To think that all the idiots have brought us back to total lockdown ?

[updownroundandround]

So frustrated with all the people, from the ineffective and blustering MP to the idiots out trick or treating tonight............

When will people learn that a bloody pandemic cannot be ignored and that insisting on personal freedoms/ personal preferences is NOT going to shorten the lock downs or save the vulnerable ?

I can't stand people who sit there finger pointing. Subtext is oh you're all so awful, not like wonderful saintly meeeee!!!
Its a virus, they spread.

@DianaT1969

I hate these nasty blame threads. Started by small people who don't understand the basics of a virus. They don't appreciate all the hard-working people who have been facing Covid daily since March. I imagine the people who write these are curtain twitchers who don't work and contribute very little to society.

I agree Diana

For fucks sake can people stop going on about stopping it! No you can’t stop it, but many, many people could have worked harder to control it so we don’t end up back in this situation. That includes the government and individuals!!!

In direct response to the OP the answer is NEVER. We will never learn.
From the very start of this dreadful disease up until now we have been unwilling and unable to do what has been asked properly.
Back in March so many mumsnetters were asking "why can't I just break this or that rule? It makes no difference". I got a heap of flack for suggesting we find it in ourselves to work together to beat this thing 🙄

Same thing with neighbours I see flouting the rules, people out and about wearing masks ridiculously, Facebook posts about friends meeting up and not bothering to socially distance with proud pictoral evidence displayed 😡 With some people I know there is literally no difference with how they're living now compared to pre-covid times. Makes my blood boil.
No wonder we're in the mess we're in now. It just surprises me that anyone is surprised 🙄🤔

Oh piss off @DianaT1969 catch it going to work or from your child who caught it in daycare - unavoidable, catch it from having a catch up with friends indoors for hours, then spreading it to half your office - definitely to blame, and totally flaming avoidable.

@Chuggington2

You can ‘catch’ most of those things though *@epcot15* and sadly people live a long horrible time with lots of them and they don’t fill up intensive care beds. For weeks on end at the same time and they also don’t make massive swathes of the medical profession ill, thus further diminishing an overstretched workforce. The graph tells you nothing as this isn’t about preventing deaths. It’s about keeping the NHS functioning.

So because you can't catch any of the other top causes of deaths, they don't matter is that what you're saying? The fact of the matter is covid is a mild illness to more than 80% of people and more than 99% of people will survive it..Chris Whitty has already stated these facts. And if your think the NHS is all of a sudden overwhelmed have a quick google and you'll see that they never cope during winter, shortage of beds etc. Info is out there. Lastly those top causes of deaths will far outstrip covid due to thousands of people missing treatment this year.

@epcot15 it's not the same as winter pressures but it is compounded by it and the staff shortages caused by the politics of the past decade. Hospitals are already struggling, it's not beds that are the problem (if that was the case the nightingales would have been a good solution) but staffed beds.
Outbreaks not only hit patient numbers but staff. DHs department is down 15 clinical staff members atm which means there are not enough staff to keep the service going as normal, luckily it's a big acute department so there is just about enough staff to keep it going for emergencies but that requires staff to volunteer for additional shifts. They also have full icu/cc beds due to CV so when they get seriously ill patients in their specialty (it's a regional centre so they get quite a few of these anyway) they now have nowhere for them to go to receive the right care. Yes they have winter pressures but it doesn't usually hit so early or so acutely, there is usually some wiggle room. There is no wiggle room now.

Staff are also exhausted they have had an exceptionally busy and tragic year and they see no let up for the foreseeable - it's not only physically but emotionally wearing.

@epcot15 DH is a consultant health planner ....can go look in his laptop ta, no need for google. You don’t know what you’re talking about - sorry. He says if you’ve got half an hour later he’ll take you through it on PM? And you’re in Scotland are you not? Nope NHS not overwhelmed there, Yorkshire, Manchester, yep. All none urgent surgery cancelled at Pinderfields and MRI...urgent surgery next. Pinderfields is the major trauma centre for Yorkshire, scary prospects if you have a car accident here in the cominn weeks.

