To be really angry that seeing my parents is illegal?

[Snailsetssail]

My area is very likely to be locked down next week. I am so furious that it’s going to be against the law for me to see my parents, and my children to see their grandparents. We did lockdown properly last time, it was absolutely awful. My mental health plummeted and I don’t think I can do it again. I rely on support from family and friends.

Just feeling so incredibly angry about it all tonight. Poor people in Leicester have lived like this for 100 days so far with no end in site.

I’m so fed up and I know I’m going to be told to just get on it it. But I just need a space to vent.

I've not read the full thread (apologies if its already been said) but depending on how bad your mental health is you could classify seeing one or a very limited number of people as "caring for a vulnerable person" . Of course this depends on the other person(s) being willing as well. I am not one for breaking/bending rules at whim. However, you are struggling mentally and have small children. If you don't feel able to "just suck it up" then I think it would be morally (and legally) ok to seek help in the form of company from a limited number of people.

I don't get how people can boast about having gone out as normal despite restrictions, and be all defiant about how 'nothing will stop them seeing family' and it's 'governing by fear' etc etc and at the same time moan about how Leicester and other places are still locked down. Do you really not see the link?

Lockdowns and not seeing people suck, but the more people flout the rules the longer it'll go on.

@Funkypolar

Just wait until unemployment hits 20%...people will stop obeying the roolz very quickly when they are hungry and homeless...

Lots of people have already killed themselves because of isolation, lost their job, worried about paying for their mortgage etc. Northern businesses have collapsed. So many have lost their jobs and lives. Don’t joke about it.

“People should not be afraid of their governments, governments should be afraid of their people"

PandaCub7 - not joking. People will only take so much before they start to push back. Good.

I don't have a problem at all with people seeing family SD down a garden path, whatever the restrictions are. But I'm suspecting most of the people on here saying they are going to see their parents regardless are not doing that.....they're having hugs, meals, cups of tea inside homes and allowing children to mix. Am I right?

@SnackRussell

I think those who are saying “suck it up” aren’t seeing the dark side of this with the mass unemployment, livelihoods being destroyed, businesses closing, kids not being allowed to sit exams, people living in fear and time ticking away for many who aren’t able to see loved ones.

But each to their own I guess.

Stay cosy people!

Your absolutely right. And I think there is a real ‘ I’m alright Jack’ mentality about it.

And it’s all people that are finically secure whether it’s benefits, pensions or WFH and don’t have the worry of elderly isolated family.

@JeanClaudeVanDammit

Who will you rail against if your loved ones get sick, though?

What if they (far more likely) get sick with something other than covid and have wasted their remaining years apart from their loved ones? This has happened to thousands of people already this year and there will be many more because there is no end in sight. I’ll be railing as hard as I can against the selfish “all that matters is covid” brigade if that happens to my family.

My thinking exactly. It already came very close to happening in my family and isn't a risk I am willing to continue to take.

Sorry I’m peed off with what’s going on I misread the “stop obeying the rules” to “start obeying the rules.” I agree. Why are we letting the government treat us like scorned children? There’s only so much we can take.

@yetanothernamitynamechange

I've not read the full thread (apologies if its already been said) but depending on how bad your mental health is you could classify seeing one or a very limited number of people as "caring for a vulnerable person" . Of course this depends on the other person(s) being willing as well. I am not one for breaking/bending rules at whim. However, you are struggling mentally and have small children. If you don't feel able to "just suck it up" then I think it would be morally (and legally) ok to seek help in the form of company from a limited number of people.

Unfortunately the new rules coming in next week will prohibit this - you won't be able to see anyone outside your household for any reason. This is what people are (rightly) concerned about.

If you're in a Tier 3 area, that is.

@PennyDreadfuI WHat I wasn't actually aware of that (and obviously shouldn't be commenting on things I don't know all the facts on ) thats completely bonkers and unworkable! I just can't see people sticking to those rules.

@tactum

I don't have a problem at all with people seeing family SD down a garden path, whatever the restrictions are. But I'm suspecting most of the people on here saying they are going to see their parents regardless are not doing that.....they're having hugs, meals, cups of tea inside homes and allowing children to mix. Am I right?

