Family Christmas conundrum

[UnaCorda]

For context, my brother is married (happily, as far as I can tell) and has five children. I am single, childless and live on my own.

My parents live a long way away from me and from my brother, and there is not enough room for us all to stay there at the same time. Consequently we usually spend Christmas with them on alternate years and I tend to go away when it is not "my year".

I have recently discovered from my mother that my brother is arguing that, regardless of the fact I have very little opportunity to socialise with anyone at all at the moment (I'm in a Tier 2 area), he and his family should nevertheless spend christmas with my parents if this is allowed. Basically he is lobbying for me to spend Christmas on my own, despite having his own family to spend it with.

AIBU to feel both hurt and angry about this, regardless of the fact that it is officially their "turn"? We've never had a great relationship, although we get on okay most of the time as adults, and this just makes me want to have nothing to do with him. I think it's very selfish and pretty cruel. I also think it's unfair for my parents to be stuck in the middle.

For clarity, this isn't about whether or not it is likely to be possible to visit relatives at Christmas, it's about my brother's meanness - or whether I'm being unreasonable to think he should sacrifice (or defer) his turn to be with my parents, given the current circumstances.

All the people who are saying OP is being unreasonable, how would you feel in her position?

I’d own it. And recognise that it was my choice and not my brother that was making me be at home alone.

Your brother is being an arse. FWIW if I was in your mum's position I would just inform him that they are spending Christmas with you so you don't have to be alone, and he'd have to lump it.

[quote OchonAgusOchonO]**@Cadent* - Can you not see that it may be easier for OP to manage her feelings around one sibling who has one older child rather than a brother who is a ‘selfish dick’ and his wife who tries to be ‘Mother Earth’ with five children?*

How do you know the sister's child is older?

It seems to me that she doesn't like her brother and his wife so is less willing to make an effort. Referring to her sil as playing Mother Earth is hugely insulting. I assume that simply means she is a hands on mother who does a lot with/for her children.

Can you really not see how it would be hurtful to see your sister being happy to be around your dn but not willing to be around your dc?[/quote]
I thought I read it but you’re right OP doesn’t say the DN is older. However I’m guessing there are a few younger kids in the mix in DB family as there are 5 of them.

Why is Mother Earth insulting? I thought OP just meant SIL does performance parenting?

In the case of infertility the infertile person should not be made responsible for her siblings’ feelings by forcing her to spend time with their children.

But after all, embracing being on one’s own at Christmas is the Great Leap Forward.
I know Christmas is symbolic but it’s a great relief to jump off the treadmill and be on your own.
Enjoy your family when there is less pressure.

In the case of infertility the infertile person should not be made responsible for her siblings’ feelings by forcing her to spend time with their children.

WTF so the brother can't take his kids to their nans at Christmas because it might hurt OPs feelings?

Luckily most infertile people aren't this astonishingly selfish.

The person responsible for their feelings, is the person themselves. You can't force feelings on to someone.

But if the op chooses not to spend time with her brother and his family she’s perfectly free to choose to do that. What she can’t do is then complain and twist and present the whole thing in an inaccurate way.

@Hercwasonaroll

In the case of infertility the infertile person should not be made responsible for her siblings’ feelings by forcing her to spend time with their children.

WTF so the brother can't take his kids to their nans at Christmas because it might hurt OPs feelings?

Luckily most infertile people aren't this astonishingly selfish.

The person responsible for their feelings, is the person themselves. You can't force feelings on to someone.

Why are you misrepresent what I said? What you quoted was in response to below:

Can you really not see how it would be hurtful to see your sister being happy to be around your dn but not willing to be around your dc?

Don’t make stuff up, it’s a really cheap shot.

Are you messing?? you sound like such a martyr no one is telling you not to go for Xmas. But for some reason you don’t want your brother to come.

You stay in your sisters your brother in your mums and everyone has a nice Christmas and if you don’t want to go you can still go away there are Holliday destinations still open 🙄🙄

But it’s one day, albeit symbolic, why all the fuss?
I speak from the lofty perspective of middle age 😊

@Cadent - Why is Mother Earth insulting? I thought OP just meant SIL does performance parenting?

It's usually used in a derogatory way to describe women who do baking, arts and crafts, nature type activities etc with their children. I've never heard it used to describe performance parenting.

In the case of infertility the infertile person should not be made responsible for her siblings’ feelings by forcing her to spend time with their children.

Maybe not but equally the rest of the family should not be expected to organise their lives so she never encounters their children, particularly when she has no problem with other children in the family.

In the case of infertility the infertile person should not be made responsible for her siblings’ feelings by forcing her to spend time with their children.

No-one is doing that.

No-one is forcing her to be with her nieces and nephews. But equally no-one is forcing her to spend Christmas alone.

While I can have compassion for her infertility, I can't see how she can force (or even expect) her brother to give up his and his family's Christmas with his parents, because she can't face his family life.

