To set MiL Straight?

[Pregernaught]

NC’d.

I’m 19 weeks pregnant with the first grandchild on both sides, so naturally everyone is super excited and it’s all very lovely.

Yesterday, MiL let slip that she’s bought a next to me crib and a load of newborn baby stuff ‘for her house’ for when the baby arrives ... I quite pointedly said ‘oh that won’t be needed MiL, baby won’t be staying overnight with you until they’re too old to use a next to me, he/she will be in their own room by then’

She was taken aback and said I’d need a night off on the first few weeks at least. I said baby will be breast fed until 6 months at least hopefully so whether I want a night off or not, it won’t be happening. I also said that even if I couldn’t breast feed for any reason, I wouldn’t want baby away from me that early anyway.

She then got upset and said she would expect me to express so she could take her grandchild while they’re still a baby to have overnight and I’m cruel for not allowing this. DH stepped in at this point and said we wouldn’t be changing our plans to suit MiL, and he’d be very sad if she couldn’t accept that and made it difficult for us to see her when baby was born. She dropped it After he said that.

She’s also said some other weird stuff like weaning the baby from 3 months is normal, she doesn’t like the idea of breastfeeding and something about giving newborns water as well as milk? Pretty sure that’s not right? It’s making me really nervous about leaving baby with her at all until he or she is a bit more robust!

MiL has a sister who has a grandchild already, but she was born when her mum was only 16 and living at home, so naturally MiL’s sister was very involved from the start. DH and I are in our 30’s, totally independent, mortgage, the lot so it’s a totally different circumstance. I have a feeling MiL is comparing notes and wants to be as involved as her sister was, which obviously just won’t be happening.

I just want to check I’m not being cruel or unreasonable to lay boundaries with someone who is usually lovely and will absolutely dote on this kid?

The bit that concerns me is MiL has offered none of this, just to ‘take’ baby which makes me uncomfortable, even the language of that I do think your history of having lost so many babies plus pregnancy hormones is possibly an influence here op. I can't imagine how hard and scary this pregnancy must be, I'm so sorry for what you've been through to get here so can totally see why someone "taking" your child away might be triggering.
I suspect if she's a good egg normally they it's just her own experience, that her mom or mil took her babies at X points so she could sleep etc. It's like the feeding, I'm in my late 30s, my mom told me to give my babies boiled water under 6 months, says she weaned us all far earlier than we wean now etc. Some people are experience based - week it did us no harm!! But she's a good women, you trust her, she's just excited. And the buying night be here feeling she can somehow make this baby comes on time and healthy - it will all be ok ,, it has to, I have a cot!!

Good on you and DH for being kind but upfront

Can I just say that any new mum who is struggling and does need help including a nights sleep shouldn't feel they are failing as it can come across that letting a baby sleep at GPs is a total no no and something a loving parent would never do. We are all different and there is no shame accepting help, or even asking for it, if you need it. We don't need to be martyrs. Most of us manage just fine but occasionally other things intervene, PND, flu or in a friend's case the death of her own mother which she found so hard within weeks of baby being born.

Yes!! Thank you.

Week 4 with my first I went and slept the night at my parents without baby as I was loosing the plot as couldn’t sleep next to baby while was a loud sleeper... my husband fed him formula over night and I woke up once to express as my boobs hurt, and we continued to BF until 18 months and have the best bond.

Not sure why people think it’s such an achievement to get to the age of 3 and never had a Night apart from their child.

Another thing she said not long ago is it’s not fair on DH for me to breastfeed because he won’t be able to bond. This really worries me.
Don't let it worry you. I bf all of mine, dh never gave a bottle. That has not effected the bonding with any of them. In fact dd1 was very much a daddy's girl from an early age.

Even with my non-sleeper dd2 I wouldn't have wanted her away overnight. It's tough at times, but if your dh is sympathetic and can took after the baby for some time at the weekends and give you a catch up that will help. Dh used to put the baby in the sling and go off on the bus somewhere for a couple of hours and I'd have a sleep.
It's not being a martyr to always have them overnight at all.

My MIL bought a travel cot for her house which was bad enough she also wanted me to bottle feed so she could take the baby (said she'd have the baby overnight every Saturday so we could have time off ). She also refutes the CMPA DD has and seems dead set on feeding her something with milk in to check Fortunately like your DH mine stood up for me and doesn't expect me to leave her, she's still EBF at 8 months and he isn't keen on leaving her with anyone who doesn't listen to us!
I also get offered a lot of advice which I don't listen to and usually I say "oh right I'll bear that in mind" or "that's not recommended any more" depending on how stupid the advice is

These sort of threads make me so glad my MIL lives in a different continent!

