To think grandparents need to step up

[mypetEufy]

A friend of mine is a single mum. She struggled to work from home whilst parenting her active nearly 2 year old DD when her nursery was closed. She lives below the breadline, and is reliant on food banks.

During lockdown she often didn't get any kind of break from her DD for weeks on end. A few friends helped now and then, but she has still been run ragged, to the point of her hair falling out.

The thing is, her parents live 20 minutes drive away, they all get on fine, they have some health issues but nothing to stop them helping in one way or another if they really wanted to. They are retired, active and not struggling with money. Friend has been super careful with the virus so her parents are not worried about her passing it on. Both parties are eligible to form a support bubble, if I understand it correctly.

Another friend has recently had a baby, she's a competent professional but struggling with a colicky baby, and interrupted sleep. She had a very difficult labour and is still uncomfortable.

She has has some health conditions which she managed in part, before her daughter was born, by eating a clean diet. She now eats pizza from ASDA most nights. She gets on fine with her parents; mentions what a good cook and baker her mum is. The parents live in the area.

My issue is that I can't fathom how some of my friends' parents aren't helping them when they clearly need some support. The parents are fully aware of the scope of the problems in both these situations. There are numerous other examples I know of in real life and on mn where parents have struggled and their parents have been cheerfully indifferent.

I want to make it clear that I'm not saying grandparents need to provide childcare when their children are at work, or do anything to increase their risk of catching the virus if they uncomfortable (these are grandparents who are happily going to the garden centre, meeting up with friends for lunch, going on holiday and to people's houses).

In both cases the grandparents are enthusiastic grandparents, are keen to be sent photos of their grandchild, enjoy buying presents, and repost those "share if you love being a granny!" posts on fb.

Am I being unreasonable in thinking some grandparents really need to step it up?

I dont want to cause any division and I know a lot of grandparents are amazing, but it's difficult to see my friends struggle. I'm asking here as I've heard mn has a bit of a 'grandparents have no obligation to do anything outlook', and was wondering if there comes a point where grandparents really ought to help?

You only need to read the numerous threads on here about how some Grandparents are treated.....
e.g. My PIL have the news on when my children are there - I’m fummin.
and posts like......My mum wants to have our baby once a week to herself for a morning.
Oh and let’s not forget the crime of the century.....’my mum calls MY baby ‘her little cherub’, he’s mine not hers’.
It’s not surprising therefore that some are reluctant to offer help.

I also think the helping profession is declining. My disabled friend has a hell of a time getting people in without it costing a small fortune. I help as needed like picking up groceries or medications but can't help with housework. In general, it seems like the younger generation don't want this type of responsibility because it's really hard work.

@maddiemookins16mum

You only need to read the numerous threads on here about how some Grandparents are treated..... e.g. My PIL have the news on when my children are there - I’m fummin. and posts like......My mum wants to have our baby once a week to herself for a morning. Oh and let’s not forget the crime of the century.....’my mum calls MY baby ‘her little cherub’, he’s mine not hers’. It’s not surprising therefore that some are reluctant to offer help.

Exactly, not to mention posts about refusing to allow in-laws to visit new babies, interfering DMs and MILs and going no contact.

@maddiemookins16mum

You only need to read the numerous threads on here about how some Grandparents are treated..... e.g. My PIL have the news on when my children are there - I’m fummin. and posts like......My mum wants to have our baby once a week to herself for a morning. Oh and let’s not forget the crime of the century.....’my mum calls MY baby ‘her little cherub’, he’s mine not hers’. It’s not surprising therefore that some are reluctant to offer help.

Exactly.

If you cannot manage to care for your child, don’t have one. Readily available, highly effective contraception out there. Every child deserves to be planned and wanted, welcomed into a home situation that is able to meet their needs.

@DrSK2

Well, to me, grandparents need to provide childcare when their children are at work and step up whenever they are needed. This is part and parcel of being a parent - an obligation to your child. This is what I saw from my lovely parents and hopefully what I will do to my child too. I cannot comprehend the selfishness of otherwise.

You need a reality check. Yes if you have children you are completely responsible for them but adults are not children. Your responsibility ends when you have successfully raised your children into adulthood.

