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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

If you WFH what time should you start work?

515 replies

EatPrayYoga · 29/10/2020 10:16

If official hours are 9-5, is it a problem if you are not logged on by 9 every day?

I'm a team manager and one person on the team consistently logs on after 9 am. I know because our system shows a green or other colour next to everyone's names in an email so if I email the team I can see who is online and who isn't.

I usually send an email in a morning to confirm any things to be aware of for that day including who is not working that day and who is covering their work.

He usually logs on at about 9.05 but I'm not sure whether to mention this as he is only slightly late. He is in a junior role but wants to progress. There are other people in the same role who start work earlier than 9 to get things done so he stands out as doing less though I can't say who does more or less work in a day as their work is delegated by different members of the team.

I also realise we are in difficult times. He lives with parents and has no children or pets but I believe there are other adult siblings do not sure how easy or difficult the WFH circumstances are.

IABU to be unimpressed?

OP posts:
Storyoftonight · 30/10/2020 20:44

If you expect them to be ready to work at 9 let's say his laptop takes 5 mins to fully load then each day that is 5 minutes he's not being paid for that technically he is working. So it goes both ways.

Storyoftonight · 30/10/2020 20:46

@EatPrayYoga

His work otherwise is lacking and there is a general impression of not putting in enough effort or missing deadlines. If I ask for something by a certain time it is often late. There are often basic mistakes.

He is often late to meetings or forgets we have them. I have to say "are you coming to the meeting?"

It's not just the log on time but maybe I should put that aside and focus on the other things that are an issue.

He is behind on work so there is a problem and at least one other person doing the same role gets more done and in a shower yet time and he is no exceptional.

Bit of a dripfeed OP.

I'm these circumstances YANBU.

iMatter · 30/10/2020 20:49

The problem you have here OP is you're getting opinions from posters who have never worked in the same environment as you're discussing. It's about as far away from 9 - 5 as it's possible to be but obviously with big financial rewards.

Take what's useful from the thread and ignore the rest.

Curlycupid · 30/10/2020 20:53

I'm a manager of a small, specialised and diverse team. Since we've been working from home we've kind of settled into preferred working patterns - so I have someone who's online at 6am, then has a few hours break in the afternoon and finishes up later, I have someone who logs in around 10 and works later, I have someone who does more or less the 9 - 5 and I have someone where it depends on what's needed for his care of his 2 dc's. Given all this and the fact that it's impossible to track time, we've moved onto a delivery based assessment - as long as they get their job done, I don't particularly care when they do it. If they do extra then that's noted come assessment time, if they're struggling because something turned out to be more complicated, or timing doesn't work they tell me and we work it out. I have 1-2-1's weekly, which I originally thought might be a bit much (I would have done once a month if we were in the office) but actually have worked out well, plus team meetings every other week. I would totally know if someone wasn't pulling their weight regardless of time spent at screen, and I am also aware of the stresses and other issues that they face and will take that into account. So as a team of professionals I wouldn't care if someone starts at 9.05, but I would care if he wasn't performing and would want to understand why.

Macaroni46 · 30/10/2020 20:59

I think they're taking the piss and should be pulled up on it. It's 5 mins every day - not just a one off. They're expected to start work at 9 so that's when they should be ready. It's not like they're stuck in traffic on the way in ffs!

Original poster
EatPrayYoga · 30/10/2020 21:09

I agree iMatter

OP posts:
rachtimm · 30/10/2020 21:46

People are working from home during global pandemic give the guy a break. Instead of watching when people log on everyday why don't you have a coffee and lighten up!!

Macaroni46 · 30/10/2020 21:51

@rachtimm if they're working from home why the f'ck are they late logging on every day? Not like they've got a long commute!
I can't be late in my job as young children can't be left unattended. I start a lot earlier than 9am, including a commute, but somehow manage to get my arse to work in time Nor can I WFH. Loads of unpaid overtime too. So no, I'm not about to feel lenient towards someone who has the luxury of a) WFH and b) not starting til 9am.
OP I'd be having words ...

Macaroni46 · 30/10/2020 21:53

As for a coffee break, that's a laugh!

Lovely13 · 30/10/2020 22:14

I am so glad I did my mainly functioning working life when I did. Five minutes late is now an offence? If what we got up to was being scrutinised, we’d all have been sacked! Yet all was profitable and successful...

lawandgin · 30/10/2020 22:37

@EatPrayYoga you may not have said he should be grateful for a training contract, but that is the distinct impression I get from your posts. It's not as much of q criticism as it probably sounds. IMHO there is no price worth giving over your entire life or soul for. That said, the hours/work you are expecting don't sound entirely unreasonable. Just perhaps don't expect it from everyone and he shouldn't be disappointed when he isn't selected. In the same way I wasn't when I chose to leave a magic circle firm, because it didn't suit me. I find all too often in this industry everyone is too quick to apply their own expectations to everyone else and are disappointed when that individual doesn't live up to their own (often ridiculous - not saying you are, just my experience) expectations.

bossybloss · 30/10/2020 23:37

Micromanaging at its best .....or worst!

