AIBU to think a job is a job at the moment and to take what you can get for now?

[LastGoldenDaysOfSummer]

Friend's grandson has been applying for jobs since May. He graduated with a 2:2 in June. He hasn't even been offered an interview for his field, which isn't surprising with the Covid Effect.

His mum is a single parent in a low paid job but he is refusing to give her any money from his benefits. He is always complaining about not having any money and tries to borrow from the rest of the family.

My friend knows someone who runs a nursing home and she has offered him weekend shifts in the kitchen and laundry. He says it's beneath him. His mum said it was just to help out until he got a job he wanted. Huge row and she has said that if he doesn't start contributing he will have to leave because she can't afford to keep him and his siblings.

My friend is panicking because she's afraid he'll turn up in her doorstep.

AIBUto think he should take the shifts for now and keep trying for another job?

People struggle to get a job straight after graduation even in 'normal times', so obviously it's harder now.

He should absolutely be paying keep if he's still living with his mum at the age of at least 21 for goodness sake, and yes, a job is a job. A period of unemployment will look bad when he's applying for jobs he actually wants.

I graduated with a 1:1 and student of the year in a core subject. I worked as a health care assistant in nursing homes for 2 years after i graduated and I'm still incredibly thankful for that time, because it meant i could stand on my own feet. I looked for jobs at the same time and eventually managed to land a role that needed a degree, but paid less than my nursing job. It had better prospects though and 10 years later I'm now a higher rate tax payer, but at the start, you take what you can get.

Why is your friend, a grown woman, “panicking”?
Just send him home.
I wouldn’t even suggest a rental amount, as she’s a bit stuck then if he moves in but fails to pay.

Your friend needs to listen to him, commiserate that life isn’t easy... then tell him to go home, keep applying for jobs, and give his mum board from his benefits.

No panic needed.

@AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken never thought of it that way. I still wouldn't go back and do my dissertation all over again. :( not mate how easy google would make it for me.

Of course you are right. He's behaving like a child and the only way to stop him doing so is to show him that he has to grow up and contribute to the home he lives in and to society generally.

YANBU. I know someone whose DD graduated this summer. She's currently working for Public Health England answering phone calls from the public about Covid.

Obviously she has a degree, and they're a uni-educated, professional-job type family, but neither she nor any of them (nor I) think it's 'beneath her'. a) it's an important job and b) she's working and many people aren't.

My DS got a First as we came out of the last recession and took a job in an unrelated field on 18k a year with a 100 mile round journey because it was a job. Turned out he loved it and has since been promoted twice and earnings have almost doubled.

Waste of money going to uni, but this young man needs to get out there and take anything, it may end up being the job for him.

He needs to get over himself. He's just graduated with a shiny certificate, no experience
He's competing with people with years of experience and qualifications, take what you can get and then look, at least there's money coming in to help his mother while he's waiting for the high paid job that he's owed because he's been to University....
Spoilt little twat

Sorry I meant for my son it was a waste of
Money going to uni.

@mypetEufy

I literally can't think of one connection from university who was solidly middle class and went on to work in a minimum wage job, even as a stopgap if they didn't get a graduate job straight away.

What do you call 'solidly middle class'? As you say MC is a wide category in the UK. I am what I consider to be MC by background (grew up in desirable village in South East, graduate professional parents, grammar school, Oxbridge tradition) - is that 'solid'? Or are you only talking about privately educated children of 'doctor/lawyer/banker' type parents?

If I had two job applicants in front of me, same qualifications etc and I had to choose, then I would choose the applicant who was willing to do anything while they were looking their first career job. It’s all experience, interracting with colleagues and customers, learning work disciplines. My niece graduated last year and refuses to apply for anything that doesn’t match her law degree. Plenty of the supermarkets nearby were recruiting, and she has retail experience from a Saturday job. I would wonder why nobody had employed her/why she hadn’t applied for anything

[quote mypetEufy]@Asterion
You must know a lot better off, better connected middle class people than I do grin Round here they struggle to get jobs just like everybody else.

