Homesick DD locked down in uni room

[RollercoasterRita]

We took our DD to university in the middle of September. She was excited and full of hope. Now due to someone in her halls of residence being tested positive for COVID, her whole floor has been locked down in their tiny rooms with food parcels being delivered to outside their doors. Totally understand the precautions which need to be taken, but my baby girl is lonely and scared and homesick and I just want to drive up there and get her. I feel so helpless....

U go to uni because u want to. No one was conned. My dgd very aware of situation and what might happen but chose to go and start to lead her own life as a young adult. She was well prepared for every contingency as far as having enough emergency food supplies and drinks. She's wise enough to keep topping it up after all she has to make sure she has enough meds, enough contact lens, enough masks, enough sanitizer, etc. It's what being responsible for yourself is all about. We have just sent her a parcel of goodies so she doesn't have to go in too many shops. Don't bring your young adult home. Life is hard especially in these times. They have to learn how to cope because you are not going to be there forever and real life is unpredictable, hard and confusing sometimes. Allow her to become an adult.

@Serin

HottoCold

"Millions have been in isolation for months"

Presumably they arent limited to tiny bedrooms.
Lockdown in your own home is entirely different to lockdown in a hall of residence.

This.^

being shut in an 8 foot by 10 foot bedroom that isn't even familiar to you, with no friends or family nearby, perhaps afraid that you might get ill, and at the mercy of "authorities" who get to decide how long you have to stay in there.

Not every first year student knew what they were getting at all, as many of these threads have shown.

DD's f2f sessions have reduced massively from what she was told was happening less than a fortnight ago.

Her university, like many, told them they were to be welcomed into university that x y and a would be on, open or going ahead.

Reality is their events don't happen, f2f is massively reduced to a bare minimum and whole blocks of flats, rather than individual households, are being locked down. The latter would not happen in any other flat accommodation in society so this was not to be expected.

The reality is a great many students have not got what they were told at all and we, as a country, have let them down and continue to do so.

The lack of empathy on MN from some quarters regarding students has been eye opening as to how little we care about the young adults in our country.

I know I could have 100% relied on my parents to come and get me in this situation and I would do the same for my DD.

I don't see why your household would have to isolate unless your DD showed symptoms as she is the close contact, not you.

If not now then definitely after the 14 days because it will only keep happening.

Aragog, I was one of many lecturers worried about bringing all students back to halls. We foresaw that this would result in students locked up and teaching being disrupted.

The thing is, our experience is that social distancing face-to-face seminars (which is our main form of teaching) are not better pedagogically than online seminars. It is no longer easy to do the kind of teaching that we know provides the best learning experience - small discussions seminars where students sit together and take the initiative. Sitting socially distanced in a lecture hall with a face mask and your tutor behind a Perspex screen can be a complete spontaneity killer. In my experience, Teams meetings actually work better to get a lively discussion- and I'm a complete technophobe.

Of course the moment one student is identified as infected every course that contains one student or tutor they have interacted with has to go online anyway. Students who already need to be shielding miss out on group discussions unless these take place online (we can't record for privacy reasons and zooming in doesn't really work well when the other students have to shout from the back of a socially distanced lecture theatre).

We can't use our best rooms because they are too small for keeping even moderately safe. I will be teaching 16 students in a massive lecture theatre, spaced out at 2 metre distance, not allowed to turn round and look at each other, all wearing face masks, myself also wearing a face mask and standing behind a Perspex screen. Can't see it exactly engendering a spontaneous and lively discussion.

Yet everybody with no experience of academic teaching keeps insisting that only f2f teaching counts.

The other fact is that many lecturers are in the vulnerable category. We can't suddenly sack everybody who is older and has some common underlying health issue and magic up new healthy young lecturers out of nowhere. So a lot of teaching has to take place online because people are shielding (and I also have shielding students).

I have a colleague who was infected in March and is still off sick, far too ill to even teach online. That means everything she could have contributed to the student experience is no longer available.

Believe me, everything is going to be less perfect than it was without a pandemic. But I feel I could do a decent job of it- for all my students- if I were allowed to do it consistently online from the start, not keep jumping backwards and forwards as the pandemic flows and ebbs. I am not allowed.

And yes, I miss the physical presence too. I miss not being able to sit in the afternoon with my office door open so students can just pop their head round. I miss not walking through the cafeteria and seeing them huddled together over my seminar text. I will miss not being able to bring coffee and gingerbread in at Christmas. But we can't have that just now.

Personally, I'd be going up there and fetching her back. I can't understand why the university students are having more stringent lockdowns than the local communities around them.
And I wouldn't be staying, paying out a load of money for nothing, and end up in debt all for a dreadful university experience.

