DS bullying a child at school

[orangesalad]

Posting for traffic and name changed as potentially outing.

Found out today that my ds13 has been nasty to a child at school today... throwing food over the child's head, making a laughing stock out of the child's dandruff (which was caused by the food my ds dropped on him) the child was also pooped on by a bird and due to that and my son throwing food over them the child threw their blazer in the bin at school. My ds13 seems to be having a good laugh about it with his friends over WhatsApp which is how I've found out and what bothers me also is my DS was telling both myself and my DH about how this 'crazy' kid had thrown their blazer in the bin at school today. We asked why and he just said he didn't know and the conversation moved on.

I'm going to speak to DS in the morning and see what he says but I've already seen what happened via his phone. I will also call the school first thing Monday but I just feel so disappointed and sorry for the child this happened to. Having been bullied throughout my school years I understand what impact that can have on a child and so I've spoken to my kids many times and encouraged them to be kind. Wwyd

This is the second time you've found him bullying. It's time to fight fire with fire. Tip some food over his head and see how he likes it. I'm completely serious.

He clearly has no empathy and doesn't give a fuck about how what he's doing this child is making them feel so it's time he should feel a bit of humiliation.

Get him some grandad clothes from eBay and cheap crap trainers or shoes make him wear those instead of nice clothes. Sell his smart phone and get him a Nokia.

You are his parents. Everything he owns/wears/does is thanks to you. Fancy trainers and phones are not a human right or even a need. They are gifts and he has shown he is not worthy of them.

Taking away his WhatsApp and making him do some dishes clearly isn't go to have any effect whatsoever.

If that was my child who was bullied by your son, it would have been a police matter.

What appalling behaviour you have spawned.
I think I’d have spoken with school and arranged to have my dear child make a public apology to the other child. Preferably in front of the entire school. He might learn some empathy and consequences.

Perhaps teach him to be kind by doing acts of charity together. Lockdown makes this more challenging but he could still learn to make masks to donate to food banks or similar. He could collect and deliver shopping for elderly neighbours with you. He could collect prescriptions for others with you. He could still litter pick.

Then perhaps change his social life and activities so that post lockdown they included something altruistic. Maybe youth councils, school charity group etc.

Bullying is about power and control. Those of us who have bullied or been bullied typically have a very low tolerance to lack of control or power, such as social capital. They tend to be leaders, ring leaders, outcasts or mavericks.
Those who tend not to bully or be bullied have high levels of tolerance. They tend to be ignored by bullies and are laid back, happy-go-lucky and by-standers

What does this mean? So a child who is bullied say for being poor, fat, disabled, spotty or whatever has a low tolerance to power and control?! What?!

Your son sounds like a proper arse hole!

Bullying makes me see red. A 12 year old has very recently committed suicide due to bullying. Her bullies will just carry on with their lives.

I really feel strongly that their should be consequences for bullying. Spending a few months in a YOI for the bastards should be the norm. They wouldn’t be too keen then.
Losing privileges whilst still sat cushy at home just isn’t enough.

Please can we not flame the op. She is asking for help. Shaming and humiliting her son isn't going to help her son or the victim. He needs consequences to know this is very serious but he also needs to see the effects of his actions and learn to have empathy and humanity. Is a apology even sincere if made to do it? How will the victim feel if made to do it front of everyone. Your son needs to learn it it wrong, it has an enormous impact on others mental health, he needs to understand how that would have made that poor boy feel. He's needs to stop and he needs to be kind. There's an interview on This morning of a parent who's son was bullied, he killed himself. It is heart breaking. Lucy Alexander was her name Google it make him watch it.

I'm still so confused about how bullied children just arent "stepping out of the dynamic" Do explain more about how children are for example meant to change their features so as to deepen their tolerance for lack of power and control. What a load of wank.

I strongly believe, in fact, that the consequence of proven and serious bullying should be loss of the culprit’s school place.

My daughter was bullied because she was short.

Please can you tell me how I am supposed to make her grow taller?

This discussion is kind of depressing because really, the best and most appropriate time to teach empathy is in toddler and infanthood. Problem you see now might stem back from that point. Of course you can try to tach it now, to 're-wire' his feelings, but it'll almost certainly need professional help. Tipping a plate of food over his head will do nothing.

We see around us, all the time, adults completely lacking in empathy, and exhibiting sociopathic traits. It's very difficult to 'fix' this after a certain point, even through therapy, because these people simply aren't capable of feeling compassion or taking genuine responsibility for their actions.

Op, there is a lot of really good advice on here. But please ignore the more extreme suggestions - like the poster saying that you should pour a plate of food over your son’s head. Seriously?? Bullying is awful, but you have to approach the punishment in a considered and controlled way. Talk to him and educate him on the consequences of bullying. That works better than repeating his bullying behaviour yourself.

