To think grandparents need to step up

[mypetEufy]

A friend of mine is a single mum. She struggled to work from home whilst parenting her active nearly 2 year old DD when her nursery was closed. She lives below the breadline, and is reliant on food banks.

During lockdown she often didn't get any kind of break from her DD for weeks on end. A few friends helped now and then, but she has still been run ragged, to the point of her hair falling out.

The thing is, her parents live 20 minutes drive away, they all get on fine, they have some health issues but nothing to stop them helping in one way or another if they really wanted to. They are retired, active and not struggling with money. Friend has been super careful with the virus so her parents are not worried about her passing it on. Both parties are eligible to form a support bubble, if I understand it correctly.

Another friend has recently had a baby, she's a competent professional but struggling with a colicky baby, and interrupted sleep. She had a very difficult labour and is still uncomfortable.

She has has some health conditions which she managed in part, before her daughter was born, by eating a clean diet. She now eats pizza from ASDA most nights. She gets on fine with her parents; mentions what a good cook and baker her mum is. The parents live in the area.

My issue is that I can't fathom how some of my friends' parents aren't helping them when they clearly need some support. The parents are fully aware of the scope of the problems in both these situations. There are numerous other examples I know of in real life and on mn where parents have struggled and their parents have been cheerfully indifferent.

I want to make it clear that I'm not saying grandparents need to provide childcare when their children are at work, or do anything to increase their risk of catching the virus if they uncomfortable (these are grandparents who are happily going to the garden centre, meeting up with friends for lunch, going on holiday and to people's houses).

In both cases the grandparents are enthusiastic grandparents, are keen to be sent photos of their grandchild, enjoy buying presents, and repost those "share if you love being a granny!" posts on fb.

Am I being unreasonable in thinking some grandparents really need to step it up?

I dont want to cause any division and I know a lot of grandparents are amazing, but it's difficult to see my friends struggle. I'm asking here as I've heard mn has a bit of a 'grandparents have no obligation to do anything outlook', and was wondering if there comes a point where grandparents really ought to help?

My MIL is as you describe. Fit and well, local, doesn't work. Claims to adore the grandchildren but never ever has them for us - ever. She's worse really as she can be needy with DH and has made it clear she'll expect support and care if needed in her final years.

We're very lucky my parents muck in as much as they can, as my grandparents did for them. Obviously I don't know your friend's family dynamic but I will never understand 'normal' people who decide they won't give up any of their time or energy to help out, just because their child is now an adult. Surely if your kid is in need, you help if you can, at any age!

There's a difference between relying on GPs for daily childcare, and asking for the odd babysit at a time to suit, or in a crisis.

@Calabasa

Exactly *@DryIce*. its hypocritical.

It perpetuates the boomer/gen x selfishness. Take the help from their parents when we were little, expecting the help from us when they're old.. but not helping their parents or their kids in return... just take, take, take, me, me, me.

Well I'm Gen X and have young DC - no one helped me (sorry DMIL helped when DD was small - but I never, ever asked. She loved DD and only had one DGC at the time. We always had paid child care and my DM never helped out nor was she expected to although we spent holidays with her and she came to us to visit a lot.

Luckily, I believe in self sufficiency, as do my Gen X sisters, so we will never burden our DC with our care. I did, however, look after my parents when illness struck - it is not the same as expecting them to mind my DC, it is was a thank you for being such wonderful parents to me.

Oh and when I was struggling with my first poorly silent reflux baby when dh was at work I rang my mother. She replied 'oh dear' then proceeded to tell me about the shopping trip she was currently on and the lovely things she was up to.

Wow, that just takes it to the next level. Can't even begin to understand the thought process here.

It’s upsetting to see how we, as a society, have generally dumped mothers and left them to fight far too many fights on their own.
Whatever happened to ‘it takes a village to raise a child’?

Agree

YANBU. Of course it's a GP's right to not offer any help at all, but for an otherwise healthy, well person on one side and assuming no one taking advantage on the other, why wouldn't you help a bit? I hope I will offer help when my children are older. We've spent the last few years (mostly) without much support for lots of (justified and reasonable) reasons but I do think those with helping GPs are v lucky. It's not even the help as much as the relationships they build e.g having tea together, chatting as well as the support of having someone to ask for advice. I miss that.

