Nursery withholding DS drink

[T33l9]

My toddler (new to nursery) has been returning home with a full drink cup, as in - not being given his juice.

It is sugar free and heavily diluted so it's not unhealthy.

After doing some reading online it appears that alot of nurseries have a blanket rule of 'no juice' but this hasn't been communicated with me.

My problem is that he is a restricted eater/drinker due to having additional needs and I'm concerned he's not getting sufficient fluids. He may take a sip of water if he's totally parched, if they're lucky, but he certainly won't take in enough. When he gets home he screams and shouts for juice because he's overly thirsty.

AIBU to tell them to let him have the juice I'm sending him in with?

It’s better for his teeth to drink any milk/juice with his meal and water in between. It’s reducing the number of times your mouth is acidic. I think your trying hard to do the right thing but are jumping the gun a little. Give them a call. I think it might be better to have a chat away from dcs ears.

@updownroundandround

@ T33l9

I can see how upset you are by your responses to OP's comments. I understand why you are upset, believe me.

I'd like you to maybe try and see things from a different viewpoint ?

I understand your DS is 2.5 yrs and has been diagnosed as having SEN (as well as maybe a further diagnosis of ASD in the future) ?

I also understand that the nursery he goes to is specifically for SEN children ?

If all of this is correct, then what your issue actually is, is that you know what works with your DS at home, and you'd like his nursery to continue doing things in exactly the same way ?

If that is correct, then what you're not seeing, is that your DC has to learn that in nursery (and in school when he's older), things are done differently. Unfortunately, with SEN kids, this will be a little tougher and take a little longer, but it is definitely worth it, for both of you.

Although your DC has SEN, he is not incapable of learning, or of adjusting to change, same as any child. He will benefit from learning that different places have different routines/ rules.

You actually need him to learn this, so that he can develop his own strategies and coping mechanisms as well as increasing his 'tolerance' of different drinks/ food/ people etc.

I really do understand that you and your DH have spent the last 2.5 yrs learning what 'works' and what your DS 'likes' etc, but the staff at the nursery are not there to maintain your rituals, they are there to help your son learn that the world is different outside of your home/ family.

As he learns and develops, things which he would not tolerate at home, can become things he will tolerate in other places/ situations, and your life will be easier because of it.

Teaching SEN kids new things/ routines is HARD work and ridiculously repetitive, and so is very often better accomplished by people without an emotional link to the child, someone who doesn't get upset when the child gets upset, someone who is more dispassionate, i.e a teacher/ SEN helper etc.

I know it's heartbreaking to see your child 'thirsty' or 'hungry', but if he is to learn and progress, he must go through this (and so must every other SEN child) to be able to develop.
He will learn, that no matter what, juice is not given at nursery, and at some point he will learn that he must accept water if he is thirsty.

The nursery will also be a great help with the 'no dummy' and with accepting more foods and with toilet training etc, but you have to allow the nursery staff to do their job and teach your DS.

You raise alot of valid points, so thank you for phrasing it in the way that you have.

I will consider everything you and other PP's have said up thread.

@ T33l9

P.S, I'm writing as both a professional with extensive experience working with SEN kids in residential/ social care as well as a parent of an SEN child and step parent of another SEN child.

You’re right @T33l9, that’s a fab post from updown. My little one is a big one now and I totally understand where you are coming from. Let them help you, and him. He’s going to learn and change so much in the next few years, and so will you. Sadly for us Ds still only drinks water and milk so I’d be bowled over by the sips of something new.

Something to consider: even sugar free juice is horrendous for teeth, due to the acid. if nursery helps you to reduce acidic juice intake (and help you safe his teeth), i would grasp that opportunity with both hands.
Yes, I have a extremely picky SENDs child - and some relatively short days where he only sips water will not damage him.

Fantastic post from updown

A lot of children with additional needs also do a lot of compartmentalising where they will associate one thing or behaviour with one setting and not do that anywhere else.

At home the only crisps DS will eat are salt and vinegar (has to be walkers), at school they would go uneaten but he will eat Asda ready salted crisps in school (but never at home, when lockdown started I had a lot of ready salted crisps to eat to make sure they didn’t go off!)

Same with drinks for him, he will only drink Asda orange and mango at home but at school he will only drink flavoured water. When out he will drink lemonade but can tell different brands and is very fussy.

I have long since realised there is no point trying to second guess. It could well be that he is drinking enough water throughout the day even if at home it would be turned down.

My daughter started nursery in July. At home she poops 1-3 times a day. She's only just started popping at nursery last month. I think that's because she's very settled and happy now(?)

I'm starting to see things from another perspective and coming around to the idea that 'only water' rule will be a good thing - If (and only if) they can show/assure me that he is drinking enough, I'll be happy.

I won't budge on the dummy front for now as I have our paeds support on that, but so long as DS is hydrated I'll be satisfied.

There are a few things me and the nursery don't agree on and whilst I will accept I'm not always right, there are some things they're not right about too. Nobody is right all of the time (least of all me)

He is my Achilles heel and I will admit I'm protective and can be sensitive where he is concerned.

