Pubs V Schools

[Witchcraftandhokum]

I absolutely understand the importance of keeping schools open, but...

I live in an area which is likely to go into Tier 3 tomorrow, I personally know 7 people who have tested positive for Covid. One of which is most likely to have caught it in the care home she works in and 6 of which are most likely cases transmitted in school. I don't know anyone who thinks they may have caught it from a pub or restaurant. AIBU to think that the hospitality sector is being abandoned by the government?

Classroom teachers outside London can be paid up to £41,604

Ah, so you retract your comment about the average salary for a classroom teacher being £40k then?

To be top of the pay scale you usually need to have been teaching for over a decade. Not many last that long.

@Appuskidu

The data comes straight from the DFE.

The average salary of a secondary classroom teacher was £38,674

explore-education-statistics.service.gov.uk/find-statistics/school-workforce-in-england

Wtf does well paid considering the qualifications needed for the role mean? It's underpaid considering it's a graduate profession surely.

Jesus, you're so clueless your name must surely be Alicia Silverstone.

@Appuskidu

The average salary for a classroom teacher is not far off £40,000

That is the top of the upper pay scale-so, unless you are counting large numbers of SLT (who by doing some classroom teaching are being counted in the category of ‘classroom teacher’), who are on the leadership pay scale, then it won’t be. Averages don't work like that.

It really wouldn’t surprise me though if there is some skewed and misleading piece of data out there somewhere stating just that though.

That’s true. I’m SLT and although I teach 50% of the time I am paid on the leadership scale. I’m inner London too and the increments here are different.

I don’t know why the thread has descended into discussing teacher wages though. For the record I am happy with my salary but have never known a more stressful half term than this one. It is like the stress you feel before an OFSTED visit all day, every day. A couple of bottles of hand sanitiser would not do much either way to be honest, whether or not a teacher wanted to provide them.

My personal experience is that parents are deeply divided about schools. I get an equal number of complaints that we aren’t doing enough and that we are doing too much.

Love the idea that teachers should show they are ‘in tune with the public mood’ by paying for hand sanitiser, instead of the government showing that they are in tune with the public mood by paying for hand sanitiser.

To say that this even needs pointing out just shows what a shitshow we are in, where is it, that anyone's 1st thought is that the teachers should be supporting our children and our economy but now we look to them to actually finance our child's safety and their own.

Everyone's 1st outrage should be we are even having to have this conversation.....any PPE needed or desired should be there in our schools, paid for by our government,

I do think schools should stay open but I think to survive the winter it needs to to be two weeks in, two weeks at home doing blended learning. Then at least there is a chance for some social distancing for those who are in.

The average salary of a secondary classroom teacher was £38,674

Then they are adding in things like Head of Department who are being paid extra for things which are not classroom teaching.

Good to know that you’d expect an NQT on £25k to fork out for essential school supplies because apparently showing up for work day after day in unsafe conditions isn’t enough for you.

@noblegiraffe

£25,000 is a good starting salary in most parts of the country. It is more than many people will earn in their lives.

Teachers and TAs are already providing their own sanitiser, buying soap and tissues for their classrooms amongst other things. They’ve been buying classroom supplies from their own money for years in my school and I’m sure many others. It’s not going to create goodwill with the public or parents because those people don’t even know.

Ecosse it doesn’t matter if it’s a good starting salary or not, it is ludicrous that you expect it to be spent on school cleaning supplies because the government can’t be fucked to fund any.

No one is saying here that teachers are badly paid exactly, just that we aren't paid enough to buy any MORE resources. And you're ignoring the more important point, which is that the government should be funding schools adequately. Which is something they weren't doing even before this crisis.

@noblegiraffe

Where do you expect the government to get the money for hundreds of litres of hand sanitiser for evert school in the country at a time when it is facing huge demands and reduced tax take (which will be even worse when furlough ends)?

The government simply does not have the money to fund cleaning supplies and hand sanitiser for every school at the moment. It is up to teachers and school staff to do their bit.

I'm a publican in a small tourist hotspot in north waves, we are in local lockdown, I'm going to write to mark drakeford tomorrow to beg him to lock us down, it's our only chance of survival, it soul destroying, financially we can't continue, I've 14 staff that deserve there jobs, every penny of my savings has gone to save my business, my brewery have charged me full rent throughout the first lockdown, they are relentlessly chasing me for the money, I cannot pay for a business that did not trade,

@NailsNeedDoing

Putting different sections of society up against each other is only going to create animosity with too many people disagreeing, and when people disagree with rules for justifiable reasons, they aren’t going to follow them and the problem will only get worse.