I literally can't think of one connection from university who was solidly middle class and went on to work in a minimum wage job, even as a stopgap if they didn't get a graduate job straight away.

They all had it sorted: loads had parents who funded postgraduate study, some went on to volunteer in an area of interesting or throw themselves into good causes whilst living with parents, some did gap years abroad, one got money from parents to set up a niche business.

I assume some of them did struggle to find the kind of job they might have wanted initially but none of them ended up doing laundry or washing up in a care home, or had to work their way up in any way.[/quote]
You obviously don’t know that many middle class people then. I’m classed as middle class, I had Saturday jobs throughout school and summer jobs at uni. I got a good job after uni, not because I got help from my parents or had connections, but because I worked hard and got a good 2:1, had work experience doing numerous waitressing/bar work jobs and spent time applying for loads of graduate jobs. If others can’t be bothered to do that then that’s their problem, but it’s not a class thing!

Oh and I graduated in a recession (2009) and still managed to get a good job through hard work so it can be done, too many people have excuses nowadays!

Am surprised he gets benefits tbh. I didn't after uni, wasn't eligible due to household income.

Getting a job is hard enough when you graduate - I had a 1st in my BA and a Masters and it took me 4 months from graduation to secure a job in my desired field. Even then I started as an Apprentice.

With a 2:2 nowadays he's essentially bombed it and needs to take what he can get especially during Covid.

He's in for a rude awakening if he thinks he's anything special with a crap grade in a global pandemic when over 50% of young people go to uni.

People with this attitude piss me off.

So rather than do any job he’d rather be leaching off the state. I had a friend who had been looking for work, and I sent her a couple of links to companies who were hiring at the time and she said “thank you but those jobs just don’t excite me.” She’d been unemployed for eight years I’ve been looking for work now for a few years and if I could I would go and work on a supermarket checkout, but because I am visually impaired and tills etc just aren’t accessible I don’t have that option.

Beggars can’t be choosers. And if I were hiring and had two candidates one of whom had been working and the other sitting on his arse there’s no way I’d employ the lazy fucker who thought that only my job was up to his standards.

Lazy and entitled. Even a first from Oxbridge doesn’t entitle you to be like that. Back in the real world it’s a poor degree in generic subjects. Has he got any work experience in these areas at all?!

It’s sad when people say a certain type of work is beneath them. I’m sure he’s disappointed and annoyed but I agree it would be best to take a job, get a foot in the door and something to put on a CV.

I also think there are mental health benefits that come from working and earning your own money. It gives you confidence.

Another one with a 2:2 here; I also had to "get over myself" after I graduated and go and do quite a few jobs I'd really rather not have done. I also had to go and get some useful vocational qualifications to go with that fancy first bit of academic wallpaper (though my 2:2 was brought down, marks wise, as I foolishly chose to do a module in the notoriously pompous English and Drama department in my final year. If I'd just stuck with my joint honours subjects it would have been a reasonably decent 2:1). It did mean, as others have said, that a lot of graduate schemes and civil service rounds were closed to me automatically. Having met some of the people who were successful in those areas, I actually think I'm thankful I didn't end up on the cookie cutter graduate conveyor belt, but anyway...

Those tough jobs I had to do to fund my final year at uni and after I graduated (everything from waitressing to customer service to REALLY boring data entry, though it ultimately led to some of the very nice jobs I've done since) have served me very well in the long run though. I live with someone who has a nursing degree from one of the top universities in South Africa, another degree in International Studies with Sustainability obtained in the UK, and over 20 years' of experience at senior level in the NHS. Doesn't stop them happily doing the ironing if that's what the home they're at needs when on shift! (Doesn't happen all that often, to be fair, it's usually registered nursing duties like medication and supervision, but the point is they certainly don't see it as beneath them.)

I think he needs to wise up, as they say, and appreciate that it was tough even before COVID-19. And take what he can get, for now.

@LastGoldenDaysOfSummer

When friends ask for advice or an opinion Do some people here say, "Not my business"?

How very strange. In my friendship group we talk over each other's problems and ask for and receive advice. Some people here seem to lead a very insular life.

