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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

'Boys' work night out

234 replies

thistimenextmonth · 07/10/2020 10:05

I am part of a 3 person senior management team where I work. I am in the middle of the other 2 in terms of seniority.

We have a team of 60 employees with 4 junior managers beneath us.

2 colleagues (male) have left the workplace recently and one of the junior managers has organised a few drinks to say farewell, my boss (male) and the other manager (also male) have been invited along with the junior managers and a couple of others on site.

I have not been invited and no other women have either. The reason given was it is a boys night.

This has only just happened so I am still reeling a bit. There are no other female managers which is why I am asking here if I should be feeling this uncomfortable about it? My boss hasn't said anything but when I mentioned to the other manager he seemed to 'get it' which is why I know the answer of it was a 'boys night' I feel disrespected and dissapointed. AIBU?

OP posts:
Asterion · 07/10/2020 11:55

@Oneandzero

*It was organised by a manager for a colleague who is leaving. That makes it a work related event.*

Replace “leaving” with a birthday celebration. Also a work related event?

A birthday happens regardless of where you work. A leaving do doesn't.
Newkitchen123 · 07/10/2020 11:55

@NiceGerbil

New kitchen

In all of my workplaces, team drinks/ leaving drinks are general invitation.

If you don't want to go you can say no.

It's not complicated. And is quite normal.

A lot of you must work in really horrible work environments tbh

But this wasn't an open invitation. It was invitation only It just sounds like OP expects to be invited as she's their manager.
artisanparsnips · 07/10/2020 11:57

It's cultural sexism, and does impact on relationships at work so is unjustifiable. It's like all those city golf client events and so on.

Do you have an HR department? If so, I'd tackle it through them, and also mention that it's breaking the rule of 6 anyway. Shouldn't be happening at all.

Asterion · 07/10/2020 11:57

@OhCaptain

This is a difficult one because it's blatant, ridiculous sexism.

But what's the desired outcome? That you get invited when you know you're not wanted? I can see how it would be awkward.

If it had been arranged as a boys' night - fine. But it was arranged specifically as a farewell to a colleague and you shouldn't need a penis to get in.

The desired outcome is to have a company that doesn't condone sexism.

How do you think anything ever gets changed? It gets changed by people not putting up with it, by fighting the little battles.

Otherwise why not just invite only white people? Or only able-bodied people?

2bazookas · 07/10/2020 11:59

BNO ; manspeak for " rat-arsed pubcrawl, strip joint, then back to Jim''s for vindaloo and porn".

Owlypants · 07/10/2020 11:59

Someone is having leaving drinks with friends from work and you obviously aren't considered a friend.

Oneandzero · 07/10/2020 11:59

@Asterion

If happening during contacted work hours - work related event.

If happening outside contacted work hours - non work related event

OchonAgusOchonO · 07/10/2020 11:59

@Oneandzero

*It was organised by a manager for a colleague who is leaving. That makes it a work related event.*

Replace “leaving” with a birthday celebration. Also a work related event?

Replace colleague with potato and it makes as much sense as your substitution
fromdownwest · 07/10/2020 11:59

@artisanparsnips - Wow.

That will build work place relationships, telling tales on your collegues activities OUTSIDE of the work place.

ilovepixie · 07/10/2020 12:00

It's like that where I work to, the boys have nights out by themselves no females invited and they also have a Male only WhatsApp group.

Original poster
thistimenextmonth · 07/10/2020 12:00

@Oneandzero

What baffles me is that you are obviously a highly experienced professional adult and yet you start a thread asking whether you are being unreasonable about feeling disrespected and disappointed about something very clearly and apparently - not being unreasonable Confused
Surely anyone can have a moment of anxiety and think 'is it me'?

An anonymous forum where you get all opinions, good bad and ugly outside of your own thoughts or bubble is useful.

Surely there are all kinds of women here and should be welcome to ask whatever they want and to sound out other women regardless of professional success?

This is my first post in a long time. I remember why.

OP posts:
rwalker · 07/10/2020 12:00

@oneandzero
It’s a “brave” and stupid man in today’s world that does something that has even a whiff of obvious sexism about it.

So if 6 friends want to go out for a drink they MUST invite a women or they are sexist .

OchonAgusOchonO · 07/10/2020 12:00

[quote Oneandzero]@Asterion

If happening during contacted work hours - work related event.

If happening outside contacted work hours - non work related event[/quote]
Not so. If it is organised within work, it is a work related event even if it takes place outside work.

fromdownwest · 07/10/2020 12:02

@rwalker - I assume that there is an equal diversifcation of gender, religion, race and sexual orientation at this event.