They never cope in winter no, but the predictions when you add in Covid are off the scale!

And don’t be silly you know I wasn’t saying they don’t matter.

@wonkylegs sums it up perfectly in terms of the NHS.

No one wants a lockdown

Even if you reason it’s what is needed it’s not through wanting it

I work in MH. We have 24 staff and 5 are off at the moment And we have no where near peaked. One is ill the others self isolating because a family member has tested positive And are showing no symptoms at all and are absolutely fine

Never have we had to deal with this issue before. No one has had to stay off work before their partner has had a cough 5 days ago

The NHS is stretched during the winter but these circumstances are completely different

[quote wonkylegs]@epcot15 it's not the same as winter pressures but it is compounded by it and the staff shortages caused by the politics of the past decade. Hospitals are already struggling, it's not beds that are the problem (if that was the case the nightingales would have been a good solution) but staffed beds.
Outbreaks not only hit patient numbers but staff. DHs department is down 15 clinical staff members atm which means there are not enough staff to keep the service going as normal, luckily it's a big acute department so there is just about enough staff to keep it going for emergencies but that requires staff to volunteer for additional shifts. They also have full icu/cc beds due to CV so when they get seriously ill patients in their specialty (it's a regional centre so they get quite a few of these anyway) they now have nowhere for them to go to receive the right care. Yes they have winter pressures but it doesn't usually hit so early or so acutely, there is usually some wiggle room. There is no wiggle room now. [/quote]
I understand they don't have the staffing and obviously the staff are doing the best they can but what happened to we'll bring back people from recent retirement etc. That didn't seem to materialise. Why then did they even build the Nightingales when they knew they couldn't staff them, would the money not have been better used for the nhs directly?
I suppose the fact of the matter is that we can't keep going in and out of lockdown the repercussions in years to come will be catastrophic.

Well done for swallowing government propaganda...they deflected the blame on 'the people' to cover their mishandling of the pandemic.

You only have to look at the fact that the countries who had must stricter lockdowns also have a second wave to realise it goes beyond a few idiots not wearing masks.

Virus spreads. It is naive to think we have any real way to control/eradicate covid-19.

@bubblesforlife

While the guidance is not exactly clear, the message remains the same. Keep your distance Wash your hands Wear your masks (unless you have a medical reason not to)

I live in London and to be frank, people disgust me. Carrying masks in their hands, wearing them under their chin, not wearing them and not social distancing, in shops.
People coughing into their hands.
People standing in qs for stores on their phones with their mask down under their chin as not to impact their phone calls.
Crowds of people Qing for bars.
Socialising.

A report on BBC news wound me up no end. This man who was bragging that we drove to derby to place his bets and have a pint because his town was in tier 3. He was so proud that he was able to what he felt outsmart the system. Fuck him and everyone else. Selfish bastards! Give yourself Covid, that’s your problem but don’t pass it onto others. We don’t want your disgusting germs.

I’m furious we are back here again. It’s not the governments faults. It’s the general public.
Boris is a joke, but he can’t wash your hands for you. It’s up to you!!!

Same here in Yorkshire.

Whenever we've been to a retail park to collect something, I've lost count of the number of people wearing their masks below their nose, on their chin, or not at all.

Know many people traveling to tier 3 regions, going out to bars, putting photos up on fb of them all hugging and posing together, then coming back home etc. No wonder it's spreading like wildfire.

As much as the gov is to blame, the general public aren't innocent at all.

@Requinblanc It's so much easier to point the figure then to accept we have no control whatsoever over the virus. The sooner others accept this the better then hopefully all the judgemental shaming will end.