Thanks for the thoughts from the majority. It reinforces what we're thinking. He does need a reality check and to make some attempt to pay his own way.

I suspect this is less about ‘giving and receiving advice’ and more about you wanting to give this lazy young man a bit of a bashing.

I posted on here the other day about us having no interest in our advertised job vacancies.

The one exception to that is for our trainee roles. This year in particular, I know a lot of organisations have pulled their trainee roles due to difficulties with remote onboarding. This means that the competition for any remaining trainee roles are greater than ever. I doubt anyone with a 2:2 would even get a look in unless they were Oxbridge, as employers have so much choice.

That said, I don't just look at the degree classification of trainees. I'm much more likely to recruit someone that has filled their time working in a bar/restaurant/warehouse/care home as it shows they aren't scared of hard work rather than someone who has just sat around waiting for the right opportunity to come up.

Your friends son appears to meet neither criteria.

It’s sad when people say a certain type of work is beneath them.

These are usually the type of people who treat waiting and shop staff like shit as well.

@Cbatothinkofausername

I suspect this is less about ‘giving and receiving advice’ and more about you wanting to give this lazy young man a bit of a bashing.

And you would be wrong. You seem overinvested, any particular reason?

I mean he needs to find a temporary job. Retail/hospitality or something - I worked for 3 years in jobs like that before I got a “proper” job after uni!

BUT - I got a job in a kitchen and lasted 5 minutes bloody hated it - not for me - and I wouldn’t do the job you describe ether probably! He can find something else - but agree he has to something that’s “beneath”him

He needs to get any job he can and decide what field he wants to work in and start doing a professional qualification on day release or something. He could try getting an admin job and go for a professional qualification in Marketing or Accountancy.

These days degrees are ten a penny and are just something most people do after school. Tbh, I think it must be really hard to fail a degree.

I saw someone on TV at a university the other day who had gone back expecting 8 hours tuition a week and was upset that they were only getting 4. I was thinking "Wtf? 8 hours tuition?" Uni must be a right doss these days.

Clearly his non existent understanding of how Economic theory translates into real world reality explains why he got a 2:2.

Haha true!

Even the pub business has opportunity for advancement for those who are willing to work hard and be flexible, a cousin of mine works in this area, his job is arranging and recruiting temp managerial cover when owners and licensees need time off - usually for vacation but also if they're needing medical treatment etc he started out as a "pot washer" at 16 which was allowed then, and worked his way up within a particular brewery company.

ANY industry you can work your way up

I've started off on factory production lines then advanced to admin and management roles, same in hospitality and retail.

Good employers will recognise good workers however they come across them.

My mum for many many years worked "shop floor" retail - supermarkets - as a trailing spouse with 3 kids to work around (dad was army so couldn't be totally relied upon for out of hours childcare as he might be on exercise or deployed), when dad retired and they moved back home she again got a checkout job initially, her boss recognised her wealth of experience and aptitude for assessing people quickly and moved her into customer services, then an opening in security management came up and he put her forward for that. She was a little bit concerned she didn't have the usual qualifications for the role but he was very much keen for her to have the role as she is excellent at sizing people up and spotting dodgy situations before they get out of hand and at calming aggressive/agitated people down.

She got the job and spent 15 years very happily in that role before retiring including working with local police etc to close down shoplifting rings etc

The benefits his mother got while he was in education stopped. Where is she supposed to make up that shortfall while he's still consuming everything he did before?

exactly!

Pitman typing course from my parents for my birthday

wow! That brings back memories! I think every babysitter we had was studying for pitman shorthand exams! Notebooks full of squiggles they were translating into longhand

Totally true about connections and contacts being found in basic jobs, myself and many friends/family have had that happen a lot. Care work actually (normally maybe not so much at the moment) bring you into contact with a lot of people from a wide variety of backgrounds, I remember at one I worked at the accountant got "poached" off us by a hotelier, big pay increase for her, one of my factory jobs someone I worked with's sibling worked at a large solicitors office and I got a middle management admin role out of that connection...

