AIBU to think my sister is being an idiot?

[Rainbowsandpotsofgold]

Ok so my darling sister (29) is pregnant with her 1st baby after trying for 2 years. Shes decided she wants an elective c section ...no medical reason...she does suffer with fibromyalgia but so do me and my mum (2 natural births each).

Shes made this decision based on
A) She's afraid of a long labour ( I was 15 having my eldest while living at home, was in slow labour for 5 days and 17hours active labour but my daughter was born stargazing which wasnt picked up until she was coming out)
B) She doesn't want to tear ( no idea where this fear has come from 🤷‍♀️)

My argument is that...

1. Recovery from surgery can take longer for fibro sufferers
2. Anaesthetic/ epidurals don't work as well on us either
3. She lives 30 miles away from us, near her husband's family and knowing my sister, she will expect us ( our mum at least) to be there every day ( mum has fibro, ms and 2 Foster kids of school age plus my elderly grandparents who we both care for)
4. With all the uncertainty regarding covid, she will possibly be in hospital alone for a few days after the birth
5. After trying for so long I dont understand why she wouldn't at least want to try a natural birth?

She's a nightmare to try and talk to and once she's made a decision (even bad ones) she wont change her mind (typically baby of the family syndrome - brat)

Just to add...I will be showing her the replies as she is refusing to listen to me, my mum or my gran (who has had a natural birth and a c section...50 years ago but I dont think the basics have changed)

AIBU to think shes being an utter idiot in thinking a c section is the 'easiest' (her words) option?

My recovery from my elective section was SIGNIFICANTLY better than my recovery from my natural delivery. I was out of bed the same afternoon from the section, and walking round my village 48 hours later.
I was struggling with bladder issues weeks and months after my natural delivery.
Her choice. You don't need to be involved!

I have fibromyalgia and sailed through my section recovery. The anesthetic thing just doesn't have a scientific basis and it's certain not impacted me.

I was driving again after a fortnight and out walking a fair distance with the pram on my own at week 3-4.

WOW Sorry for the posts you've received today, shocking some of the replies.
I've had 6 sections and tbh I've been fine but I wish I'd experienced natural birth.
You aren't allowed to drive for 6 weeks afterwards, insurance dosent cover it as it is major surgery.
I personally wouldn't worry about half the nasty replies you've had on this thread.

Op you keep going on and on about her health condition but you should realise as a fibro suffer that you are not all the SAME?
you will not react nor respond to things the same way

Also you do realise that not everyone new parent wants bloody in-laws and parents and sisters visiting the whole time. Some women are actually perfectly capable of coping with a new born without having shit loads of people "helping her to cope"!
She probably won't want you all round all the time, as you are implying she will. Guessing her husband / partner is probably semi-capable as she's decided to have a child with him. Why is there so much about "women not being able to manage" with a new born. Just because you had to stay home for support she may not need you to do that for her.
I can just see you being that fucking annoying person who knows it all cuz you've got a child already! Urgh!

It’s her choice but yes, she’s being stupid about it.

The only women I know who have had struggles post-birth all had natural births that involved a lot of tearing or blood loss. The sections - especially planned - all went fine. I had an emergency section, and I had no pain that I remember, and healed quickly.

You need to butt out of this - I don't care if she's your baby sister, she's an adult who is allowed her own choices. I'm a baby sister, too, and I feel her pain. When are you going to start treating her as an adult? When she's 50? Just because she's a few years younger than you doesn't mean that she is an actual baby who doesn't know her own mind. You do know that, don't you?

@Userzzz

It’s her choice but yes, she’s being stupid about it.

Why?

Could you elaborate?

Or is this just another dunk and run ideological opinion based on fuck all evidence?

Its funny how people who say the OP's sister is stupid can't back it up with actual evidence. Just opinions that she's wrong. Its telling.

I had a section (emergency), was up walking 12 hours later and was completely pain free 10 days post surgery.

Most of my friends who had "natural" deliveries had far more problems after, including third degree tears and prolapses. One is still pretty much incontinent and her DS is 4 now.

Birth is a lottery. No guarantees either way. An elective c section is actually statistically the safest way to give birth.

YAB massively U.

Nothing to do with you.

An elective c section is actually statistically the safest way to give birth.

Technically its not. But only on a population wide basis. And if you intend to have multiple pregnancies there are additional risks which are often not stressed in the way they should be. On an individual basis for some women based on their individual risk factors an ELCS does come out statistically better though.

This is why we need women centred care which allows all women to look at the balance of evidence and to make properly informed decisions with the advice and experience of doctors and midwives for their individual circumstances rather than having overbearing sisters who had babies at 15 running around telling, and ganging up with their mother and grandmother to press gang her 'baby' sister into realises she's wrong and should change her mind and have a VB on the basis their grandmother 'had a bad one 50 years ago' and somehow medicine hasn't moved on in that time. Cos thats what this thread is utterly about - ignorance.

Has she actually asked for your opinion?

If not...mind your own business and stop being a know it all.

...are you going to judge all her parenting choices from here on out?

