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AIBU?

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Original poster

If No-Deal, BJ has a moral imperative to resign.

159 replies

zefi · 19/10/2020 08:48

Do they honestly think the public won’t notice the not-so subtle shift in terminology to “Australian-Style Deal?” Clearly, the latest Cummings brainwave.

No - it’s “No-Deal.” As in - nothing and you have failed. You can put whatever spin on it you like, it won’t wash.

I did laugh yesterday when MG was rambling on about this “Australian-style Deal” and Andrew Marr asked why “Australian” as opposed to a “Mongolian-Style Deal” or an “Afghan” one?

Basically, we are likely to be out in less favourable terms than Canada.

Surely, this has to be the end if this government?

OP posts:
ItsAlwaysSunnyOnMN · 19/10/2020 14:55

Yes Thatcher she did make that claim

The time was during the height of the troubles. I don’t think her informing the public would have been a wise thing to do given thar tensions were so high (but it was certainly spun to gain votes)

As for Corbyn his involvement or rather non involvement was inconsequential, he had nothing to do with discussions.

As was his time as leader of the Labour party has been (inconsequential) - what a waste of four years

DynamoKev · 19/10/2020 14:58

@KenDodd

Oh, and I'd bet money that there isn't a single Leave/Tory voter on this thread complaining. Anyone? Any unhappy/regretful Leave/Tory voters...?
People who voted leave and/or Tory are banned on here - didn't you get the memo?
PardonMyFrancais · 19/10/2020 15:00

@MarinPrime the very thought of having that smug little shit as our PM makes my skin crawl.

He reminds me of a smarmy head boy.

I don't think he's as popular with the voters as he may have been at the beginning of this year, but our opinions don't really count for anything when it comes to in-party elections.

PardonMyFrancais · 19/10/2020 15:03

People who voted leave and/or Tory are banned on here - didn't you get the memo?

I actually wish there were more to have a decent debate with, but people get angry and rude too often and it usually descends into name-calling before any of us can get to the root of why they voted the way they did!

I do remember being on here a lot right after the Brexit vote and the few leavers who outed themselves mostly gave their reasons as something to do with not trusting the EU to have such control over our country/borders.

I'd much rather the EU controlled our country than the Tories!

ItsAlwaysSunnyOnMN · 19/10/2020 15:04

The referendum was sold to the public as being that a vote on staying or leaving the EU

there was no turning back and what sealed our fate was triggering article 50

People were duped into thinking there might be another referendum then a vote of how we leave it was never going to happen

And I don’t think the majority of the public care that much anymore a small fraction of passionate leavers and remainers other that that people are tired and bored of Brexit and just want it over with (as many have accepted it shall happen)

SerendipityJane · 19/10/2020 15:16

People were duped into thinking there might be another referendum then a vote of how we leave it was never going to happen

despite even that nice Mr. Rees-Mogg saying it was the most sensible solution.

DynamoKev · 19/10/2020 15:21

I'd much rather the EU controlled our country than the Tories!
So would I - but you have to recognise that might appear like the interference in our democracy cited as a reason to dislike the EU.
After all it's fine when it's going "your" way, not so much if it's out of line with people's wishes surely?

ItsAlwaysSunnyOnMN · 19/10/2020 16:21

He may have said that

Not sure he would have actually supported it

Do you take JRM as a man of his word

longwayoff · 19/10/2020 16:22

Away with unelected bureaucrats running the country. Cummings - that means you.

SerendipityJane · 19/10/2020 16:29

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

ItsAlwaysSunnyOnMN · 19/10/2020 17:16

What a surprise the oh leavers are stupid/thick is trotted out Hmm

I voted Remain

I hoped for a second referendum but realised we were being duped into believing that this would happen Yes I was duped along with millions of others why because this is what I wanted to believe and what I felt was best.

I have never ever thought leave voters are thick I very much dislike this stand that so many remainers take. I can understand why people voted leave and have always thought the writing was on the wall. Shame our MP’s were so blind to it that they thought so little of going ahead with the referendum, so little debate on the referendum it’s truly shocking on how unprofessional they (bar a few) were.

They are millions of people that have felt governments have let them down time and time again there were given the chance for a real change and they took it. I wasn’t surprised by the result (especially after Boris got on board if you have followed London politics you will have known how canny he is at winning votes over no surprise at the GE either)

And no they are not nearly all dead if the vote were to happen again next month I do not for one minute think the result would swing to remain it’s too late that ship sailed I think many are now in the mindset just get it over with it to vote to Remain and have another few years of political wrangling over the issue

VinylDetective · 19/10/2020 17:17

@Dragongirl10

Little point asking people to vote then ignoring the result....not very democratic....
I voted to go into the EU in 1975. My vote’s been overturned. Not ver democratic, is it?
KenDodd · 19/10/2020 17:21

I think you're forgetting how significant racism was in the motivation to vote Leave. We are losing FOM, that's all that's going to matter to a lot of people, they don't care about the rest.