@Aragog

Not every first year student knew what they were getting at all, as many of these threads have shown.

DD's f2f sessions have reduced massively from what she was told was happening less than a fortnight ago.

Her university, like many, told them they were to be welcomed into university that x y and a would be on, open or going ahead.

Reality is their events don't happen, f2f is massively reduced to a bare minimum and whole blocks of flats, rather than individual households, are being locked down. The latter would not happen in any other flat accommodation in society so this was not to be expected.

The reality is a great many students have not got what they were told at all and we, as a country, have let them down and continue to do so.

The lack of empathy on MN from some quarters regarding students has been eye opening as to how little we care about the young adults in our country.

We haven't let them down! The country hasn't let them down. The university presumably had an offer for that time. We have all been aware since March that the picture is not static and things change day to day. You only had to look at the holiday quarantine lists and local lockdowns. You may have had no foresight and have failed to have advised your children accordingly. But this is noone else's fault. It was to be expected. Those activities would be if covid safe. It is quite obviously not covid safe. Honestly , some of this bleating in the middle of an international pandemic would be laughable in a comedy sketch rather than actual reality!

@SoloMummy your are being harsh.. Of course everyone knew it was going to be different this time round. The issue was, that right up until the very last moment, Universities painted a different picture. Many categorically stated that there would be face to face learning alongside some online. Not that teaching hours would be cut and that it would all be online. In some cases just power pint presentations put up. They also promised a reduced Freshers (that would be safe) again win many places there has been no Freshers, so less opportunity to meet other like minded people.Likewise the majority of societies cannot take place. I think after th year they have had, a lot of students wanted to make a go of it, but hadn't envisioned being trapped (and in many cases) lonely. After all, there's not much for them to do at home is there (no jobs, travel etc) plus they were actively encourage not to defer. So, yes, this years cohort have been caught between a rock and a hard place. The lack of empathy on this thread in some parts has been staggering.

Look people can say what they want but the reality is that many students were ADVISED and ENCOURAGED to go to university, by the universities themselves as well as the government.

Dd was told until a few days before she started and after she had committed to a large rental cost, that she needed to be in the university town as at least 60% would be f2f.

This is not the reality and she is not alone in this.

She has two short sessions a week f2f and the rest is online, a couple live but mainly pre recorded.

She could have done all this from home (or even a student rental in our home town) rather than an expensive rental with strangers, without travelling across the country and putting increasing numbers of people in those towns at risk. She'd be nearer family and known friends, rather than trying to make friends through masks in the rare occasion she's allowed in to a university classroom .

She's not allowed. The second and third years she has gotten to known in the flat below have returned to discover their promised f2f is now 0%!

Of course F2F is going to work better in many subject areas, especially the small group tutorials, than online. I teach - I do know this. I teach every single day with no SDing at all. Of course university would be different as they're old enough to SD and wear masks but the reality is that those F2F sessions, and the F2F social events, are essential for new students in a new town.

Universities should have been upfront about the reality of what they'd be offering.

I don't blame individual lecturers and tutors, but the government and those at the top of the university chain should have put student welfare and the student's experience before money.

@WanderingMilly

Personally, I'd be going up there and fetching her back. I can't understand why the university students are having more stringent lockdowns than the local communities around them. And I wouldn't be staying, paying out a load of money for nothing, and end up in debt all for a dreadful university experience.

OK, she fetches her back, and then what? Quarantine at home with her? OP goes to work so presumably she can’t do that. So the alternative is to fetch back someone exposed to covid (who should be quarantining) and then go out to work as normal. I’m not sure you’d be as approving if OP was your coworker.

*In my experience, Teams meetings actually work better to get a lively discussion- and I'm a complete technophobe.
*

This can be true when the members already know one another, so maybe for later in the year and for second and third years. But for first years who have never met it can be really really difficult.

I teach. I know teaching with SDibg is hard. I actually teach little ones so it's all impossible but have many friends who teach older secondary and sixth form. Sixth form would be the most like - so often classes of 20-25 students aged 17/18y. These are happening f2f every day without mask, albeit with SDing between staff and students. The same could be happening for 18/19y students in a university IMO. After all they've paid £9k for this!

People who live with someone who is SI due to possible contact do not need to SI themselves in norm.

Whether we think that's right or not is a different issue though.

aragog where has yr young adult been since March? Not aware of Covid and consequences when infected or those u have been in contact with have it and measures that would be put in? It's been happening all over the country since March. To think it would not affect you, universities schools and socialising is ridiculous. It's what it is and no one's fault. We ALL know about Covid.

