School forcing 8am start for my SEN girl?

[emmapemma91]

So I’m having quite a lot of bother with my little girls school. She’s not settling in very well and becoming very distressed when going into school and can become aggressive.
She’s waiting on assessment for possible Autism. She’s 6 and in year 2.

She’s on a reduced timetable at the minute but the school are forcibly telling me they want her in at 8am to give her time to settle before her class come in at 8.45. I’ve told them each time my sons school taxi comes sometime between 8.15 - 8.25 and I can’t get her there, chase her around while she tries to run away, then carry her into school then be back in time for my sons taxi. Yet every day they say the same thing, she hasn’t settled and needs to be in 8am. If I miss his taxi I can’t get him to school as I don’t drive and it’s quite far away.

Is there any solution? I’m sick of fighting with the school to support my daughter.

@Ghosts2020

To all who responded, I took this to 3 senior officials in children's care provisions for a Northern Council including an individual who has almost 20 years in social work and send leadership and yes that is the correct answer. You would be baffled as to how many parents exaggerate or stamp their feet. If it were a case of all plans were already in place I could understand but more than often it is simply a parent pushing for preferential treatment when not legally permitted or financial gain.

It really isn't. Your officials in children's care provision do not trump what the law and the courts actually say. In any event, the child care department does not have responsibility either for SEN or home to school transport and I certainly would never go to unqualified officials in that department for advice on SEN law.

The idea that a parent pushing for an EHCP is doing so for financial gain is utterly laughable. How on earth do you imagine they gain financially from them?

[quote Ghosts2020]@onceuponatimethen I have to inform you you are spreading misinformation which is detrimental to school systems. Please refrain from spreading inaccuracies.[/quote]
Precisely what misinformation are you alleging? And do you have an actual provable basis for what you're saying?

@DarkMintChocolate, add to your list parents who are seriously misled by schools and local authorities about what the criteria for assessment actually are.

It's far more concerning how many LA's have unlawful blanket policies. Across the board, not just SEND, Social Services are quite renowned for it.

OP I think you are setting yourself by trying to accommodate the early start. They're trying to catch you out and say it is possible for you to do it, you simply must stop. Send an email saying that it is not viable for your partner to give up employment to accommodate the school's request she be there before 8am and leave it at that. Don't engage in it any more.

@DobbinReturns i did send emails, and each time she told me (basically every day on pickup) I would reiterate it but she was very pushy. That’s why when she offered a member of staff to be there at 7.45 I agreed I would try this.
Unfortunately she didn’t open the gates until 8 when other children were there for breakfast club. I just give up.

Sadly we have a system whereby if a parent isn’t able to scream and shout from the rooftops then it’s unlikely you will get the right support in place

my understanding was refusal to assess - parents most likely to win
refusal to issue - more likely LA to win
contents BF &/or I is more difficult because any win in terms of content is attributed to a parental win. So could lose to LA on section I which most parents would consider a loss but if have won provision in B&F it's still recorded as a win.

@emmapemma91 I really know how it feels, the pressure and manipulation. My son's last school asked me to provide sweet snacks which I dutiful did, and they then tried to use this against me?!? honestly, with this kind of school they will constantly find ways to blame you. If you do get her there early every day there will soon be something else.

"The idea that a parent pushing for an EHCP is doing so for financial gain is utterly laughable. How on earth do you imagine they gain financially from them?"

It will be from the old " parents try to get a diagnosis because it gets them benefits" bollocks. Which of course has absolutely nothing to do with getting an ehcp.

"contents BF &/or I is more difficult because any win in terms of content is attributed to a parental win."

We went on B,F and I. The LA agreed to all our B and F and we agreed to their school when they finally named one. We went to force them to name a school and had named an expensive school that definitely had a place to force them to name something. So on paper it could look like we lost I but we got what we wanted.

You tried and they messed up.

Email saying you were there at the time prescribed and were left outside for 15 minutes. Say you tried but it obviously didn't work as they weren't prepared for her.