Plus the transferable skills and basic proof of certain attributes in ANY job that employers like to see - good time keeping, rarely off sick, willing to do overtime, work well with others etc

Some sofa loafer who's sponging off his impoverished mum wont be seen as a better option than the applicant who's grafted their way through uni and taken the first shelf stacking job they can get and grabbed as many hours as possible.

@dontdisturbmenow excellent post though (lightheartedly) have to say my family we all worked from 14 in part time jobs - me and siblings and then dd. We did "Saturday jobs" in corner shops etc, delivering newspapers, babysitting, car washing, dog walking...

Like you I think it's great for kids to have a little financial independence and employment experience early on. I remember very fondly the double denim outfit and hideous top and earrings I bought with my hard earned babysitting money (for a school disco! And yes I bloody melted - idiot! )

Dd remembers buying her first lot of contouring Make up with hers 

@VeniceQueen2004 even living in a shared house is seen as degrading to a lot of today's youngsters, dd has had words with several friends on that score! Friends moaning about paying keep at home but also considering a house share beneath them but not earning enough or working full time hours so they can afford a place of their own.

It really is down to the parents, I've known these families throughout dds high school time until now and sometimes longer and it's absolutely the ones that were mollycoddled that are now giving the parents most stress!

Parents like me who either out of necessity or principle expected dc to help around the house, learn to do chores, get a part time job to supplement pocket money for the stuff teens are into which is not cheap! Were portrayed as being too tough on our kids!

Those kids are now the ones that have jobs, are applying themselves well if studying (and also have at least one part time job plus take on extra work in holidays), cope well living away from home, have learned to drive etc (dd yet to achieve that one - her co-ordination isn't great due to disability, she's trying though)

@mypetEufy be very interested in your definition of middle class, at best what you're describing is certainly upper middle class if not lower upper class

And even then that's not my experience at all, I know and am friends with people from all kinds of backgrounds inc one friend who is from an extremely wealthy background and even he was expected by his family to volunteer to get work experience and understand the real world! He's not remotely entitled in attitude and fully appreciates his privileged background. He does a hell of a lot for a number of small charities which are close to his heart, because he feels larger charities get enough support and publicity and he likes to support smaller and often more ethical ones.

My other friends who come from the kind of background you're describing were also expected to pull their weight and not just expect parents to throw money at and solve all their problems for them!

A good few of them could have strictly speaking been subsidised by their parents while at uni, the only ONE who was is severely dyslexic with other health issues too so she needed the support so that she could spend a little more time on studies and have some rest periods as she'd get exhausted with the health impacts.

@AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken totally agree, I did my degrees in 2 separate decades but one pre and one post internet. The difference is immense! I'm annoyed at myself for just missing out on a first with the latter one as it was so much easier

The first - trawling through hard copy medical textbooks (with pages missing if they were library copies!) and journals and typing assignments up on an electric typewriter (and I was lucky with that! Other students had manuals or had to pay someone to type up for them) with carbon copies (the frustration of having to start a whole page all over again because you were nearly at the end and a key jammed or the carbon copy got crumpled up!) absolutely maddening!

Also very true that basic jobs can lead you into fields you might not have considered and thoroughly enjoy once in that industry.

I have friends who had various degrees unrelated to their final roles which they absolutely love

These include

Stem graduate who ended up in advertising
Law graduate who ended up in social work
Arts graduate who ended up in mental health

Actually thinking about it, it could be dwp gives him the kick up the arse! He won't be able to keep claiming without in genuine good faith applying for and considering realistic offers.

I'm on benefits due to disability and the hoops I have to jump through are significant

@Sophiafour my ex colleagues are now at a point where they're training nursing students and recent nursing graduates and "that's not my job" is their most hated phrase! It's not true of all but a significant minority think it's beneath them to do things like:

Obs
Stool and urine charting
Blood draws
Bed changes
Bed baths/personal care etc

It drives them nuts! Not least because not only are these tasks crucial to patient care you can ascertain important information while doing them and create a rapport with patients which often means they're more likely to tell you if a new symptom or issue appears.

These are usually the type of people who treat waiting and shop staff like shit as well. yep!