How do you know that? Most people I know are following the rules and being especially careful around their elderly loved ones.

My kids mix with other children all day at school but then we would stand at our grandmothers gate whilst she stood or sat at the front door and chatted. We would be the only human contact she would have had all day. This is not a good life for some who is near the end of there time. The physical effects on these people through isolation is shocking and a disgrace.

There is a feeling in this country pushed by the government and news that other people are stupid and don’t know how to look after themselves when in reality the massive majority know how not to kill granny or grandad. People have bought in to be treated like imbeciles and children - cos it’s for their own benefit

What about elderly people who are sick and dying? That want and need their family around them? Can you imagine knowing your dying but scared the fucking neighbours who were encouraged to grass on people would report them to the police?

This might be ok in your world but it’s not in mine and many many others.

How do people work without childcare?? I’m going to see my parents for childcare regardless, whatever the rules are and I really couldn’t give a toss about people saying I’m selfish. They are selfish to expect people to give up jobs and homes for one fucking risk.

@PennyDreadfuI

If you're in a Tier 3 area, that is.

This has not yet been confirmed though has it? As the tier 3 restrictions were still being finalised yesterday and will be announced on Monday?

tactum I don’t know about others but in my case you’re absolutely right - I’m going into my DM’s house, we’re having tea and hugs and kids are playing.

They can make it as illegal as they like for me to see my dad, who will likely die soon anyway. It won't stop me. And I don't think my 82 yo mum will find fucking zoom as any substitute for a hug when she thinks about her husband dying. Thank God I went up to explain about end of life protocols in person with tea and tissues and didn't do it over zoom.

Surely if you provide care on an unpaid basis that will need to continue?

I have a grandparent (not in a tier 3 area fortunately) who is very elderly/in general ill health and would be unlikely to survive covid (they also probably wouldnt be taken to hospital because it would not be the kindest thing). However, they are also, realistically, unlikely to live more than a few years more anyway so one of their children ahs continued visiting them regularly. Because their time here is likely to be short anyway and because they need assistance the risk-benefit balance is such that it makes sense to continue visiting. If it was suddenly against the rules my (very law abiding, and generally concerned about covid) relative would almost certainly continue visiting them anyway because the alternative is ridiculous.
And yes I would be devastated if they died from Covid. I would also be devastated if they died early next year from something unrelated having not seen family for months and not understanding why they'd been abandoned. .

It's cruel to isolate the already most isolated people in society. It's one thing to ban public events and parties but no eighty year old should have to worry about the neighbours reporting them when their family members or a friendly neighbour visits them.

There needs to be sense and humanity in the rules.

@RaspberryHartleys

The' cases are doubling' makes it sound like we're having the equivalent to the Spanish flu or the Bubonic Plague. We are not.

It's very misleading and gives a very false impression.

First of all, the cases are increasing in number because the tests are increasing in number.

The test is already recognised to picking up certain genetic material that 80% of the population carries round, all the time, with no ill effects.

An extremely small amount of people will have symptoms, never mind be ill or die.

The average age of a person dying of covid is still above life expectancy age.

Yes, every life is precious and no one wants to die or lose someone but we have to face reality, that in the long run, the measures being put into place are more dangerous and life-threatening in the long-term than the virus itself.

We need to grow up and accept that we can only do so much and nature will do what it will do as far as we can't control it.

The virus is about number 24 on the list of causes of death. Are we to constantly curtail our lives and shut everything down and ban 'bad' things to solve this problem?

If people stay locked up in their homes, never socialize, never go out, do you not realise that this is actually dangerous and very bad for their health and lowers life expectancy?

If you are getting your information purely from mainstream media or only from sources parroting the main narrative you are not being a critical thinker and looking deeper and making your own investigations as far as you are able.

This leads to an unbalanced, blinkered view and an unquestioning openness and acquiescence to authority.

Don't listen to me.

I urge everyoone, please find out for yourself and open up your field of vision for a broader, more widely-informed outlook.

*everyone! sorry for mistakes - typed rather quickly.

@ceeveebee apologies for the crap screenshot but these are the Tier 3 proposed rules. If they go ahead they mean no support bubbles/informal childcare.

There needs to be sense and humanity in the rules

This, with bells on.