaviour is tolerated and accepted by other kids who want to be part of their "in group

This was certainly my experience. With the exception of one individual, everyone who bullied me in high school had a lot
of social capital.

@orangesalad, please don’t let your son anywhere near his victim; no going to his house to apologise, no paying for things. Leave the poor boy alone.

In your shoes i would be taking my son the the police station to report that he had physically assaulted another person, because that’s what he’s done. He’s over the age of criminal responsibility and if he assaulted someone in any other setting he’d be arrested. School shouldn’t be any different.

He’d also be taken to and from school by me. If he can’t behave like a kind and responsible member of society then he doesn’t deserve to be trusted like one.

The fact he’s done this before is very worrying; he’s not 8, he’s 13 - almost an adult in many ways, really. I’d bet my house that he knows what he’s doing and he’s enjoying it. ‘Bullying’ is a word that’s used to gloss over and sanitise some truly hideous physical, verbal and emotional abuse.

If it were my son, I'd make him research the impact of bullying. Suicide rates, impact to mental health etc. Make him really see the reality of what he's inflicting.

I'd make him put together a presentation on his findings and I'd ask his form tutor to allow him time to deliver this presentation to the entirety of his class - his own form of public humiliation.

I would cancel any internet access he has for 6 months and hit him in his pocket. No money whatsoever except chores money that must pay for new blazer. I would also make him write a letter of apology to poor victim and hand deliver it to victim in school in front of you, so you know it's done. I would also personally write letter of apology to child's parents setting out all punishment your child is receiving and including cost of new blazer and ask school to pass it on to them. I would also tell your child if you find out anything else he has done you will cancel his Xmas.

Update: we went ultimate war fare this morning and had a long discussion about his behaviour and explained the consequences

1. He’s lost his own blazer until he earns it back through chores which we will pace so he doesn’t get it back before learning a lesson

1. He’s spending the day watching videos of children who have committed suicide due to bullying. After 18 minutes he was apologising profusely and sobbing like we haven’t seen before.

1. He’s had his designer clothes taken away (we’d already bought some due to his entitled attitude last week about wearing appropriate uniform for school)

1. We are going to pay for a new blazer for the child or give the parents money for one. He doesn’t know this

1. Lost phone, internet and console for the foreseeable

1. Going to the school on Monday to let them know

1. He’s going to be volunteering, maybe litter picking, or helping vulnerable people

1. He will be writing a letter after he’s watched the videos and after he’s wrote to us explaining what he’s learned from them

I can’t say too much here as it’s very outing but he didn’t have the best start in life. I am not his birth mother, but I love him like my own son and have been a mother to him since he was 5. I’m sure this has affected his empathy levels however he’s not evil at his core, he can be lovely and wants to do well but very often doesn’t think and definitely lacks in empathy, has poor judgement and thinks he knows best but our eyes have been drastically opened and on no level will we tolerate bullying

IF you haven't already -take his phone now.

Honestly you sound like a fantastic mother to this boy and you are doing all you can by making him realise this is not ok!!!!

You are doing what you can and I think the multiple actions you are taking will help him to understand the serious consequences of bullying. I hope it works out for you all.

Sorry saw your update- that sounds like a fantastic plan.

You are amazing and doing a wonderful job parenting him op. I salute you! Seriously this is not easy, and no one wants to think their child is the bully in school.

His start to life might be having an impact now, does he have any support for this now?

I think that I would be inclined to focus on empathy. How would be like it if someone did this to him? What would it be like if someone made him a laughing stock. Get him to tell you how he thinks the other boy feels. Then ask him why he enjoys making someone else unhappy? He's probably not even considered it from their point of view. I would try to make him feel really guilty about it and ashamed of his behaviour. Pull the 'so disappointed and sad' tact.

As it’s not the first time I’d take the phone away completely and honestly I’d be absolutely livid and incredibly upset/

Sorry another one, just seen your update x.

Sounds like a good start.

I'd be inclined to show him what adult examples of bullies turn out to be (via videos, discussion etc, Trump is a perfect example, it may have made him appear successful but he is an idiot, ridiculed by much of the world, there will be other examples in sit-coms, dramas etc), and how any success they have is down to others being scared of them, despising them, being disgusted by them etc etc.

Friends gained through being a bully to others are not true friends, and I am not sure he realises that - make him realise it!

@CulturallyAppropriatedName

oakleaffy gypsy The reason that hitting back worked is because bullying is all about power imbalance. The bully perceives that they have more power. Kids who are repeat victims of bullies are those who show by their responses that they perceive themselves to be less powerful. This can be through getting wound up, crying, shrinking, etc. (None of this makes it right or acceptable btw; just sharing the research). By hitting back gypsy's ds reclaimed his power. For other kids, acting unbothered works. When I was bullied I instinctively played along and gained social currency as a "good sport" with a sense of humour. They never knew they disgusted me.

Teen years are a mine field.

@CulturallyAppropriatedName

Teen years are indeed a minefield.

But even in adult years, there is bullying.

One has to stand up to it, or suffer.

It is indeed all about 'Power' .

Girls are not physical, so much as emotionally vile..

@orangesalad you sound like amazing parents! Your DS is so lucky to have you because so many parents don’t care enough to make sure their children become decent adults.

I think that is a great plan. I re-thought the binning his blazer, but keeping it from him until earned back is better. Also, paying for the child's blazer without him knowing is perfect.

Is he going to actually apologise to the child face to face? I think that needs done too as a letter may just be ripped up and thought of as cop-out, unless alongside a real apology - they could think - sure anyone can write words on a page without actually meaning it. Also the child will be dreading seeing him in school again - I think a face-to-face before being back at school will help both of them a lot, help that poor wee child try to settle himself before going back, and your son begin to process what he has done. You will probably never have any idea the profound positive impact it could have on the boy, if he has been suffering for a long time with this, before it is too late. My heart is breaking for him.

Thanks for this thread. It has reminded to me to have a chat again to my own kids about all this stuff, about what is going on in their worlds that may be under the radar.

Amazing update, well don OP.

It sounds like his tough start might well contribute towards his actions now. On top of everything else I'd also be looking into therapy for him. He can't get away with taking out his pain on others for the rest of his life- forcing him to watch the videos and volunteer is all well and good but it needs to go alongside something that forces him to deal with the reason why he is bullying.

I also agree that you sound like fantastic parents.

There are several BBC3 'Real stories' documentaries on you tube focussing on bullying. Might be worth a watch.
I wouldn't leave him to watch them on his own. Watch them together as a family.
Let him cry all he likes (with embarrassment & shame hopefully).
He needs to feel those emotions.
As his Mum, you can comfort him when he's got the message.

Well done on the plan op. Make him watch and rewatch those suicide videos. He needs to be deeply affected by it and realise that he could be the reason someone does that.
He also needs to publicly apologize to this boy with you and his parents there.
The other boy needs to have his say because your son could just be putting on an act.
Please follow through in punishing him. There should be no place in this world for bullies.

You've got a long weekend ahead of you OP to you.

Give your son a dumb phone, ground him until the New Year, at least, and take him to meet the child and his parents and get him to apologise. No computer games, and scale back his Christmas expectations. Explain clearly why his behaviour is appalling and why he is being punished so severely. Stick to your guns.