Full inclusivity or you are a racist, mysgoniosistic, homophonic hateful male pig

growinggreyer · 07/10/2020 12:03

[quote Oneandzero]@Asterion

If happening during contacted work hours - work related event.

If happening outside contacted work hours - non work related event[/quote]
Why do you believe this to be true? It is not the legal position at all.

Original poster
thistimenextmonth · 07/10/2020 12:03

@Cheeseandwin5

I have seen the question asked a few times but I still haven't seen it answer ( apologies if this is due to my eyesight). Is the Company paying for the party or is the night being paid for by the people going.
No it's not paid for by the company.
OP posts:
Asterion · 07/10/2020 12:05

[quote Oneandzero]@Asterion

If happening during contacted work hours - work related event.

If happening outside contacted work hours - non work related event[/quote]
No, it doesn't work like that. It's about company culture.

Brefugee · 07/10/2020 12:08

take the bull by the horns and ask the leaver if this is what he wanted as a leaving do.

Because if it's not - he can nip it in the bud. And if it is you can call him out for the sexist twat he is.

user191264 · 07/10/2020 12:08

@thistimenextmonth do you think they are going to go to a strip club ? And maybe they thought it wouldn't be your thing

GeorgeDavidson · 07/10/2020 12:08

That’s not in, the other senior managers shouldn’t be going to stuff that excludes women.
Some of the boys, and I do mean boys, at our workplace started a men only night out as a regular thing and then complained in the office when the senior male managers decided to give it a swerve, knowing that it wouldn’t look right.
Apparently the lads had thought they’d be given a leg up career wise if they bonded and hung out with the bosses.
They were actually openly talking about this in the office and when female staff called them on it, Defended it saying the office was so women ‘Heavy’ (60% women to men) that they needed to have some time without them.
HR got wind of it and told the sr team that as it was outside of work it was up to them if they went but that it was an absolute minefield and their advice was for them not to go.
The whole thing fell apart once the junior male staff realise the VPs and bosses weren’t going to hang out with them. And a couple of the nicer blokes went and reported that it was boring without any of the women, and that the blokes just talked about football the whole night.
Dickheads.

GeorgeDavidson · 07/10/2020 12:10

OP - that’s disgraceful. I would t be happy if I were you. It’s not the 1950s.

fromdownwest · 07/10/2020 12:15

How has it gone from a few drinks with their mates, to defo going to a strip club?

The reverse sexism on this thread is quite something.

Males can go for a few drinks without feeling the need to go to a strip club you know.

rwalker · 07/10/2020 12:16

@fromthewastedown
@rwalker - I assume that there is an equal diversifcation of gender, religion, race and sexual orientation at this event.

Full inclusivity or you are a racist, mysgoniosistic, homophonic hateful male pig

Fuck me what have we come to when I organise a nightout I pick friends I want to socialise with and like .I don't have a tick list to make sure all gender,orentaion and race covered .
I have friends of all genders, race and orientation and do different thing all of with them .
This is 6 friends going for a drink if it was a full works do the other 50 odd people would of been invited as well.
They have not gone round the entire workforce and invited everyone but women.

Brefugee · 07/10/2020 12:18

Maybe their wives would give them a hard time if they were hanging out with a female colleague?
You are too sensitive. Get over it.

Hey, ladies: don' worry so much about the sexism displayed by men because it's much much worse from their fucking handmaidens, like this one.

Birthday drinks: invite who you like, if you are excluding some and inviting a lot of colleagues, be discreet about it.

Leaving do: is actually a work function regardless of who pays. Invite either only the people you work with, or invite everyone and hope that the people who don't like you decline like a sensible person.

Don't be a sexist twat. FWIW, OP, I'm also ex-military and while there wsa a lot of shitty institutional sexism, in our troop/squadron/regiment when it came to things like this, we were all one big team. Even if some people hated that (which was their problem not ours). In fact we often had the totally irritating convo of "but i always think of you as one of the guys"

Asterion · 07/10/2020 12:22

[quote rwalker]@fromthewastedown
@rwalker - I assume that there is an equal diversifcation of gender, religion, race and sexual orientation at this event.

Full inclusivity or you are a racist, mysgoniosistic, homophonic hateful male pig

Fuck me what have we come to when I organise a nightout I pick friends I want to socialise with and like .I don't have a tick list to make sure all gender,orentaion and race covered .
I have friends of all genders, race and orientation and do different thing all of with them .
This is 6 friends going for a drink if it was a full works do the other 50 odd people would of been invited as well.
They have not gone round the entire workforce and invited everyone but women.[/quote]
It's more than six people - sorry, men - being invited by a man to a man's leaving do. In a company where women colleagues do actually exist.

Now, let's try it with colour - black colleagues are excluded from a white man's work leaving do.

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