You don’t stop loving them though and you still want the best for them. Adult children become more like equals. Within a family it’s nice if you all look out for each other and want the best for each other. That cuts both ways. It doesn’t mean that grandparents are obligated to provide free childcare.

If someone within that family is struggling, then you do help out. That’s how it is in our family.

@MsTSwift

Read the thread 🙄. No ones “expecting grandparents to raise them” we are talking about refusing to sit with one child while you are in hospital with the other. Would you not even do that for an adult child if you were able? Personally I think that’s bloody awful.

Like the thread on here once by a woman whose healthy, able, local mum wouldn't babysit her gc whilst her DD was in labour. Christ, I'd do that favour for a stranger

If you cannot manage to care for your child, don’t have one

Well I can manage to care for a child, what I can't do is collect one from school whilst sitting in A&E with another...we all need help occasionally

Sadly there will always be people who aren’t very caring, and who refuse to help even their own family.

In the real world, most people do help each other within families. As ever the Internet and especially Mumsnet, is not a representation of the real world.

What isn’t right, is where adult children take advantage of their parents. Making them feel they have an absolute obligation to provide free childcare is so wrong.

YANBU.

I don't understand the 'not their responsibility/not obliged' brigade.

Surely if you love your children you'd want to help out in whatever way you can?
They don't stop being your dc just because they've grown up.
Family is family and being there for one another is what it's about.
Offering emotional support, cooking a meal, helping with cleaning, etc, and giving respite when needed; these are things I'd want to do because I love my dc and dgc. These are things I already do for friends; I would love the opportunity to do these things for my dc too (when they have dc of their own).

I might not be physically fit enough to do childcare day in day out, but I'd certainly want to do what I could to ease their burdens and improve their lives because I love them and want what's best for them.

@Hurtandupset2

YANBU.

I don't understand the 'not their responsibility/not obliged' brigade.

Surely if you love your children you'd want to help out in whatever way you can?
They don't stop being your dc just because they've grown up.
Family is family and being there for one another is what it's about.
Offering emotional support, cooking a meal, helping with cleaning, etc, and giving respite when needed; these are things I'd want to do because I love my dc and dgc. These are things I already do for friends; I would love the opportunity to do these things for my dc too (when they have dc of their own).

I might not be physically fit enough to do childcare day in day out, but I'd certainly want to do what I could to ease their burdens and improve their lives because I love them and want what's best for them.

Helping in times of trouble and being obligated for routine childcare are two different scenarios.

Of course you love your family and they love you.

They are still your offspring when they are adults but they are fully functioning adults, not children. At least they should be fully functioning, if you’ve brought them up properly.

This thread is a bit confused. Families helping each other is one thing, being obligated to provide frequent childcare is another issue.

I’m not a grandparent but do have a grown up daughter. If she had a child I’d like to think I’d help out But on my own terms. I definitely don’t want to feel like I have to help though. I had three young kids with very little outside support, One with severe Disabilities. It was bloody hard work, still is as my son with learning disabilities will need 24/7 care for the rest of his life! It’s a tough job and I’ve been there and done It And don’t want to do it all again.

@Sertchgi123, I've said nothing about GPs being obilgated to provide frequent daily childcare; I simply stated that I don't understand not wanting to help your own children and grandchildren.

It goes both ways though. When those gps who don't, but could help, get to an age when they need support, hospital appointment trips etc, their own children are going to be less inclined to step up.

If you've spent the bulk of your child-rearing years struggling while your spritely parents refuse to even sit with their DGC while you go to A&E with your partner 'because Covid' but you know they've had their hair done yesterday (me btw), you're going to look at things differently when the shit hits the fan in later years.

If you love you care. Simple as that. Adult children should care enough to put too much childcare-related burden on their own parents, and grandparents, if they love their kids and grandkids would love to spend time and provide whatever is in their caring style. For some it's cooking, cleaning, chores, some show it with money. If there's nothing at all, it's very difficult to see where the love is..

Have your friends actually asked them for help and told them they are struggling?
Some parents don't want to interfere and wont until they get asked for help.

As an aunt and a godparent I agree with those who have said that any family member or friend who helps should be able to do so on their own terms and not feel obliged.
Sometimes I’d like to be actually asked more because no one wants to interfere and it’s hard to know when you’re actually needed/wanted.
But being asked is different to being expected to help and no one is obliged. If you have children you should generally be able to look after them, it’s no one else’s automatic responsibility.