I breastfed the older 2 and bottle fed my last. I mixed fed with dc1( formula, breastfed/ expressed)
They are all healthy happy children.
You are the parent and its okay for you to make these calls. Its great you and your husband are on the same page.

I only ever gave my dc cooled boiled water after 6 months and only with food or if they became a little constipated from weaning.

And as for sleepovers dc1 was 6 months, dc2 was 2 years and dc3 is 8 months and still not stayed. That just depends on when each child is ready. If they or you & dh are not ready, then it just doesnt happen until you all are.

Dont fall into the trap of explaining your descisions as this comes accross as a discussion. You state the situation and move on.

Its great mil will have an active caring role in dcs life when they are a little older. Just when they are little they need their parents.

[quote Pregernaught]@ILikeTrains that’s so helpful to read. This is another thing that worries me, MiL doesn’t like the idea of breastfeeding at all, she thinks it’s bollocks that it’s better than formula/ just the same as cows milk and as such she has no concept of supply/ demand and how it all works. Obviously I’m more than capable of making my own decision on that but I don’t have the experience to know the reasons why I’ll need to feed from the breast and not express all the time etc. Another thing she said not long ago is it’s not fair on DH for me to breastfeed because he won’t be able to bond. This really worries me.[/quote]
Look, I know you like her, but her opinion on breastfeeding is as irrelevant as that of someone you pass on the street. I had to FF as my milk never came in at all despite two months of trying everything, with advice from all possible quarters, and I had total strangers be rude about it, including a man who told me he had just arrived in London from Benin, but still felt he needed to have his say on how wrong it was I wasn’t feeding my baby the ‘traditional way’ when he passed me sitting on a park bench with my six-week-old baby.

What your MIL thinks is about as relevant as my mansplaining Benin man.

Many congrats OP. I think you have done the right thing to make your feelings known now.

You may find you will welcome a break from time to time, I don’t think DH & I would have survived without MIL having our baby one night a week, if I am honest. My MIL used to look after my baby all night, downstairs in my house, just so DH & I could get some rest. We were very grateful for her help & have never forgotten it.

It used to be (in the 1990s at any rate) that sometimes you could offer cooled boiled water in a bottle to a baby alongside formula milk. No idea if that's still the case, but maybe what she's referring to.
Well done to your DH for supporting you and standing up to his mother.

Hi OP... I know you have had lots of losses and I’ve been there too. Everyone’s very excited and that’s actually wonderful. I’m pleased that you are establishing boundaries now, and not when baby is here and when you are tired and vulnerable. When my first was born, it was my mum who was the nightmare. She became super-competitive re-MIL (who is pretty flaky, tbh, but that’s a whole other thread) and said things like “I am more her grandmother than SHE is...” and of course, first Christmas was an absolute shit show.)
I am absolutely thrilled that your gorgeous DH is already helping you establish boundaries like a grownup, which seems so unlike so many other men mentioned on mumsnet. I don’t think that the concept of family cultures has been mentioned here rather than “what x wants”.... You have talked about DH’s family and yours having a different way of dealing with things and that shapes your expectations. I think you and DH need to sit down with MIL and calmly explain this concept to her. Not only has modern parenting advice changed, but your family culture or “expectations” if you prefer are different to hers. And by Your Family, I mean You, DH and baby. You might need to draw her the diagram that has lots of overlapping circles which has one with you, DH and baby in the middle, one with her (and other members of DH’s family if there are any), one with your mum, etc....

YANBU - sounds like you and DH were admirably assertive with this one.

Everyone is different, you have to do what you're comfortable with. My mum has had all 4 of mine overnight from about 3 months and MIL has always had them from a young age too.

it’s not fair on DH for me to breastfeed because he won’t be able to bond
Bollocks. He can bath, change, cuddle, and do basically everything else. She’s talking rubbish if she thinks that feeding is the one and only bonding activity. And does she really mean DH? Or does she mean herself? I faced huge pressure from my MIL in the early days because she was obsessed with wanting to feed my baby.

I don’t have the experience to know the reasons why I’ll need to feed from the breast and not express all the time
I didn’t express because it was a pain in the arse. Wash, sterilise, pump, freeze, defrost... it was a huge hassle and took more time than just sticking a boob in the baby’s mouth. I was tired enough without all that extra work. Plus your boobs don’t stop filling up, so it’s not like you can pump and then have a long sleep - you’ll still get woken up by full boobs at the time the baby would usually feed. So you’re sitting there wide awake and pumping while someone else is downstairs trying to feed a reheated bottle to a screaming baby who just wants a boob. That’s before you even consider the fact that milk contains different hormones at different times of day - and what a faff labelling your milk with the time it was pumped so you can feed it to the baby at the correct time of day!