@Cadent No one is forcing the OP to be with the kids. The OP is choosing not to go.

Your brother can't legally go as it exceeds the rule of 6 so you may as well

People are taking my quote out of context. It was in response to a comment from Ochon. I didn’t say anyone is forcing OP!

@OchonAgusOchonO with regards to Mother Earth, if that is what it means then I agree it’s offensive, nothing wrong with doing any of those activities. I took it to mean performance parenting without looking it up.

Do we know what country the Op lives in?

OK cadent. I'm struggling to read what you said in a different way even with the context of the reply your quote was referring to. Apologies for taking it the wrong way.

Not sure either OP or her brother deserve to be criticised or why the brother is being called an arsehole or a dick. Neither are actually in the wrong, I don’t think. We tend to see things from own perspective, no matter how much we like to think we do otherwise. It’s the brother’s “turn” so that’s his argument. But OP, I can see that god this year with everything that’s gone on, all bets are off. I don’t think there’s an answer as such Other than for perhaps your DB And his family to have maybe Christmas Eve and Christmas Day with your parents and then for you to go on Boxing Day, and they leave before your arrival. I know it’s not ideal because it’s not Christmas Day, but it would mean you have something to look forward to and enjoy.

@Cadent

People are taking my quote out of context. It was in response to a comment from Ochon. I didn’t say anyone is forcing OP!

@OchonAgusOchonO with regards to Mother Earth, if that is what it means then I agree it’s offensive, nothing wrong with doing any of those activities. I took it to mean performance parenting without looking it up.

That's the only way I've ever heard it used.

Can you not see that it may be easier for OP to manage her feelings around one sibling who has one older child rather than a brother who is a ‘selfish dick’ and his wife who tries to be ‘Mother Earth’ with five children?

Yes, this pretty much sums it up. And much as they love their grandchildren, both my parents think that my SIL massively over-eggs the perfect mummy routine.

Christmas Day is primarily for children. And even they cope if they get presents a bit earlier or later if they understand snd why.
The Christmas period is a general free for all. Just see them at some other point over the festivities if seeing them and having a big meal is important.

Yes, this pretty much sums it up. And much as they love their grandchildren, both my parents think that my SIL massively over-eggs the perfect mummy routine.

It sounds like your dil can't win. She's too good a mother? What a terrible failing to have.

It sounds like none of you like her.

So you don’t like your brother, you definitely don’t like his wife. And you don’t want to spend Christmas Day with them.

That’s your perfectly valid choice but you cannot simultaneously pretend that you are being excluded when it’s your choice.

You all really hate your SIL don’t you.

I feel sorry for her.

So you don’t like your brother, you definitely don’t like his wife. And you don’t want to spend Christmas Day with them.

That’s your perfectly valid choice but you cannot simultaneously pretend that you are being excluded when it’s your choice.

This.

DinosaurGrrrrr

You sound like my brother and sister in law, they couldn't have kids and took 2 years to get over the fact we have them (they refused to actually see them for a time, it was "too hard"). I think you need to sort your issues rather than spoil others Christmas. If it was my parents they'd prefer a Christmas with our children over a Christmas with my brother and his wife, as much as my brother is golden child they love Christmas with our kids. My brother has Xmas dinner with his wife and comes over in the evening and we all spend the evening together. They accept our kids now though and have finally embraced their Aunty and uncle role. It hurt a lot to be on the receiving end of their selfish behaviour though, we just pretend it didn't happen now.

This is the most horrible reply I have ever read on mumsnet. I am unsure as to which adjectives to use. I realise you may not understand the emotions associated with infertility, but to be so selfish, so unkind, so self centred, just completely heartless. If your brother and sister in law took "two years to get over the fact" then they are amazing and should be congratulated. However I suspect that they may have just got better at hiding it. During my 11 years of infertility I could not have spent Christmas with children if someone had put a gun to my head. Yes, maybe it was selfishness on my part but the pain behind that was suffocating.

OP, there was so much I wanted to reply to you. This year has been so awful I guess we are looking towards Christmas with even more anticipation than usual, everything means so much more. And with different restrictions and who knows how different things could be by December, that nothing can be written in stone. One thing I have learnt this year is most of us are struggling through in the best way we can, but all of us will have different priorities. In our household we have been shielding completely since March to protect my husband. Others would make different decisions and think us strange, but that's ok. I do understand your point of view because I have been there. Equally I understand your brother may want to spend Christmas with your parents after a year of enforced separation from his children. I can see why your brother may be being selfish, on the other hand it is possible he is just putting his children first. Your mum must be so conflicted because there us nothing in the world more special than seeing grandchildren at Christmas, yet obviously she knows the pain it would bring you to witness than too. I hope so much you find a way through so that everyone manages a nice time, but my heart knows the pain you are going through.