To not understand why women intentionally have children with these men

[Pickagoddamnname]

A friend said this about a mutual friend. Basically mutual friend has 2 children with a man who she can’t leave them with because ‘he doesn’t know what to do on his own’. So mutual friend is always solely responsible for childcare except when she has family babysitters. My friend thinks this is unfair on mutual friend and the children and I kind of agree but it’s really not an uncommon situation. I don’t know if mutual friend suspected her DH would be like this as a father or has maybe taken over the parenting to such an extent that he lets her get on with it as I’ve only known the couple a few years.

@Sitt

I don’t understand why people continually post these threads, knowing that they are intentionally blaming women for men’s behaviour

To respond to a poster, it's not my intention to blame women who have had these kind of misfortunes, and I doubt it' the intention of other posters.

But I think it's important to tell teenagers and young women to keep their eyes wide opened when getting into serious relationships.
I have 2 daughters myself, and one of the things I plan to tell them when they get older is that their choice of a partner in life is one of the (if not the) most important choices they will ever make, that they are wonderful, and that their purpose in life is not to manage a manchild.

I think it’s quite common when they’re babies as women do tend to take over that main parent role probably through maternity leave. But mutual friends children are 7 & 5 and their Dad doesn’t feel confident taking them to the park for a couple of hours. Mutual friend is very happy so none of my business, I just find it interesting and wonder if it is fair on the children to be missing out on that fatherly time.

@Sitt

I don’t understand why people continually post these threads, knowing that they are intentionally blaming women for men’s behaviour

I think there is some level of personal responsibility here. Yes, man should be held to higher standards than they are now, but... When they get away with it, don't do anything yet women still go and have more kids with them... Why change🤷🏻 It's bit of a circle and needs to be broken somewhere.

I’m also not intentionally bashing women either. Of course the father should be more responsible. However do we also as women not choose the father of our children (generally speaking)? Surely women should have some responsibility for that?

It's kind of like... You got a leak so you find a plumber. He is shit and in the end, after he leaves, you end up doing the work yourself from youtube video.
In a year you have another leak and call the same plumber. Story goes as before. The second time is simply on you🤷🏻

@Pickagoddamnname

I’m also not intentionally bashing women either. Of course the father should be more responsible. However do we also as women not choose the father of our children (generally speaking)? Surely women should have some responsibility for that?

You have no idea whether or not a man’s going to be an unsatisfactory father until it’s too late. It really isn’t important to some women if the relationship is otherwise good.

Its often a lack of relationships education and expectations. I only discovered MN with DD was 4 months and I had been married 1 year. It has been a revelation and really changed my view of relationships but sometimes MN forgets that women don't necessary grow up with the support to know what healthy relationships look like and with appropriate expectations of men. I come from a long line of abused women with low expectations of men and that is what I was brought up with. When DD was born I made a decision to break the cycle and told DH that I wouldn't stand for it and would force change. In some ways he has stepped up but inevitably I end up doing more because DD will come to me. The problem is that everyone supports DH. As the mother I am expected to take care of my child, house and pets, to work and to contribute equally financially. If DH cares for DD for a morning whilst I work his parents are shocked and of course the house is a shit hole because he literally just looks after our child without doing the washing, cleaning etc. My parents and friends are just as bad.

You don't always know someone will be useless/lazy with children specifically before having them though. Obviously some have red flags hanging out of their arse, some women think the man will magically change when he becomes a father, but for others there is nothing to indicate this will be the case. My friend is married to a 'great' man, he has always been very thoughtful, done an equal share of housework etc, amazing with other people's small children ie nieces and nephews, is very patient, and takes wonderful care of their pets. He is, however, a bit rubbish in terms of pulling his weight with their DS (she wanted a bigger family but does not want to because he doesn't help), and I wouldn't have seen that coming in honesty.

Hindsight is perfect.

Or they're an alright dad to one, if not great, and then with subsequent they either get more useless because, let's face it, it's harder the more you have, or life changes somehow and makes them more useless... This as my experience anyway. Multiple children made it so much harder and his MH deteriorated and he became utterly useless with the kids. We're divorcing now, for other reasons, but his MH improved over recent years, they're a bit older, he copes with them on his own though I worried at first. Just a shame he couldn't find his way to it sooner so my kids had happier memories of their dad from when we were together, but oh well. He's making up for it now with the full-on Disney experience.