I also don't see it as one way or entitlement, e.g families help each other and look after each other - because they're family. I'm talking about families with no issues, abuse etc. In RL grandparent involvement, seeing each other frequently or a bit of help seems usual, it's normally distance that gets in the way.

Grandparents have already done their time as parents. They have earned the right to retire and not be expected to take responsibility for their grandchildren

With ever rising retirement ages, a lot of GPs are likely to still be working FT, which is no laughing matter when you're 65 and your health is deteriorating (I speak from experience). And they still have to do all the every day stuff that we all have to do.

I'm not a GP, but I wouldn't have the time or the energy to be much help if I was.

It is hard of course when u see how other families pitch in. My mother expects us to run after her now. Not realistic with your own family. And never any help! She was 60 when I had my son.

Grandparents have already done their time as parents. They have earned the right to retire and not be expected to take responsibility for their grandchildren

I know a woman whose mum brought up her DC for her and who now refuses to even babysit for her grandchild.

It's a unpopular view but I do wonder if some parents just care less as time passes?

I dont honestly think dhs parents actually care about him. Ok so they might love him in so much as they would cry if he died, but day to day interest or warmth? I dont see it myself.

The same's true of my husband's family. From what I've seen you're either in (in which case you're really in and thus involved with all the drama and healthy dynamic) or you're out. In their mindset, children stay in the area they were born in and forging an independent existence is an unforgivable digression. What's more, it's all about them; never occurs to them that it isn't a personal slight but their adult child making a decision he believes is in his own best interests.

DH left in his 20s to escape all the cross-currents and has heard from them about 3 times a year since. This was about a decade before I met him, but suddenly as soon as we had a child this lack of contact was deemed to be my fault (because isn't it always the woman's doing by default in these cases)? I never saw any reason why the in-laws' disinterest wouldn't also extend to my husband's child, and sure enough as soon as he'd passed the cute baby stage they mostly disappeared off the radar.

If kind of terrifies me that one day, a switch will turn off in me too and the affection and care will be replaced by only obliglitary love.

It doesn't terrify me. I know that won't be the case because I'm not cut from the same superficial, cold mould as either my MiL or my own very abusive father. I was as close to my mother as any daughter could be until the day she died. If this worries you I very much doubt it will happen to you, either. You simply wouldn't care.

For those saying it's not the GPS responsibility we are in a bloody pandemic and these working parents are the ones attempting to keep the economy running for everyone in difficult circumstances

And so are many of those GPs! Many of my friends and colleagues are GPs, and a lot of them are key workers, some in NHS and emergency services.

Whatever happened to ‘it takes a village to raise a child’?
This was the way years ago usually through neighbours and friends not really grandparents.
People are more distracted these days usually working long hours.
This summer felt like the old days as many parents were off work and able to meet each other.

My mother is zero support.
My grandparents basically raised us. Bailed her out 1000 times, did free childcare among other things.

My MIL is a saint.
She has no support raising my DH or his brothers.

Some people are just selfish and will take but not give back. Others understand the struggle so will do anything to help.

Depends on the personality I guess

@StillCounting123

I have 5 DC, all young with small age gaps.

Had no help or real emotional support when I had 1 DC, so decided to just have more DC as we wanted a big family. (I know that is a sin on MN).

For us, the issue is not so much that we don't have practical support and that we pay all childcare for work and also social time.

Our sadness is that we don't feel loved by our parents, and see how superficial their interest in the grandkids is.

They love seeing pics of them, but don't actually know them as unique individuals.

Although I don't have 5 children (I have three virtually grown up DDs), your point about superficial interest in the grandchildren does strike a chord with me.

I don't doubt that my parents love me, but it is this superficiality towards the grandchildren that bothers me. They will throw money their way, and mine too sometimes to contribute to Christmas and birthdays, which is always gratefully received, but have never really seemed to want to really know them properly.

I've never expected childcare and knew that with only a few exceptions (having another baby, me having to go into hospital etc.) I certainly wouldn't get it. It is the general disconnect and lack of true interest that bothers me.