As above prayers have said, if my child was being bullied how you describe, I would be contacting the police. I would mention that to your son, and make it clear that the bullied kids parents would absolutely be in the right and not over reacting to involve the police.

I was bullied at school and it led to lifelong mental health issues, including suicide attempts. And looking back, the bullying wasn't even particularly "bad", not much violence and no cyber bullying, so once I got home it was over. But it WAS stuff like your son's been doing - the name-calling, stuff thrown on me, by property being destroyed or thrown away.

Your son is still a child, so I won't go so far as to call him a monster (as much as I'd like to) but it is your responsibility to stamp out this behaviour now so that he doesn't grow to be one.

Sorry, haven’t RTFT but I don’t think it’s possible to punish the bully out of him (although he should undoubtedly suffer consequences of his actions)

He needs to develop empathy, which might take professional intervention but, more importantly I feel, he needs to break the cycle he seems stuck in.

Is moving schools an option? A friend had a (younger) DC who had slipped into the class bully role and couldn’t seem to get out of it. 3 years ago she moved her to a different school and, according to her Mum and parents of other children who know her, she’s a changed girl.

@flaviaritt

I strongly believe, in fact, that the consequence of proven and serious bullying should be loss of the culprit’s school place.

Interestingly, this is what happened to one of my bullies. She was expelled and had to go to another school. When in South Form the schools in the town had a consortium, and I ended up having classes with her. First time she saw me, she made a real and genuine apology, and we actually became friends. Not saying that the being expelled was the reason she was remorseful, but your comment did remind me of that.

Omg that is so cruel. That poor child. Please go full throttle at him it has to stop. And replace the blazer. I hope the child doesn't harm themself in any way during the weekend. Can you not find out who the parents are? Imagine being 13 and that happening and knowing you have to face the bullies Monday morning. Poor poor child.

I think you and school need to agree a robust, joint approach. His behaviour being off makes me think it will take work and consistency to change him.

Problem with coming down like a ton of brick verbally will mean he is even less likely to tell you anything which indicates why he is doing this.

However, as of right now, he needs his phone and other unsupervised internet access removed and he need to find a way to pay for a new blazer. Then anything else you agree with the school.

And yes, find a way to contact the other child’s parents ASAP!

Agree about the police matter. My 12 year old got bullied I reported it as he was attacked and the kid got a formal warning on his record. I hope the other parent reports your son OP the police speaking to him might make him see he cannot torture other people.

Please take his phone away, make him do regular chores, pay for the other child’s blazer, make him write a letter of apology and request a meeting with your son’s achievement leader/head of year at the very least. Ground him completely - he shouldn’t be mixing with other children outside school during lockdown, anyway, but make sure that you enforce this strictly for at least the next four weeks.

If he has no empathy and little regard to the consequences if they are the removal of "things" I would get angry (not shouty) and stay angry. The conversation goes along the lines of you did this act and that is unacceptable because XY or Z. I cannot like a person who does that and feels that is acceptable. Until that changes I am going to remain disappointed in you. Then walk away.

Obviously that won't work if you have a fragile relationship.

It is hard when kids bump against your boundaries, but even harder when they take a running jump over them. Well done for recognising that you have to act and aren't just ignoring that there is an issue.

What does this mean? So a child who is bullied say for being poor, fat, disabled, spotty or whatever has a low tolerance to power and control?! What?!

It's about taking shame and humiliation out of it. It's about supporting the child to develop their resources in their way to manage the situation - high self-esteem, humour, calling out by-standers etc.

OP you say this isn’t the first time and he’s been caught before bullying via WhatsApp.

This makes it all the more serious. You only know what he’s written about. He may have done other things and not written about them.

Unfortunately your efforts haven’t worked before. The problem with following up at the school can just make it worse for the other child in different ways if your son isn’t sincere about changing his behaviour.

It doesn’t sound like your son is in a healthy social situation. Maybe a different school with parallel efforts to increase his empathy might help him make a fresh start.

I would discuss with him moving to another school for his own sake and for the sake of the other child and anyone else he is damaging. If he’s the ringleader, he’s setting the tone for others.

Your son is the one who should be removed from the toxic environment he’s creating. Or at the very least he needs to understand this will be the outcome if he genuinely doesn’t get his act together.

Jeez some of these comments directed towards the op are themselves completely lacking in empathy. Bullying behaviour makes me see red having been badly bullied myself at school and having had 2 DC who were both bullied.
But some sympathy for the op who is struggling with this and not minimising it as other parents would do, wouldn't go amiss 🙄

No child is going to have high self esteem and be able to use humour after having been bullied for aspects of their appearance that they cannot control.