Thank you all for your input on the thread be it in agreement with me or not, it helps to get a balanced view.

My DD goes to a mainstream nursery and eats fish and veg for meals there. No meat. They are able to make allowances for her for her diet. Why can't your son be allowed to have his diluted squash? The mind boggles. As a previous poster said he could be allowed his fluids in private.

Not that this helps you but mine always comes back thirsty from the place so I am pretty sure as a given some nurseries are not keeping en eye on the fluid intake of all the kids present.

Hi op, I hope you manage to come to the best arrangement for DS, one which you feel comfortable with. I’ve been an early years teacher since 2001 including working in SEN schools. Quite often SEN children’s fixed ways of thinking are radically different in different settings. We have often found our little ones only drinking water/milk in school even when offered something else (which we would do from time to time purposefully to aid with transitions).

I agree with updown, however I think nurseries should allow parents a period of adjustment too, to get used to the idea. It's like they are losing some control over their parenting

Also you could ask them not to change him last thing? Then you'll know for sure he's had some fluids. And only change him when he needs it. Then you can account for the nappy changes.

@T33l9

As much as I don't agree with a blanket rule, I'm happy for him to have water if I can be reassured that he's drinking enough of it.

Without that reassurance of course I would prefer he drinks juice because I know he won't refuse it (like I've seen him refuse water many times)

If they will document his fluid intake for me when asked, and it shows he's getting sufficient hydration, then I will drop the issue of juice.

This sounds like an entirely reasonable and sensible approach, and I hope the nursery is equally reasonable, @T33l9.

Not pooing at nursery isn't constipation. DS didn't for a long time, even before potty training but was most definitely not constipated- just chose when to poo in his nappy (lucky me!)

DS is NT but is often quite thirsty when he arrives home. He does however drink a HUGE amount, like his dad.

It is reasonable to ask for more evidence of hydration than 'sips'

And as many others said, a nappy change just before pick up is very usual- I'd say no, it's ok, don't do it if he was next when I picked him up.

It is interesting that peer pressure makes such a difference.
My DD at that age wouldn't drink squash, only water or milk.
However once she discovered other kids drank diluted squash, she'd empty any child's beaker left lying around! Before that she spat it out. (And doesn't like it at all now she's older)
Likewise the potty/toilet. A friend's (older) daughter came over at a time mine was happily using a toilet step and the loo. Because Ellie didn't need to use a step as she was taller, mine refused to use the step so either wailed for assistance or used the potty - for months! What a pain!

DS 5 has watched his peers drink school milk for 2.5 years. Won't touch the stuff. Same for any fruit that isn't apple - 2?5 years of snack time, he just goes without if there's no apple. Likewise lunches and toileting.

Yes it might work for the majority of kids, but the idea that ALL kids will do it if they're thirsty / see Bobby doing it / aka their parents were less useless isn't true and isn't helpful
T

As a child I wouldn't drink water because even at age 2.5 my iarebts let me have coke!! My 5 year old happily drinks water because apart from milk that was the only thing I gave him for the first 2 years of his life! At school they are only allowed water so if you can wean him.off the squash now it will help in the long run.

My son takes these in his lunchbox they’re are completely clear like water but very much taste of juice not flavoured water they say out of Stock on line but I buy them in store every week if u have an Iceland near u and it’s £1 for 12 just an idea and I’m sorry your going through this sounds very tough jus try thought this might be an option www.iceland.co.uk/p/calypso-clear-natural-mineral-water-cups-drinks-12-x-185ml/49008.html

Well I've spoken with the nursery and there has been a big miscommunication, partly thanks to DP coming back to me this morning and saying the nursery wants them "all to have the same" and that being bloody water.

He's got his wires crossed which then fuelled my annoyance today.

I told the manager I had not been made aware of the "no juice" policy as I've been sending him with juice since July and nobody had mentioned anything to me, she said she hasn't banned juice at all but is encouraging the children to drink water aswell as she's under pressure from the higher ups to encourage healthy eating/drinking.

(She didn't say that to DP this morning though, only that they're encouraging drinking water - so he returned home believing it was only water allowed)

She has assured me that DS is doing well in adjusting to drinking water but when he refuses (which is 50% of the time) then he's given juice. This explains why sometimes his bottle is empty and sometimes full. He has days where he'll happily drink water but then point blank refuse on other occasions.

They haven't ever poured his juice away.

I've agreed to encourage him to drink more water at home with a view to hopefully lessening the amount he refuses it at nursery.

There has been a lack of communication on all sides, mine included.

All said and done I'm on board with the nursery encouraging him to drink more water and will do the same at home. I see it as a positive and I'm on board with it now I know exactly what's happening.

Glad it’s sorted!

Fantastic! Good outcome.
Maybe at home give him two drinks each time. Juice and plain water. Leave both out and don’t mention it. He might end up reaching for the water as often as the juice.

Good luck op, it’s a bloody long road but worth it.

Oh, that was a good update to read, OP :)

Lovely

Great result.

That's really good