People not understanding what no deal actually means?

[flashbac]

Do you understand what it means? For food prices, crime enforcement, things that affect you?
Think we can just trade with the rest of the world come January? Easy as that? Do WTO rules ring a bell? Pound crashing?
Or do you think sunlit uplands await you?

The thing with the fishing stuff , is that nobody really cares in the UK, unless they stick some bunting on a plucky boat in a nationalistic photoshoot shizzazle, it is such a teeny tiny part of the UK economy now. It is a useful 'Britannia rules the waves' trope to be dragged out at opportune moments, nothing more. I cannot see things getting better for the UK fishing fleet, which is a shame because its a tough old job and they deserve a break as much as anyone.

@derxa glad to hear you did OK at the sales

Barnier has been trying to get the fishing nations to compromise, also some other issues that I forget now

That is not Barnier's role. He has a mandate from 27 countries which tells him what he can and cannot negotiate. He can take the UK's response back to the heads of the EU countries - such as 'the UK would like X, Y or Z' - but it is not his role to persuade anyone to compromise.

Derxa
I know you did not vote for Brexit.
And I'm glad that your lamb sales went well.
I am genuinely sad that the leaders of UK farming groups have not stood up for people like you.
And being somebody who actively buys UK meat I hope that you and your ilk get some decent supporters against the might of the US "farmers"
Any meat eater like me who bashes UK farmers is an eejit IMHO

ODFOD to the Brexit site. Soo tired of all the scaremongering. We have enough of it already with Covid

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_

Just in case it's beyond your wit to find it

ODFOD to the Brexit site. Soo tired of all the scaremongering. We have enough of it already with Covid
www.gov.uk/transition
What scare mongering ?

Big red font
time is running out

and that is the main UK Government page .....

@ListeningQuietly

Derxa I know you did not vote for Brexit. And I'm glad that your lamb sales went well. I am genuinely sad that the leaders of UK farming groups have not stood up for people like you. And being somebody who actively buys UK meat I hope that you and your ilk get some decent supporters against the might of the US "farmers" Any meat eater like me who bashes UK farmers is an eejit IMHO

Minette Batters the NFU chief has been in talks with Boris only this week and she had an article in the Mail on Sunday www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-8851229/MINETTE-BATTERS-National-Farmers-Union-wants-support.html However there's not much she can do about the Tory majority. Sorry I was a bit arsy LQ You know what I'm like

@Havanananana

Barnier has been trying to get the fishing nations to compromise, also some other issues that I forget now

That is not Barnier's role. He has a mandate from 27 countries which tells him what he can and cannot negotiate. He can take the UK's response back to the heads of the EU countries - such as 'the UK would like X, Y or Z' - but it is not his role to persuade anyone to compromise.

You'd better tell him that then, because this is what he said today:

Nous chercherons les compromis nécessaires, de chaque côté, pour avoir un accord jusqu'au dernier jour utile.

Here's his statement to the Europian parliament ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/speech_20_1962

We will seek the necessary compromises, on each side, to have an agreement until the last useful day

I still do not see this as a 'fundamental' shift , at the end of the day he is trying to reach an agreement between two parties involved ?

Apply some common sense here.

The US wants to sell us lots of cheap low quality meat.
We say "I'll just not buy it, I'll only buy british meat!"

Do you seriously think the USA are stupid? They are well aware that given the choice we'll swerve it. They know we will be reluctant to eat their shitty produce and hence they are insisting that a condition will be that the UK consumer doesn't get the option to opt-out of US produce.

@SimonJT just the 1! You need to find yourself a few more 😂

I don't get threads like this. I voted remain, I did that when I had any say. I don't know what I gain by crying every night now??

OP do you have anything of any practicality to suggest?

[quote Havanananana]@LastTrainEast
So consider some French company that buys ..bolts from us. They still need the bolts and their government wants them to get them so that they don't go under

Great example.

The French company currently buys bolts from a UK supplier. They can place an order on Monday afternoon, and because their is no customs paperwork to complete, no border checks and a free flow of goods across the Channel and no tariff paperwork, the bolts can be delivered next day. Let's say that the pallet of bolts costs the UK supplier £500 to make and deliver, for which it charges £700, making a £200 profit.