I'm not normally one to be outraged, but the way uni students have been treated has really got me. These are young people, who although being adults, are at an extremely vulnerable stage of their lives. They're paying through the nose for services they are not getting. I fully appreciate that they need to isolate, but people living in tower blocks with a case or two of the virus have not been treated the same way. It just feels so heavy handed and shoddy.

I have no advice that hasn't already been suggested, but I really think the situation should have been made more explicit to students before going back or starting, so that they could possibly distance learn from home (since very little is running in physical form anyhow) or defer a year.

And we were daft enough to believe what the universities told us. That there'd be 60% f2f, that there'd be some f2f social events during induction week, that they were being welcomed into university.

We, and many others , took the universities at their word.

Bearing in mind that as someone working in schools, along with knowing many people who work in schools with all ages, we believed this would happen - as it's happening across the school communities for children and young people right up to aged 18/19 in schools - some of DD's friends are 18 and doing a third year at sixth form.

After a horrific few months of bereavements and cancellations, as a family, we were ready to believe that universities had fit their act together and were ready to resume with some level of normality in the same way that schools and sixth forms had.

We did not realise that they weren't going to act on their assurances and cancel most of it with less than a week before starting.

We didn't realise that universities would treat students entirely different to the rest of the country by locking up whole blocks of flats - they aren't doing this for any other set of flats in the country, only student ones.

In short, we trusted what the universities were telling us would happen and we had no reason not to, as - as I've said - I work in education and schools and sixth forms, many with young adults the same age or similar are doing just that.

And we were daft enough to believe what the universities told us. That there'd be 60% f2f, that there'd be some f2f social events during induction week, that they were being welcomed into university.

That was based on a UK alert level of three. It has increased to 4 very recently which means things had to change in universities. If you think the universities should have predicted that perhaps you should have predicted it yourself. They have guidelines which have to be followed and these are online so you could have read them yourself rather than assuming the situation would be the same as in schools. You also chose to go on a private hall which wasn't a good idea at all. Again, that was your decision.

There was no offer of a university hall until a few days before term started. By that time we had hot have sorted out other accommodation. That was caused the governments monumental mess up of the exam results. Dd has had enough messing about to not try and least sort out accommodation for her before she started. As it is the private halls could be the saving grace this year -
though we will be stuck paying for them regardless at least she won't be one of the ones locked in by a university!

Not one person can answer why 17-19y are being taught full time f2f in classes of 20-25 with limited restrictions in a sixth form but why 18-19y can't be taught for 60% (that was the assured percent a week before) of their time f2f in similar sided groups. Dd in her two f2f groups is with 18 other people - this was the same size groups as the groups last year so it isn't a staffing/room issue.

Why is there such a huge difference?

As it happens at present Dd is perfectly fine and happy but as her parents we know what she's missing out on and what she should be getting for her money but isn't. After the dreadful experiences she's had in recent months we hoped for better.

Things could have been managed way better and we are now just seeing poor excuses for young people being tested poorly.

Anyway I will leave this thread now and hide it. People clearly only want to throw barely hidden insults and insinuations around now about individual young people and parents. I repeat - the lack of empathy on MN especially regarding young people in recent times is staggering.

There was no offer of a university hall until a few days before term started. By that time we had hot have sorted out other accommodation. That was caused the governments monumental mess up of the exam results. Dd has had enough messing about to not try and least sort out accommodation for her before she started.

The mess up of exam results is not the University's fault . The guidelines that they have to follow are not their fault either .I still think that you had a choice. DD was in the same position last year as she had to wait for an exam remark which was very delayed. By the time she got a place it was only a few days before the start of term and there was no accommodation. We decided to wait as there will always be students who drop out. She got somewhere in university halls a couple of days for the start of term.

Not one person can answer why 17-19y are being taught full time f2f in classes of 20-25 with limited restrictions in a sixth form but why 18-19y can't be taught for 60% (that was the assured percent a week before) of their time f2f in similar sided groups. Dd in her two f2f groups is with 18 other people - this was the same size groups as the groups last year so it isn't a staffing/room issue.

I have answered. Firstly not all the students are aged 17 to 19. Some are older and will be at higher risk. Secondly, the guidance for universities has been different to that of schools. www.gov.uk/government/publications/higher-education-reopening-buildings-and-campuses/higher-education-reopening-buildings-and-campuses#introduction

ClarencesMum - It’s not “barbaric”
She’s in a nice warm flat/room with food bring brought to her. She has technology to make her life easier and stay in touch. Stop catastrophising.
I feel immensely sorry for all these young people who are having to self isolate but they will cope if we give them the support and encouragement to do so. It is only for 14 days after all and I’m sure she can be getting on with some studying. No it’s not ideal and not a great way to start uni but kids are resilient.