I agree with you Op. Why would you suddenly not care that your child is having a shit time just because they’re 18+ ? On the other hand my best friend had a shitty time when hers were born and I didn’t really step up as I should have or would have if I really understood the situation. She didn’t tell me and I was too ignorant / wrapped up in my own non-child problems (as well as living far away and working full time tbf) to guess how she was struggling or ask the right questions. When she mentioned struggling later I asked about getting help from parents and her reply was, ‘God no, that would be the last thing I’d want’. She loves and gets on well with her parents but I think it’s a pride thing where people don’t want to ask, or don’t want the complications that go with it (having to take advice, having to be grateful, having someone see how you live with no shiny gloss). I know that I happily take support from my parents but it does come with not exactly strings attached but other trade offs. Sometimes both sides are aware of this and so it’s easier to stick to the status quo.

Oh my god I feel so much for gps here, as a gp poster said you're either meddling or not helping. At the school I see gps running about after kids looking absolutely wrecked. I've heard gps make bitter jokes about looking forward to days off. The way I'd make a joke-me, a mother! That is absolutely not right. I always said I'd help and be the dream gp (we didnt get much help) and now, at 40 with dodgy knees and a dodgy back I know I'll try to help but wont be great. You can say people are fit and healthy, doesn't mean after finally being done raising children they wont be absolutely wrecked by even the idea of minding a child. And money wise I was talking to dm once and she told me it's terrifying when work stops and you have to figure out savings and a pension and you know it has to last you until you die:(

On the last, rare occasion I saw my mil, she said how lovely it would be if we had a third child and how babies are a blessing. Totally bizarre seeing as once her children became adults, she effectively washed her hands of them. I felt like saying, I might have had more children if I had anyone to offer me some support.

Im very surprised to see the out come on the polls! Meaning that YABU seems to be in the lead. My vote was YANBU. I only have my Dad left after my mums passing 8 years ago and although he works full time has prostate cancer and parkinsons he would bend over backwards to help me and my DD (6years old). I am a single parent.

"Oh and when I was struggling with my first poorly silent reflux baby when dh was at work I rang my mother. She replied 'oh dear' then proceeded to tell me about the shopping trip she was currently on and the lovely things she was up to".

"Wow, that just takes it to the next level. Can't even begin to understand the thought process here".

What did you expect the GP to do with the posters baby in this case? Drop everything, end her trip she was midway through?

Some GP's had no help also, they in turn did not help their children ( i am one ). There is no law that grand parents should help. If you have children, they are your responsibility. I appreciate that sounds harsh but that is how it is sometimes.

You could ask your DC to pay you @stayathomer

I think she wanted some sympathy/empathy @KatherineofTarragon not a run down of her mums shopping trip and not a rescue either.

'On the last, rare occasion I saw my mil, she said how lovely it would be if we had a third child and how babies are a blessing. Totally bizarre seeing as once her children became adults, she effectively washed her hands of them. I felt like saying, I might have had more children if I had anyone to offer me some support.'

@formerbabe I completely relate to this but in my case it is my DM. She will act like she is the doting grandmother with her friends showing loads of pictures etc but in reality barely sees them. It's like my dc are status symbols and a way of her getting attention from other people. It is sad as I expected both of my parents to be better than what they are. If I am lucky enough to be a grandparent in the future I will strive to be better than their example.

In my opinion something has broken down in a family if the grandparent is totally uninterested and never wants to see their DGC, there is a big gap between that and being forced into childcare 24/7.

@KatherineofTarragon well if that was my daughter i would have as an extra pair of hands and somebody to hold the baby for five mins means the world doesnt it . If my mother rang me in that frame of mind I would have gone straight to see her or at the very least offered to come over at the next available opportunity.

My parents were great when ds was born & ever since, it was only my mum who managed to get me through severe pnd, she came up every day, helped me have the confidence to learn to manage a new baby, listened to my fears, held me when I couldn't stop sobbing. They did everything they could to help me when my marriage ended, furnished & decorated my new home, have always loved having ds. Ex inlaws were totally different, the morning after I came out of hospital turned up, walked in & demanded I put the kettle on, I had only been out of high dependency 2 days after an emcs that had turned in to a nightmare, only saw ds as a status symbol who in their own words "would carry the name on", rarely offered to babysit without demanding something in return.