After January 1st, the French company wants to buy more bolts and wants guaranteed next-day delivery. They phone the UK supplier.
The UK supplier now needs to register as an exporter, needs to complete a customs declaration (costing £75), pay someone in-house to do the paperwork (say £25 per shipment) that they didn't do before. Then they need to pay the logistics company, whose costs have also increased by £50 a pallet to cover additional paperwork and the cost of delays at the ports and the cost of the truck returning empty as they can no longer pick up goods in the EU. The additional costs are therefore £150. If the UK company charges the old price of £700 per pallet, they make £50 profit instead of £200.

It gets worse. The £700 per pallet price must now include tariffs. To keep the maths simple, lets say approx. 20% of the £650 - so approx.£130. If the UK supplier attempts to absorb the cost, they now make a loss of (£50 - £130) = £80 loss per consignment. The UK supplier is bankrupt in a matter of weeks.

If the UK supplier asks the French importer to absorb the cost, the bolts now cost the importer £700 + £140 = £840. The importer also has to complete the additional importing paperwork that was not needed before - which costs money - and due to delays at the ports there is no guarantee of delivery times.

The importer says thanks but no thanks, wishes the UK manufacturer 'bon chance' and buys his bolts from a supplier in Germany, Spain, Poland or anywhere else in the EU, with no customs paperwork, no tariffs and no delays. Even if he has to pay 10% more than before (£770 instead of £700) this is still far cheaper than the UK supplier's new price.[/quote]
I said it ‘in a nutshell’ waaaaay back - havananana sets it out very clearly here

@frumpety

We will seek the necessary compromises, on each side, to have an agreement until the last useful day

I still do not see this as a 'fundamental' shift , at the end of the day he is trying to reach an agreement between two parties involved ?

By asking the EU to compromise. Which, apparently, is not his remit

@amusedtodeath1

But it's not just trade is it?

We want to trade with the EU on the same terms, but they won't allow it. What we want is independance, but we can't have that AND have a trade deal. This is what the EU have decided because for one thing it discourages other countries from leaving and for another because they want to punish us for leaving.

What the fuck are you smoking??

@amusedtodeath1

It's basically blackmail "You can leave but we won't cooperate with you even though that would be in everyone's best interest because.....". ????

You're taking the piss now.

There is probably already a deal.

I think Sarahandco is probably right but there is more money to be made pretending there might not be up until the very last minute.

Does anybody else find themselves living in a time in which much, much more than before 2016 or so people come out with the fucking stupidest, dumbest shit (i.e we'l grow swedes) and you just cant even believe the amount of ignorance and lack of comprehension that goes into a statement like that and how are they even allowing themselves to say it out loud? it completely crushes the soul.

Farmers can whistle as far as im concerned. They lobied against the EU for decades.

ShirlleyPhallus how did you decide one explanation was 'impartial' and the other wasnt? just by which one you liked the sound of more?

"I don't get threads like this. I voted remain, I did that when I had any say. I don't know what I gain by crying every night now??

OP do you have anything of any practicality to suggest?"

I posted this on the back of a post where the poster asserted that we'd be ok with no deal because "we'll just get food from outside the EU". It's not the first time I've been flabbergasted by how little attention people are paying to something so huge. The issue needs to be raised.
Yes it is anxiety inducing but we shouldn't stick our fingers in our ears and pretend it's not happening. That's how this shit show are getting away with it.

And I think the post about being okay because we can swap swedes is an example of why there's a problem with the standard/lack of conversation/info on this topic. Swapping swedes FFS. You've got to laugh!

@flashbac

"I don't get threads like this. I voted remain, I did that when I had any say. I don't know what I gain by crying every night now??

OP do you have anything of any practicality to suggest?"

I posted this on the back of a post where the poster asserted that we'd be ok with no deal because "we'll just get food from outside the EU". It's not the first time I've been flabbergasted by how little attention people are paying to something so huge. The issue needs to be raised.
Yes it is anxiety inducing but we shouldn't stick our fingers in our ears and pretend it's not happening. That's how this shit show are getting away with it.

It is a shame that more than 4 years on, people are still as clueless as when the referendum kicked off. Someone mentioned upthread about scaremongering. They are going to be in for a nasty shock when reality kicks in.

@KooKooKachu it's easy to make derigatory comments, but harder to actually defend your opinion with a sensible response. I really don't care what you think tbh, I'm sitting here not panicking about something that a) might not even happen, b) if it does happen it is highly unlikely to be as bad as is being made out here.

I hope you find some peace