Vinomummyinlockdown · 30/10/2020 23:56

9.05?!?! Come on man. My god. Get some real issues. I really do wonder about these posts at times.

Mummadeeze · 30/10/2020 23:59

I would start to get frustrated if someone wasn’t logged on and contactable by 9.15am. Five past seems OTT to be getting wound up over. We often have to work a bit late or take shorter lunch breaks with no complaints or compensation so I think it all works itself out.

Suzi888 · 31/10/2020 00:04

@sirfredfredgeorge

There are other people in the same role who start work earlier than 9 to get things done so he stands out as doing less

These are the people you need to be concerned with as a manager, can they not do their job in the time available? Do they need extra support? Do they need extra training? Do they need help switching off from work (important to the business 'cos these are the people who crash out of the job leaving you completely stranded)

^^ this! We have a policy whereby we will watch those that cannot complete tasks during the allotted time. How do you measure performance? or do you just look at start and finish times.
ZoeTurtle · 31/10/2020 00:10

WHY do companies promote people to line managers when they don't have a clue how to manage others? It's the same everywhere I've worked - people are promoted on job performance and nobody ever asks if they're actually suitable to be line managing.

I got myself put on training courses, OP. Sounds like you need to do the same.

ClareBlue · 31/10/2020 00:26

@EatPrayYoga

His work otherwise is lacking and there is a general impression of not putting in enough effort or missing deadlines. If I ask for something by a certain time it is often late. There are often basic mistakes.

He is often late to meetings or forgets we have them. I have to say "are you coming to the meeting?"

It's not just the log on time but maybe I should put that aside and focus on the other things that are an issue.

He is behind on work so there is a problem and at least one other person doing the same role gets more done and in a shower yet time and he is no exceptional.

These are much more significant issues. Are you just focusing on the late login because it is easy to prove and be specific about. What you state here are serious performance concerns that are not going to be sorted by logging in on time.

I think you need a full assessment meeting at some stage. Ignore people saying you are being pedantic, you are doing your job.

EBearhug · 31/10/2020 00:31

I would start to get frustrated if someone wasn’t logged on and contactable by 9.15am.
It's down to organisational culture and expectations - some places this would be an issue, others it wouldn't, and in that sense, what anyone else says is irrelevant, as long as expectations are within the law. The thing is to communicate, so people are clear on those expectations in the place where they currently work - and if people want to change the expectations, that's also down to communication. Starting exactly at 9am might be difficult for someone who drops their young children off at school, but a manager is more likely to accommodate that if they know about it and can negotiate than if it just happens.

Gennz18 · 31/10/2020 00:44

As a lawyer myself this pettifogging micro-management over 5 minutes is ridiculous. YABU.

I get into work anywhere between 9-9.30 depending on traffic & the school run but am contactable 24/7 and routinely field calls/emails later in the evening and on weekends. If my manager had a word about my log in time on my laptop I would be extremely unimpressed.

Good in this guy for setting boundaries around his work/life balance, especially given your firm has been stringing him along as a paralegal for 3 years and seem to expect him to daily donate hours of his life to the v well paid partners.

August1980 · 31/10/2020 05:31

OP you are a micromanager! I work for a global company for a super senior person too. We have similar set up in terms of security and VPN - takes ages to start up and Teams/Skype both indicate when people are off/online but we don’t micromanage anyone. People need to do be responsible and accountable. All the old fashioned managers were walked out the system. We are encouraged to work flexible around a schedule that suits us around dog walking and school runs etc. In terms of urgency Nd deadlines - people are accountable. 5 min isn’t a big deal to me! Hubby runs a small business - he too has staff over the world, doesn’t seem to care when they login and log off provided he gets what he needs and everyone is pulling their weight (mindful of course of the different time zones). Stop being petty.

LemonDrizzles · 31/10/2020 05:41

So he's a trainee and the role has a desirable future, he's in competition with one other. If you are hungry for something, you make every best effort to always put your best forward in each situation. Sounds like this logging in at 9:05, to you, is indicative of some wider overall lack of him putting his all in? I myself do not log in that early at all. Ever. But then again, I've taking multiple calls at before 7am (this week and last!) and, before maternity leave, had to work at 9pm multiple times "get the job done."

I voted that you are being unreasonable because I think one can very much "get the job done" and start at 9:05. If there are other areas he could improve "pulling his weight", i suggest focus on those as bringing up not starting at 9:00 instead of 9:05 could sound petty unless you work in a call centre that has to be "manned" by a certain number at 9:00.

garlictwist · 31/10/2020 06:13

It's only five minutes. I don't think it's a big deal.

Pertella · 31/10/2020 08:27

So OP, when are you going to do what you are paid to do and start managing your staff Wink

serialreturner · 31/10/2020 08:29

Jesus Wept.

Micromanaging or what?

I'd hate to work for you.

Thisismylife1 · 31/10/2020 08:31

I think this says more about your management/perception than anything.

If you focus on starting 5 minutes late you just look petty and like a micro manager. If there are wider performance management issues, focus on those. Your management and judgment seem wanting here tbh. 5 mins is nothing!

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