Of course there will be those people who have mental health issues and their parents know them best. If they feel they are at risk then the only option is to go and fetch them home for their safety.

Op I hope your daughter manages to get through the next few days and comes out of it knowing she’s done her best to protect other people. I would send a parcel. If you go rushing up there then it may make her feel worse once you’ve gone back home.

I can’t believe people are still debating this. When it was the older generation locked in care homes (with more than one room) there was outrage. These poor university students are being kept in a room only big enough for a single bed. A window that opens a few inches for safety. The op has already said she cannot get post due to not being allowed to the central post room. I didn’t see what was said re food but there has been a lot mentioned on the news regarding students who are told if they leave to go to the shop they can’t go back - so they can’t get food. Or if they can, they have no kitchen to cook it in.

Did anyone see the news lately? Student in Newcastle found dead.

It’s fucking barbaric and it is inhumane. Also, you can not compare this to Anne frank/ww1/ww2. It’s ridiculous. It’s like comparing ‘at least you can go to Tesco, our ancestors in the Stone Age used to hunt for their chicken’

Have a bit of heart. It’s an awful situation to be in. I’m sorry for your daughter, OP.

teach. I know teaching with SDibg is hard. I actually teach little ones so it's all impossible but have many friends who teach older secondary and sixth form. Sixth form would be the most like - so often classes of 20-25 students aged 17/18y. These are happening f2f every day without mask, albeit with SDing between staff and students.

Teaching in a school is very, very different, both pedagogically and logistically. You can't draw conclusions about what works best in an academic setting from what works with school children.

Nor what works from a safety point of view from a school with at most a few thousand pupils to a university with over 20,000. All of whom do a different set of modules with different people in them so you can't just isolate a bubble of 30 or even 100 students.

Also, in an ordinary school, pupils haven't just travelled all over the country, so the risk of them spreading new infection to the area is much smaller.

Further, our students are adults

• we can't control what they do in their spare time unless by locking them in (which I really do not approve of!). And even then, most of our students don't live in halls. Our students had been given all possible warnings about responsible behaviour: it didn't take many hours before the neighbours were complaining about large house parties.

So we've got these students coming from all over the country, mixing with far, far larger groups of people also coming from all over the country- don't you see that our infection precautions need to be on a different scale if we want to keep both students and the local community safe?

And that those precautions do actually have the potential to interfere with pedagogy?

@Ilovemycat13

I can’t believe people are still debating this. When it was the older generation locked in care homes (with more than one room) there was outrage. These poor university students are being kept in a room only big enough for a single bed. A window that opens a few inches for safety. The op has already said she cannot get post due to not being allowed to the central post room. I didn’t see what was said re food but there has been a lot mentioned on the news regarding students who are told if they leave to go to the shop they can’t go back - so they can’t get food. Or if they can, they have no kitchen to cook it in.

Did anyone see the news lately? Student in Newcastle found dead.

It’s fucking barbaric and it is inhumane. Also, you can not compare this to Anne frank/ww1/ww2. It’s ridiculous. It’s like comparing ‘at least you can go to Tesco, our ancestors in the Stone Age used to hunt for their chicken’

Have a bit of heart. It’s an awful situation to be in. I’m sorry for your daughter, OP.

I don’t think you can compare care homes and universities, for a start I didn’t hear of any care homes having parties despite being told not to.

I do have sympathy for students, and I know it won’t have been all of them, but some haven’t acted responsibly at all, and the rest are now paying the price with very strict measures.

I think universities should invest in mass testing programs as many of these students will be asymptomatic but positive, so can only see this continuing otherwise, unless they can learn to keep more distant.

Why not? People are comparing Anne frank.

I understand it’s not the same, but they are still people; just as the people in the care homes are. If it was me, or my daughter, I wouldn’t be happy

I think universities should invest in mass testing programs as many of these students will be asymptomatic but positive, so can only see this continuing otherwise, unless they can learn to keep more distant.

Yes the government should have prepared for and funded tests for every student when they arrived, and then a week later. That would have helped.

I really do not approve of locking students up in halls.

But we cannot both provide safe f2f teaching and have students moving around cross-bubbles and organising parties. Something has got to give.

In the same way as we cannot both offer a reduction in fees and promise there will still be lecturers there to teach students whether online or f2f. Something has got to give. Loans for buildings are fixed costs, the only way the university can save money is by sacking staff.