@DarkMintChocolate

Oh absolutely - I'm not saying that all who could appeal do appeal. The current system lets down many. I was simply stating that saying that the LA is wrong is 90% of cases is factually incorrect and could become a dangerous false narrative.

In my area, the LA doesn't go to tribunal on parental EHCPs as they simply can't afford it. If a parent pushes for it, they often just reverse the decision. A few years ago, they were hit quite badly when they (rightly) lost a case at tribunal and ended up having to fund a bunch of additional costs which, over the life of the EHCP, will be hundreds of thousands of pounds. They won't risk that again.

"I was simply stating that saying that the LA is wrong is 90% of cases is factually incorrect and could become a dangerous false narrative."

I said that the LA were wrong in 90% of cases that got as far as tribunal which is factually correct.

@KeepOnKeepingOnAgainandAgain thank tot for that reply it’s such a big help. They’re calling it a ‘staged return’ rather than a reduced timetable, as she had only been there 2 days before they imposed it.

So they must have a plan to bring her back full time, ask for a copy of it in writing. I’d also be asking what their plan is to actually educate your child because physically having her in school isn’t enough.

In terms of today, I’d email clearly outlining how you did what they asked and the outcome clearly saying you aren’t able to keep facilitating this and specifically asking about other options they have to help your child access her right to education.

What a fucking nonsense.

@Spikeyball

"I was simply stating that saying that the LA is wrong is 90% of cases is factually incorrect and could become a dangerous false narrative."

I said that the LA were wrong in 90% of cases that got as far as tribunal which is factually correct.

Parents win 90% of Sendist Tribunals which shows that 90% of the time Local Authorities were not following the law.

90% of the time is not the same as 90% of the tribunal cases. As I said before, 90% of the tribunal cases could be as low as 10% to 20% of the time. We'd need to know:

• how many applications are made,
• how many are accepted,
• how many are rejected,
• of the rejected, how many are taken to tribunal,
• of those, how many are won.

That's information we don't have in this thread and so saying 90% of the time is factually incorrect.

"90% of the time is not the same as 90% of the tribunal cases."

I know that. The 90% is referring to the subset of cases which go to tribunal which is why I said "were" and not "are". I don't have the data for all the other cases.

I think it would be impossible to know how much law breaking goes on overall although the amount of unlawful blanket policies tells you a lot.

@Spikeyball

I think it would be impossible to know how much law breaking goes on overall although the amount of unlawful blanket policies tells you a lot.

Each LA seems to have policies on EHCPs that are different to, and more harsh than, the national regulations. For me, that just makes me ask why. What is it that makes the LAs set policies like that?

Is it lack of money to actually support EHCPs? I know that seems to be the case in my LA. We have higher than the average number of EHCP and some of them are very expensive so the LA seems to be struggling to pay any new ones.

Is it that the LAs see the thresholds in the law around EHCP as being too low?

Is it that there is some kind of unknown and hidden target around lower EHCP numbers or rejections (like the company who manage DLA face-to-face meetings)?

What is causing the LAs to do this?

@emmapemma91 Your threads seem to have been going on for ages.

How long has this nonsense with the part time schooling actually been going on for? And is your child actually learning anything at school or is she just sitting under the table?

@Ellie56 since the 9th September, and she may have days she’ll do a couple simple tasks such as copying a sentence or odd& even numbers but she mainly won’t co operate.

@emmapemma91 That's 4 weeks already. When is the EP coming in?

Have you tried ringing the LA? She is entitled to a full time education and she's certainly not getting it at the moment.

EP was due to have a virtual appointment last Thursday, school rearranged to this Thursday, but I got told by SENco because she’s working from home she’ll have to put it back another 2 weeks.

I really don’t know what to say to the LA, I haven’t really got the confidence or expertise to challenge them. I was very lucky when my son got his EHCP that the school fully supported it and the EP was amazing.

Tbh arranging an EP within 4 weeks of a child starting school is pretty darn quick.

The EP was halfway through observations at her previous school before lockdown. Because it went through FAP he is able to observe her at her new school.

How long did she manage in school today with their magical early start