@requinblanc since when are all of the people in the U.K. law abiding citizens?
Countries that have stricter lockdowns, tend to have more compliance to laws and rules. The U.K. (I’m not from here but comparatively speaking from my home country) is hit and miss.
So when were the general population ever going to abide by the rules? They take it into their own hands.
I see people all the time wreaking havoc and not being afraid afraid of the police, they seem to find folly when the police show up. It’s as though they know better, and are above the law.
This lockdown has made me completely rethink living here long term. I find it unbearable on the streets of London, what I see happening outside my window are more often than not, not law abiding citizens.

Some are and they are the people I feel sorry for here.

So stop blaming the government for people’s ignorance and selfishness.

People were very compliant first time round. Now many see the lockdown as pointless and damaging. The British are pretty good at giving the finger to officialdom.

YABU, and hysterical.

And technically, its not a pandemic, because the percentage of people who die from it is far too tiny, and because the risk of imminent death to society as a whole isn't there.

Its a virus. Viruses spread. Historically, humanity's best and most effective way of dealing with viruses is to keep healthy immune systems.

It would take just one person however many months from now with Covid - 19 to untracked and untraced to start up this whole epidemic again. Just one. Its unsustainable to work towards eradicating this virus. Lockdowns are arguably making it worse, by lengthening its course and not allowing it to spread and become less strong by doing so.

@epcot15 they did bring some staff back from retirement however many were already covering gaps in rotas on an ad hoc basis anyway so hadn't really dropped off staffing numbers , they are in a higher risk group as they are older and staff didn't want to come back (exhausted, ill health, no incentive and crappy conditions) has meant that this isn't the solution that the government promised it would be.
Drs also can't just cover any specialism that has a shortage. DH can in theory deliver a baby but he hasn't done it for over 20yrs and if anything went wrong he wouldn't be best placed to do the right thing. Obstetrics in his hospital is in crisis as they have had an outbreak and there is a real lack of obstetricians to plug the gap.
The government are still playing politics with numbers - the increase in dr numbers that they have been quoting recently is only an increase as they are now counting medical students as drs - they aren't drs and they cannot do the things needed to plug all the gaps.
We've been running departments on minimal numbers for years and that just about bumbles along in normal years however CV19 has put pressure on in a way that we just don't have enough slack in the system to cope with. When you are running at 100% there is no magic wand to conjure up the trained staff that is needed to run the services when more space is needed. CV is filling up critical wards in a way that isn't usually seen, and it's a slow illness, so you can't treat and turf, plus it's affecting frontline staff in a greater proportion than the general public so they are being hit from all sides.
Measures aren't to stop infection but to lessen its effect because otherwise it has a knock on effect on everything else, which as we have seen don't just stop. It's then you have to take tough decisions on who is worth more to save - and that's something nobody in healthcare wants to do if they can help it.

The government were advised to have a quick two week circuit break six weeks ago by SAGE. They chose to ignore the experts and introduced the shitty tier system instead. The tier system which literally just meant people in the highest tier couldn’t go to the pub (unless it sold food because covid doesn’t affect people when they’re eating chips with their beer). So yeah, it has been caused by the idiots- the government.

@PostItJoyWeek

People were very compliant first time round. Now many see the lockdown as pointless and damaging. The British are pretty good at giving the finger to officialdom.

If anything back in March and April people were doing more than the law required of them. The fallacy about one hour of exercise a day, for example. That was never true anywhere except Wales but so many people thought it was and observed it.

Yabu not to use the word "covidiots" in the thread title. But with a little more effort you'll need writing Daily-Express rants before you know it

It's not rocket science. Lots of people feel that the overall effect on everyone (mental health, rapidly increasing suicide rate, neglect of childrens education, economic disaster) outweighs the perhaps accelerated deaths of the vulnerable (particularly given the average age at death of a Covid victim is 82, higher than uk life expectancy). I'm not saying this is right, but we cannot protect a minority at the expense of the majority forever. I think many people would rather see targeted protection for vulnerable than sweeping measures.

@IncandescentSilver

Pandemic: adjective
(of a disease) prevalent over a whole country or the world.

Erm..............what did you think the word pandemic meant exactly ?