If my sister or friends were in crisis I’d help out with their children, of course, but even then years ago I was told to butt out once and it stung.

I’ve heard parents moan about relatives and friends not caring or helping out enough and sometimes you can’t win, if you need help you need to make it clear. Because the same families also want their time to themselves as a little family and others can’t and won’t dance around them.

Plus people have their own lives, I love my family dearly but there are others I care about too and we should also be looking out for our wider social networks and communities. We can be too family centric sometimes at the expense of wider society.

I can't fathom it either OP. It's definitely taught me one thing though, I vouch to be there 100000% if my children do decide to have children of their own one day. I really will do my best to remember those days and be the support I needed.

There are a lot of GPS who live their own very active life and can't/won't do childcare - fair enough. What grinds my gears is when they do the above but also moan about how they don't see family or the DGCs enough, post every photo on Facebook to look like the doting GPs and share all the 'share this if family is the most important thing' etc. Also the expectation that they will be cared for in old age. PIL have been so complicated and awful with childcare I've had to put DD in nursery (won't listen to me at all and brag about it, lie about her being ill/accidents or not, talk about inappropriate things, use emotional blackmail) at great expense. Totally fine and factored in when TTC but MIL talks constantly about moving in or me caring for her in old age (not her son of course, just me) and it drives me potty. The sense of entitlement can go both ways. Obviously I'm now the bad guy for putting DD in nursery and they wonder why i don't contact them to babysit.....

Yes they do need to step up.
I am more exhausted meeting my little ones grandparents ( MIL and DM) because they are only interested in " meeting for lunch" or " going somewhere nice for the day" it's hard work with a 2 year old I need a break not to just meet them and let my daughter entertain them all day. It's muggings here having to navigate her around cuz she doesn't want to be in the pram try and get her in the high chair , find somewhere to change her nappy etc I would rather potter around at home or local to the park etc meeting them is more hard work as they expect so much from us.

I know that I'm extremely lucky to have my dm helping me so much, and she has all the time in the world for her family. Her world revolves around us and all of the grandchildren.

I see other families are not so lucky. Sometimes the grandparents are happy to share pictures on Facebook, and buy gifts at Christmas, but seem very lacking in real, practical help.

@blubberball that's so true . My DM and MIL provide no practical help at all. It's just a day out or lunch out every couple of months. As soon as we meet it's like a photo shoot the phone comes out pictures are taken and yet again I'm the one doing all the motherhood usual tasks while they just take pics and then go home " il leave you to it then" after a couple of hours. No offer to help with anything it's shit and if I ask I just get " I used to clean while they had a nap" or " I used to clean when husband got home" we both work we are both knackered.

@jop67

Yes they do need to step up. I am more exhausted meeting my little ones grandparents ( MIL and DM) because they are only interested in " meeting for lunch" or " going somewhere nice for the day" it's hard work with a 2 year old I need a break not to just meet them and let my daughter entertain them all day. It's muggings here having to navigate her around cuz she doesn't want to be in the pram try and get her in the high chair , find somewhere to change her nappy etc I would rather potter around at home or local to the park etc meeting them is more hard work as they expect so much from us.

Muggins is the parent, who chose to have that child. Grow up and stop expecting other people to parent your child.

@Sertchgi123 I am happy being the parent but I don't want to keep entertaining them with things I wouldn't normally do , that's more work for me . So if they want me to meet them at very specific times for example. They always want to meet to avoid nap time's but DD doesn't always have her nap at the same time. I can't guarantee that DD won't want to nap & they are disappointed. They want to do adult activities and fit her in alongside that oh let's go for a coffee and then yes it is muggings here that knows DD won't sit in a high chair for that long at that time and then I'm dealing with carrying them tantrum etc .

Sertchgi123 Ok, keyboard warrior 🙄 All she said was that she would prefer to meet up with the grandparents in a park or at home, as she is the one running after a toddler in a restaurant. At no point did she mention anything about anyone parenting her child. Just a bit of consideration when thinking of places to meet with a two year.

I can't imagine listening to my daughter telling me she has been working all week, house is a tip her and DH both have colds then I respond with " oh dear I am off out for a day out " do you want to meet me with DD at insert specific time that's also a drive for you. @Sertchgi123