While I believe schools being open is vitally important, it’s not everything to everyone. At an individual level, a primary age child who is safe with their carers at home is not more important than an adult who needs the hospitality industry to fund their family or a single adult who’s only social life and mental health relies on being able to visit a pub.

Even thinking only if children, it is massively more important that those in exam years are kept in school, but it’s not so important that those in reception to Y8 do. It doesn’t have to be all schools open versus all schools closed.

Maybe the rule should be that those who have children in schools aren’t allowed to visit pubs and restaurants but those that don’t have children in school can be allowed to do what matters to them.

I was with you til the last paragraph :)

Those with young children likely don't get to the pub as often though, does that help?
Don't take it away from us completely though- we need it more!

Sorry !! North wales !

The government simply does not have the money to fund cleaning supplies and hand sanitiser for every school at the moment. It is up to teachers and school staff to do their bit

If you don’t think the government should have to pay, why school staff? Why not parents?

What about MPs? Why can’t they donate their nice fat pay rise to pay for it? I bet it was much bigger than the teachers’ one.

It’s not rocket science, Ecosse, the government says its priority is to keep schools open so it finds the money to keep them open. If it could find the money to give people a cheap Nando’s for the good of the economy then it can find money for this.

But it is always the case with this govt that it can chuck money to its mates with abandon and then go ‘oh dear no money for you’ when it comes to schools.

The public shouldn’t accept it.

Where do you expect the government to get the money from? They have just forked out for a load of furlough. Or do you think they shouldn't have paid that.
A lot of people are working in unsafe conditions, it's getting a bit old to say it's only teachers who are risking themselves
Surely teachers would agree children should be in school for as long as possible? Home learning didn't seem to work very well for children, parents or teachers.
I really hope the government don't shut anything down but I have a feeling they will.

Surely teachers would agree children should be in school for as long as possible?

Indeed. And that’s more likely to happen in a safer school environment where staff aren’t off with covid.

A conversation last week at school.

SMT: I’m afraid you’ve got to pick your child up. They are presenting with a cough and you will need to either keep them off for 14 days or get a negative COVID test.

Parent: I can’t pick them up. I’m at work.

SMT: I’m afraid you’ll either have to leave work, our policy is that your child must leave the site until either isolated or they have a negative COVID test.

Parent: I’m not coming to get them. You’ll have to just isolate them there until the end of the day.

Pupil stays in school in a room on their own with one member of staff.

Next day, pupil arrives at school. SMT phone the parent.

Parent: yes, we called the doctor and they said it’s a normal seasonal cough and nothing more.

Member of staff: ok, great thank you.

The hysteria on this thread of the youth is ridiculous.

How many of you waving the flag for schools to close are taking responsibility of your own health so you don’t suffer WHEN you catch covid?

Stop smoking, decrease alcohol consumption, lose weight or actually exercise?!

Take responsibility for your own health FFS

@DBML unfortunately not everyone will be paid to isolate by their workplace and just can't afford to be off. I am a single parent on minimum wage and I cannot work from home, thankfully I have a good employer who has said they will pay me if I need to be off with DC but if they didn't do that I couldn't afford to have 2 weeks off unpaid.
If the government sorted out quicker testing and helped fund people to isolate with their children compliance would probably be higher.

Schools are essential. Education is the future of our children and our country, never more so than at age current time. I don't care if pubs are a lower risk than schools they still close first! Yes I know its peoples living but it has to be done.

@Waxonwaxoff0

Well, that’s OK then. We’ll just accept that COVID will spread around the schools and parents just send your kids in. Any child (we have kids with type 1 diabetes and Cystic fibrosis), teacher or parent who dies can just be collateral damage.

And @Ecosse

Buy your own kid’s sanitiser. You’re one of those parents who ring the school complaining that your child didn’t get to cook, when you failed to supply the ingredients aren’t you.

Schools need to stay open as a priority, children have missed more than enough education.

I’m not completely opposed to them closing again if necessary, but they should certainly be prioritised over pubs/restaurants.