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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Furlough holiday

429 replies

MrsQGinglass · 18/09/2020 11:47

I am furloughed still and work for a large international company. There are only a few off us still furloughed 2 in my office only.

I received an informing me that all holiday from last year that was carried over would have to be used in the October. I know the reason why it is cheaper for them to get part of the government to pay it.
My issue is that those that have not been furloughed are allowed to carry over their holiday for the next 2 years.
I really do not think this is fair as they are treating us differently.
I have contacted HR for clarification but they have not answered my emails.
Is this lawful.
AIBUto think that they are treating us unfairly.

OP posts:
Happygogoat · 18/09/2020 19:50

If you'd "love to be at work" and hated being furloughed as you say then surely it's no bad thing that you won't be carrying over an excessive holiday balance? Work all you like and give Barbara in accounts a break and well deserved holiday. Those in essential roles who have been coming in are the people who have kept your employed afloat and the same people to thank that it didn't go under and you don't face redundancy (yet).

Yours clearly wasn't an essential role. Choose your battles wisely. Not saying furlough was easy £2500 a month for doing absolutely nothing, then moaning you don't get time off on top? Selfish and entitled in the extreme.

BBCONEANDTWO · 18/09/2020 19:56

@MrsQGinglass

I am furloughed still and work for a large international company. There are only a few off us still furloughed 2 in my office only.

I received an informing me that all holiday from last year that was carried over would have to be used in the October. I know the reason why it is cheaper for them to get part of the government to pay it.
My issue is that those that have not been furloughed are allowed to carry over their holiday for the next 2 years.
I really do not think this is fair as they are treating us differently.
I have contacted HR for clarification but they have not answered my emails.
Is this lawful.
AIBUto think that they are treating us unfairly.

This must be a joke????
TheLastStarfighter · 18/09/2020 20:00

OP you realise you could have taken your holiday during furlough? You would have been been paid at full rate and could not have been recalled while on leave. You chose not to do that.

Your employer are entirely within their rights to mandate you to take holiday now.

chatterbugmegastar · 18/09/2020 20:07

Get off your butt and sort it out for yourself
**
chatterbugmegastar There’s nothing for her to sort. She can’t do a thing about it - they’re acting legally.

And once she realises this, after making her own formal enquiries, she can leave the subject alone with grace. (I hopeConfused)

SantaClaritaDiet · 18/09/2020 20:22

Wow
My colleagues are actually in agreement with me and so is my line manager.

of course they are... Hmm

JulesM73 · 18/09/2020 20:29

Resign and get another job that means that you can take your holiday when you want.

FFS.

pollylocketpickedapocket · 18/09/2020 20:35

You've been unnecessary for months, this is the least of your worries, maybe try a new job, redundancy is on its way

jelly79 · 18/09/2020 20:53

I'm sure it's not been easy, it's not been for most for all kinds of circumstances whether working or furloughed. Regardless of opinion your employer can do this and the chances are its had to decline many holiday requests of the working population so this was the fairest option.

I would imagine if there has been financial pressure due to furlough then this would be a welcomed boost in income

2kool4skool · 18/09/2020 21:25

Jesus wept

Morsmordre · 18/09/2020 21:29

@dontdisturbmenow

The problem is that you are only focussing on treating people the same when you lose out.

Did you beg your employer not to be furloughed whilst a colleague desperate for furlough was told they had to work? Or did you think that bring furloughed wasn't do bad then, but you're now kicking of because you're not getting the same benefits.

Have you considered that many people working were actually told they couldn't carry over any holidays, so they had to take that time off during that time, doing exactly the same as you were, but theirs was a supposed holiday?

You are so narrow-minded and entitled, it's sickening. It's hard not to wonder whether there's a reason they picked you to be furloughed.

Spot on with this comment!
Nydj · 18/09/2020 21:43

OP, the reason many people have been furloughed is to avoid them being made redundant - that was the main objective the Government in introducing the furlough scheme. However, you were not obliged to accept furlough - the rules stipulated that it had to be agreed by the employer and employee so I assume you agreed to be furloughed - maybe even in preference to being made redundant?
In any event, the likely reason those who are still furloughed are being required to take annual leave by the end of October whilst those who are not furloughed can carry over the leave is cash flow. As you pointed out, all employees accrued annual leave over the few months - those who were furloughed and those who were not furloughed. The difference is that employers can recover some of the costs of furloughed employees annual leave from the Government whilst they are furloughed but for non-furloughed employees, the employers have to bear the costs of annual leave. So most employers want employees who have not been furloughed to postpone their annual leave as it is a cost to them. And they want furloughed employees to use up annual leave while they are furloughed so that they can recover as much of the cost of annual leave from the Government under the furlough scheme.
I am not sure if understanding the likely reasoning by your employer will help you but I thought it was worth setting it out.

LilyLongJohn · 18/09/2020 21:48

No it does not in certain circumstances but in work, with colleagues it does.

No it doesn't, otherwise all employees would have been furloughed or all employees would have stayed at work. Of course the holiday situation will be different for those that worked, compared to those who were furloughed

Redcrayons · 18/09/2020 21:49

OP you realise you could have taken your holiday during furlough

I don’t know about the OP but I couldn’t. They would have to pay 100%, so they told everyone no holidays.