SerendipityJane · 19/10/2020 17:22

What a surprise the oh leavers are stupid/thick is trotted out

it was a bit more nuanced than that. (And a personal view anyway).

KenDodd · 19/10/2020 17:27

I can understand why people voted leave

Why do you think they voted Leave?

I've said why I think they did, racism.
This is based on following lots of Leave groups on the internet and from almost all of the Leave voters I know personally. Most are really racist. Sadly, this includes most of my family.

VinylDetective · 19/10/2020 17:31

My theory was that the leave vote was motivated by wanting to give the Tory government a bloody nose as a result of austerity. Of course two subsequent Tory victories, particularly the last one, have blown that theory out of the water. I honestly can’t believe all or even most of leave voters did so out of racism but perhaps I’m naive. It has turned into a cult though.

june2007 · 19/10/2020 17:31

I for one never thought there would be another referendu,, as far as i am aware no one in charge said there would be. We got our chance to vote. The problem is partly because a lot of people don,t vote at all.

DynamoKev · 19/10/2020 17:32

I voted to go into the EU in 1975. My vote’s been overturned. Not ver democratic, is it?
Actually, you didn't.
The EU didn't exist in 1975
The 1975 referendum wasn't about joining. We we never given a (separate) vote about whether to join what was then the EEC.
The 1975 vote was whether to stay in or leave.

VinylDetective · 19/10/2020 17:34

@DynamoKev

I voted to go into the EU in 1975. My vote’s been overturned. Not ver democratic, is it? Actually, you didn't. The EU didn't exist in 1975 The 1975 referendum wasn't about joining. We we never given a (separate) vote about whether to join what was then the EEC. The 1975 vote was whether to stay in or leave.
Fine, if we’re nitpicking, I voted to stay in the EEC. Happy now? I voted to stay twice 41 years apart.
Porcupineinwaiting · 19/10/2020 17:34

Well if leavers arent thick, perhaps they could explain why a Mongolia Australian style deal is a good thing for the economy? And when they extra money for the NHS will start rolling in, cause it seems quite stretched right now.

DynamoKev · 19/10/2020 17:34

What a surprise the oh leavers are stupid/thick is trotted out

And racist - don't forget they are all racist, and thick.

KenDodd · 19/10/2020 17:36

I went on some of the marches, although I didn't believe any of it would make a difference (I was even I interviewed on a march saying this :) ) I have young children though and in the years to come I want to be able to say that I did everything I could to stop it. I'm really glad that I did go on them.

OnGoldenPond · 19/10/2020 17:37

@VinylDetective, you voted to stay in the EU (then known as the EC) in 1975, as the UK was admitted to membership in 1973 when our application, submitted back in the 50s, was finally approved. (Sorry, pedantic, had this debate with my DM and she still doesn't believe me).

The vote to remain back then was much more decisive than the vote to leave this time round, 67% against 33%.

SerendipityJane · 19/10/2020 17:40

@DynamoKev

What a surprise the oh leavers are stupid/thick is trotted out

And racist - don't forget they are all racist, and thick.

As noted, there's a little more nuance than that. And racism by definition is a bit thick, so it doesn't need a separate explanation.

And it's not that Leave voters were thick for voting leave. After all, that bus (oh, when is that £350 million a week kicking in ?) was quite appealing.

However, I'm saying now that any Leavers that are happy with the way things are going are thick. Unless they are willing to cite how they knew we'd end up here from historical news reports before the referendum.

Admit it. You've been had. Bigly. And you've pulled the whole nation with you. Bigly bigly.

ItsAlwaysSunnyOnMN · 19/10/2020 17:41

I don’t doubt some voted due to their racist beliefs.

But I also feel many people felt left behind many had never had a wage rise in years had seen other areas of the country doing well and so little investment in their area. Can I understand why when companies were allowed to bring in workers from the EU to work in factories or on building sites for less money so workers here were undercut they didn’t feel anger. Of course I can understand this. It didn’t impact me (apart from getting decorators in at a cheaper cost to myself) in a negative way but freedom of movement became the topic of the referendum (something Remain tried to ignore) and it has impacted many. Now we can say everyone who thinks that is unfair is racist or we can be realistic and understand that we all deserve to earn a decent living wage. unfortunately while there are many positives for being in the EU legal exploration of workers (and this is an issues in many EU countries) is allowed.