Do not leave your baby with her. Well done for being clear from the start. Fully breastfed babies (no pacifiers, unrestricted access to the breast 24/7) don't need extra water. Breastfeeding for a newborn is more like breathing than having a meal, it's a survival system that you don't turn off. Sounds like your dh and dm are onside. Is there any reading material the mil could have, to point her in the right direction? (Travel brochures spring to mind ...)

You are 100% right, but please be gentle with her over this. She wants to show her love for the baby and will be a huge asset in the future.

You (and your baby) are very lucky to have her.

I can relate. My ex's mother was a bit overbearing and I did resent her a little, with her nonsensical pregnancy advice and superstitions.

However, I soon came to realise that she was head-over-heels in love with our baby from the moment she heard I was pregnant.

She and my FiL became my children's staunchest supporters (better than my own parents) and all-round wonderful grandparents. Your child too will have this fantastic advantage in their life.

So in your place, I'd swallow my pride and go cap in hand and actually apologise to her. Maybe take flowers. Just you, woman to woman.

You'd be doing this not for her or you, but for your child.

Don't apologise for having a different plan, but for 'jumping down her throat' about it. You want her onside so a bit of grovelling is a small price to pay.
You don't have to mean it!
Although it sounds as if her feelings were hurt, which is a shame. I wonder if she went home and cried.

Say something like 'About the other day, I'm sorry for biting your head off. We know how we want to handle things and I think it might be a bit different from how you did it. I'm sorry for overreacting.'

There may be a hug and a tear or two, all good.

Then you can butter her up with 'I can't WAIT to see your face when the baby comes!' and hopefully lead into a lovely conversation about the wonderful times you will all have.

Remember that after the first few months, depending on how you're feeding Junior, Gran will be able to take over now and then to give you a break, as she has promised. Take my word for this: by then you will be DELIGHTED.

Also - things might not turn out according to your plan. I don't mean anything will go wrong, but circumstances change and you might find you need to adapt a little. Having Gran ready to step in would be a huge help.

Anecdote time -
In one of my later pregnancies Gran happened to go with me for a scan. Back then they were strict about who was able to go in with expectant mothers; only the baby's father or the expectant mother's own mother were allowed.

I told the technician Gran was my mother so she could see the scan.
Gran cried for joy the whole time! I honestly think it was one of the best moments of her life.

This was before photos were given out but if they had been, I would have handed mine over to Gran without a second's thought. She was totally worthy! Your child's Gran will be too. Cherish her.

Is your own mum supportive of breast feeding?

It might help to join a group like nct or la Leche for breastfeeding support and info. They have all the back up info to support your decision.

I personally couldn't pump at all. Nothing came out. I guess the pump wasn't as strong as dc sucking.

With my oldest dc I was so worried and the hospital gave me a sheet to note down when they fed and how much. I think this was detrimental to breastfeeding as I was obsessed with writing it all down and it seemed easier to know what dc was getting with formula.

With younger dc I just followed my instincts and fed on demand in front of telly or co sleeping. Breast feeding worked great that way, and now I'm still feeding youngest at 18 months.

I have not used the next to me cot once! It just gets in my way and it's full of clothes! Like 'the chair'.

For me pumping was like doing the same job twice. Pump and then feed expressed milk from bottle. Easier to only have to do it once.

All the people being sympathetic to the MIL, she made her demands and then called OP, who is pregnant after an incredible number of miscarriages and trying to get to grips with a stressful pregnancy cruel for not agreeing.

How is that okay?

How about MIL being “gentle” with her son and DIL? It cuts both ways. She’s had her child(ren), she got to do it her way. She has no rights where OP’s baby is concerned and her toddler tantrum attempts at manipulation are indefensible unless you really think bullying new parents to be is somehow acceptable.

Well done OP and you DH. And no, no water if you are breastfeeding. Even with formula, you don't need to give additional water unless it's very hot weather. I had checked and rechecked with HV about the formula. If breastfeeding, you dont need to give anything else at all. And your baby sleeps where you decide. Definitely wont be recommending sleeping overnight without you, in the first few weeks itself!!

I'm breast feeding, i wouldn't want her away, i don't enjoy expressing. DH and I agreed early on we weren't having a baby to give her to other people at every opportunity, where as MIL has SIL little girl every weekend to give her a break and has done from 1 week old. We were also informed there would be a bedroom in her house for her, he said that seems like a waste of space.

My mother said about tap water, i said recommendations have changed and left it at that. Its my answer for pretty much anything i don't agree with.

DH does sometimes give LO a bottle, but she was such a daddies girl without that, mainly the cuddles morning and evening, and the thirty minute nappy changes where they chatter away to each other.
You're doing the right thing for you.

@TenDays

You are 100% right, but please be gentle with her over this. She wants to show her love for the baby and will be a huge asset in the future.

You (and your baby) are very lucky to have her.