Ive said before, the day you start a new relationship you should have a Mandatory three year contraceptive implant fitted. That gives you a vague chance of knowing a person before you choose to breed with them.

Abuse, low self esteem, low expectations due to difficult upbringing, accidental pregnancy, financial problems, changes in relationship dynamics after children/ being a SAHM in vulnerable situation. The list is endless really. I don’t feel anything except empathy- I suggest you educate yourself and try to put yourself is their shoes. Parenting is hard enough even if you have an involved partner. It must be relentless to be in this position.

I wonder what these men have learnt during their childhood. Were they pampered or did their friends later on tell them to be lazy twats? Do we need to educate boys more in what equal chores and parenting means?

@BillywilliamV

Ive said before, the day you start a new relationship you should have a Mandatory three year contraceptive implant fitted. That gives you a vague chance of knowing a person before you choose to breed with them.

And you still won’t know what kind of parent they’ll be.

I don’t agree, you just need to watch how they deal with other people, take on responsibilities generally, how domesticated they are, what they care about generally. Parenthood is a whole set of behaviours, very few of them are unique!

Exactly @VinylDetective, you could think someone will make the best father in the world but when it comes down to it you could be completely wrong. My friend was Married for 5 years before they had a baby, and that's when he completely changed. They are now divorced. You sometimes can't see it coming, no matter what they were like before.

@FreeGlib

No man has every chatted up a woman by saying "I'm an absolute fucking roaster, couldn't mind a cheese plant, lazy as fuck - how about some kids?".

I can't imagine why not, @FreeGlib!

@Nosnogginginthekitchen

Or they're an alright dad to one, if not great, and then with subsequent they either get more useless because, let's face it, it's harder the more you have, or life changes somehow and makes them more useless... This as my experience anyway. Multiple children made it so much harder and his MH deteriorated and he became utterly useless with the kids. We're divorcing now, for other reasons, but his MH improved over recent years, they're a bit older, he copes with them on his own though I worried at first. Just a shame he couldn't find his way to it sooner so my kids had happier memories of their dad from when we were together, but oh well. He's making up for it now with the full-on Disney experience.

Yeah true, I think it can be like this with parenthood as it is with a lot of things. Jobs, other relationships etc. Some people are just pootling along fine, managing to be unremarkable and adequate. Then something, anything happens to make things a bit harder and they just do not meet that challenge in any way. They fail the stress test: turns out adequate was the best case scenario and only going to happen if all the ducks were in place. Meanwhile though you'd already had no 2 on the basis that they were doing alright.

I think sometimes it's the man not wanting to try, sometimes it's the woman not trusting, and sometimes it's a mix.

Dh was very hands on with dd1. Did a lot of care, loved it. What I really liked he always did her bath which gave me half an hour completely on his own.
When dd2 was born we did the bath together for a few weeks, then I suggested he bathed them both and I could go back to having the break.
He looked horrified and said he couldn't manage both through the bath at once and he wasn't sure it was safe with only one adult to two children... then he thought and added that now he was working a bit later for work what would be really good is if I bathed them both and got them ready for bed, then he could play and read stories to them instead.
Once I'd finished laughing and saying pot kettle black and making helpful remarks like that, he realised how silly he was being and agreed to try if the first couple of days I waited in the next room in case he needed help.
After that he was fine.

They’re not incapable of looking after their kids, they just don’t want to. Lazy, abusive arses

Agree with above PP that there are many reasons why women tend to stay with unsuitable husbands .In fairness unless they have ever been "left" with their very own children ,how will they ever "know what to do" FFS! A lot of women will say "oh hes hopeless" as they may wish to do most of the childrearing themselves .Many couples dont talk about having DC full stop and then have no idea how a guy will cope with being a Dad!

@Sitt

I don’t understand why people continually post these threads, knowing that they are intentionally blaming women for men’s behaviour

Men don't conceive. Men don't make the decision on whether to continue with a pregnancy. Men cannot make children on their own. It's a 50/50 responsibility and regardless of how useless a man is, women are not blameless in this.

I'm sure plenty of women have had subsequent kids with 'perfect' dads who have then gone on to fuck them all over. Don't be so bloody judgemental.

FreeGlib LOL! Many of them probably think that Though!

I said YABU because sometimes you don’t know how crap someone will be as a father until they are a father.

If your question had been why do women intentionally have kids with someone who has shown themselves to be a terrible father, you would NBU.