BikeTyson · 18/09/2020 21:51

I have had 4 days annual leave since the start of lockdown. Workload made it impossible to take any more than that. You bloody bet I want to be able to carry it forward. I can’t imagine how much easier the last 6 months would have been if I hadn’t had to work and provide childcare at the same time.

LilyLongJohn · 18/09/2020 21:59

I have had 4 days annual leave since the start of lockdown. Workload made it impossible to take any more than that. You bloody bet I want to be able to carry it forward. I can’t imagine how much easier the last 6 months would have been if I hadn’t had to work and provide childcare at the same time.

This x1000000 I didn't have any holidays until July due to workloads and lockdown, my two weeks booked for April had to be pushed back to October, and the way it's going, October is now looking unlikely.

I think the op needs to count her blessings rather than moaning and acting like her employer owes her a living, your employer is in the business of making money, if it couldn't during lockdown you could end up having as many days holiday whilst looking for another job.

My life would have been so much easier if I'd been furloughed, as it was I had to work full time and homeschool two kids. I'd look longingly at my neighbours who managed to decorate their house and sort their garden out whilst earning 80% of their wages.

Trust me, I'd forgo a few days holiday for 6 months of paid leave.

NancyBotwinBloom · 18/09/2020 22:06

@Nydj

OP, the reason many people have been furloughed is to avoid them being made redundant - that was the main objective the Government in introducing the furlough scheme. However, you were not obliged to accept furlough - the rules stipulated that it had to be agreed by the employer and employee so I assume you agreed to be furloughed - maybe even in preference to being made redundant? In any event, the likely reason those who are still furloughed are being required to take annual leave by the end of October whilst those who are not furloughed can carry over the leave is cash flow. As you pointed out, all employees accrued annual leave over the few months - those who were furloughed and those who were not furloughed. The difference is that employers can recover some of the costs of furloughed employees annual leave from the Government whilst they are furloughed but for non-furloughed employees, the employers have to bear the costs of annual leave. So most employers want employees who have not been furloughed to postpone their annual leave as it is a cost to them. And they want furloughed employees to use up annual leave while they are furloughed so that they can recover as much of the cost of annual leave from the Government under the furlough scheme. I am not sure if understanding the likely reasoning by your employer will help you but I thought it was worth setting it out.
May not set it out to the op but it's made it easy to understand for me and probably a lot of other people who just think like me.

Thank you

EveryDayIsADuvetDay · 18/09/2020 22:08

Yes I have lost more than 20%, the max they pay is £2500.

presumably £2.5k is more than you'd have received on benefits if you'd been made redundant at the outset?
And frankly the opportunity for an employer to be rid of someone so angsty and whingey - were you as petty as this pre-furlough?

Ginger1982 · 18/09/2020 22:24

So when does your holiday year run from and to then?

CandyLeBonBon · 18/09/2020 22:27

Op. I'm self employed. I've lost ALL my work this year. Life is difficult. You are not suffering discrimination, you are suffering the repercussions of a very difficult situation that will cause death, redundancy, and heartache for thousands. Whilst your situation might be frustrating (to you) it's not illegal. You have a job, you have some sort of security (trust me 20% salary loss and a job to return to is preferable to 100% loss, and the demise of a business you've worked hard in for 7 years).

If there is no unlawful behaviour (ie discrimination against protected characteristics), I'd probably keep my mouth shut so I didn't sound like an entitled twat.

Chocowally · 18/09/2020 22:29

OP had you considered that those making policy decisions at your employers might be planning for 2021 and trying to think of ways they might be able to keep the business afloat - one of those ways is to minimise the amount of leave staff can take (leave might need cover, productivity will be reduced).

You’ve had (A lot of) time off this year. Your employer might feel it fair for you to manage next year on your standard annual leave allowance.

NancyBotwinBloom · 18/09/2020 22:35

I'm surprised this thread hasn't been deleted by now you know

c0ntent5 · 18/09/2020 23:23

You asked a question and it has quite clearly been answered, I don’t know why you continue to whinge like a child! You may not be happy with it, but its not wrong so you need to suck it up.

If you dont want others opinions, or are unwilling to take them on board, don’t ask the question. Pretty simple.

Aridane · 19/09/2020 05:49

I’ve never been able to carry more than 5 days over to the following year. Carrying over for two years Just wouldn’t be entertained, you would lose this allowance. I’ve been working FT for 30 years.

Rule is same in my place

However government has temporarily changed employment law enabling greater carry over

Aridane · 19/09/2020 05:50

@Aridane who are the “entitled fuckers” though?

@BanjoStarz

The oP fir a start

CanIHelpYou · 19/09/2020 06:00

Why is this such a huge deal to you? Why are you so hell-bent on your working colleagues not receiving any sort of 'perk' for working throughout?

This is standard across the board, I was furloughed for a while back in April/May. I had to take some holidays. I had no problem with that, I'd just had months off!

You have had 6 months off work OP. I appreciate it hasn't been a good old jolly and I don't like it when people refer to it as sitting on your arse on full pay and things like that because I understand it's actually very stressful for a lot of people and not a fun time, you'd rather be working and didn't choose it, but I don't see why you need to carry even more time off over to the next year? I don't even think you really care about the holiday, more just about what you perceive as fair which I think is skewed.

This year has been shit for a lot of people. You just have to suck it up and get on with it like everyone else.