I can relate. My ex's mother was a bit overbearing and I did resent her a little, with her nonsensical pregnancy advice and superstitions.

However, I soon came to realise that she was head-over-heels in love with our baby from the moment she heard I was pregnant.

She and my FiL became my children's staunchest supporters (better than my own parents) and all-round wonderful grandparents. Your child too will have this fantastic advantage in their life.

So in your place, I'd swallow my pride and go cap in hand and actually apologise to her. Maybe take flowers. Just you, woman to woman.

You'd be doing this not for her or you, but for your child.

Don't apologise for having a different plan, but for 'jumping down her throat' about it. You want her onside so a bit of grovelling is a small price to pay.
You don't have to mean it!
Although it sounds as if her feelings were hurt, which is a shame. I wonder if she went home and cried.

Say something like 'About the other day, I'm sorry for biting your head off. We know how we want to handle things and I think it might be a bit different from how you did it. I'm sorry for overreacting.'

There may be a hug and a tear or two, all good.

Then you can butter her up with 'I can't WAIT to see your face when the baby comes!' and hopefully lead into a lovely conversation about the wonderful times you will all have.

Remember that after the first few months, depending on how you're feeding Junior, Gran will be able to take over now and then to give you a break, as she has promised. Take my word for this: by then you will be DELIGHTED.

Also - things might not turn out according to your plan. I don't mean anything will go wrong, but circumstances change and you might find you need to adapt a little. Having Gran ready to step in would be a huge help.

Anecdote time -
In one of my later pregnancies Gran happened to go with me for a scan. Back then they were strict about who was able to go in with expectant mothers; only the baby's father or the expectant mother's own mother were allowed.

I told the technician Gran was my mother so she could see the scan.
Gran cried for joy the whole time! I honestly think it was one of the best moments of her life.

This was before photos were given out but if they had been, I would have handed mine over to Gran without a second's thought. She was totally worthy! Your child's Gran will be too. Cherish her.

This is a really bizarre post with a lot of generalisations. nobody needs to “apologise with flowers” just for gently setting boundaries!

@ancientgran

Can I just say that any new mum who is struggling and does need help including a nights sleep shouldn't feel they are failing as it can come across that letting a baby sleep at GPs is a total no no and something a loving parent would never do. We are all different and there is no shame accepting help, or even asking for it, if you need it. We don't need to be martyrs. Most of us manage just fine but occasionally other things intervene, PND, flu or in a friend's case the death of her own mother which she found so hard within weeks of baby being born.

I really have to agree with this. I can't bear to be away from DD overnight BUT my niece had a baby a year before me and my sister regularly had her grandson from a very early age to give my niece a break. She was young and I think struggled with her new role when all her friends were still out all the time and she needed a break to feel more her. I don't think that's wrong - she did what she needed to do to get through and my nephew is far better adjusted with others than DD is (who has hit peak separation anxiety just as I try to settle her into childcare and with in-laws for a return to work in a few months). When DD was tiny PIL used to fetch me (section so couldn't drive) and take me to their house and let me sleep for a couple hours while they looked after her in another room. I needed that desperately as I never slept and was a bit shell shocked at the level of exhaustion I suffered. I agree with others saying you don't know what you will need when baby is here so don't 'burn your bridges' just yet. I wouldn't want to leave DD overnight but I am keen to get her settled during the day with others and maybe get a couple of hours to spend with DH or my friends again. And it's as ok to feel that way as it is to want to spend every second with baby.

So in your place, I'd swallow my pride and go cap in hand and actually apologise to her. Maybe take flowers. Just you, woman to woman.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Do NOT do this.

You and your husband are your baby’s defenders, and the two people in the world who will love, support and care for them over anyone else. Do not put that responsibility in doubt by grovelling apologetically to someone who wants to put their own needs ahead of your baby’s and was manipulative when you stood firm about it. You absolutely do not need to put the feelings of an overbearing adult ahead of the well-being of your baby.

Ask mil to help you while supporting breast feeding. You will need others to do cooking, cleaning etc for you. So you are able to sit on the sofa in front of telly and just feed all the time. Ask her to keep the cups of tea coming! Someone to cuddle the baby while you have a shower or go to toilet is helpful. A short walk with the baby or bathing / changing / dressing it can give you a break too. Bonding and spending time with the baby doesn't have to be feeding.

What on Earth are you on about @TenDays

Overbearing, unsupportive, disrespectful people are not to be cherished by babies or their parents. No child needs people around them who upset their parents before they’re even born.

And what’s this woman to woman horseshit? It’s OP’s DH baby too and his mother who he sensibly felt the need to set straight on her inappropriate demands. You’re suggesting OP excludes him and lies to his mother about how grateful they both are for her interference? Your advice is ridiculous and your tone is patronising and stupid.