@DalzielandPaxo

Get to fuck. It’s her body and her pregnancy and her choice. Keep your judgy beak out.

You have no idea what CS recovery is like because of your ‘natural’ births. Whatever her reasoning is, it’s hers and It’s valid and it’s fuck all to do with you.

As you can probably guess, I had an elective CS, during lockdown, simply because that was how I wanted to give birth. The length of trying for a baby is irrelevant.

I too, endured a load of bollocks judgement.

I healed beautifully, was up and about the same day, running in four weeks, lifting weights by six and have had no complications. It’s a very different procedure to an emergency.

So how about you act the supportive sister and support whatever your sister chooses.

Get to Fuck? Seriously?

I’m just scanning the thread and at some of the frankly disgusting comments and language used but this phrase you used in this context is one of the most offensive.

I suspect your comment about the length of trying for a baby being irrelevant to wanting a section is not the case. I personally know several Women who struggled to conceive and / or carry to term and I think if I recall correctly all five of them wanted and had elective c sections. They just wanted to know when they would meet their baby and they didn’t want to have to end up with an emergency section. I have had three babies “naturally” but things can and do go wrong. If I have endured what some women have: losses and real struggles carry a baby to term I can utterly understand that. If you chose to have a c section for absolutely no discernible reason then you of all people should be able to see that. Women who have already endured psychological trauma or grief and other such things associated with pregnancy are far more likely to be given one than someone like you who “just wanted to give birth that way”

Secondly it would never be recommended by any clinical or medical professional six weeks after major abdominal surgery to lift weights. Whether the procedure was planned or otherwise. If something went wrong and they’d been found to have advised or endorsed this they would be in serious professional trouble.

And as far as I can see the OP is not being unsupportive she is merely pointing out some of the practical aspects of recovering form surgery and that help at some point that will be needed.

Some of the vitriol here is extraordinary.

I’d like to add one thing as well. After my VB, which left me contemplating life long incontinence, I was agonising in my head about why I didn’t choose a C Section from the outset. My grandmother did have severe life long issues after VB and I blamed myself for not learning that lesson. Also, I felt guilty that I couldn’t focus completely on my new baby, as I wanted. I wrestled with those thoughts for ages. If someone else had been instrumental in persuading me into the VB, I would never have forgiven them. Be careful what you talk your sister into.

And as far as I can see the OP is not being unsupportive she is merely pointing out some of the practical aspects of recovering form surgery and that help at some point that will be needed.

She claims she wants to talk about the pros and cons, yet part of that is about giving information which is flawed. That doesn't actually help, nor is it about the best interests of her sister. Far from it. It comes from an ideological perspective which makes it harder not easier for women to do the best thing for themselves.

I'm angry due to the OPs unwillingness to engage on that level and look at things from what evidence there is in order to help her sister make informed decision, whatever that might be.

Instead its just a bunch of stuff about CS are bad and wrong, using emotive language, calling her sister names (which her sister has no right to reply on her side of the story), rather than an actual grown up discussion thinking about risk and evidence.

And the controlling aspect of her tone and attitude towards her 29 year old sister doesn't help matters. I'm not entirely sure what the OP expected, but if you are going to start a thread in which you refuse to respect the decisions of an adult about their own health for no other reason than 'you don't approve of them' I'm not sure what she expected.

@Anurulz

You know what, neither is cancer treatment or antibiotics, but noone who needs it or wants it is shamed, is it? Neither is living in a house made of concrete, but am sure you dont live in a cave either.

When did I shame c sections!?! I haven't at all. I honestly couldn't care less how someone else gives birth. But to say c sections are as natural as vaginal births is just bloody stupid.

@RedToothBrush

And as far as I can see the OP is not being unsupportive she is merely pointing out some of the practical aspects of recovering form surgery and that help at some point that will be needed.

She claims she wants to talk about the pros and cons, yet part of that is about giving information which is flawed. That doesn't actually help, nor is it about the best interests of her sister. Far from it. It comes from an ideological perspective which makes it harder not easier for women to do the best thing for themselves.

I'm angry due to the OPs unwillingness to engage on that level and look at things from what evidence there is in order to help her sister make informed decision, whatever that might be.

Instead its just a bunch of stuff about CS are bad and wrong, using emotive language, calling her sister names (which her sister has no right to reply on her side of the story), rather than an actual grown up discussion thinking about risk and evidence.

And the controlling aspect of her tone and attitude towards her 29 year old sister doesn't help matters. I'm not entirely sure what the OP expected, but if you are going to start a thread in which you refuse to respect the decisions of an adult about their own health for no other reason than 'you don't approve of them' I'm not sure what she expected.

I think the use of the word “idiot “‘was unfortunate

I do also think some people on this thread perhaps yourself included are expecting a degree of neutrality and objectivity that does not exist in sibling relationships and where families are concerned.

But at the end of the day the sister is a grown up women and ultimately it’s her choice as it should be

I’m surprised she’s being allowed to have one without medical need?
But even so - its her choice. Just make sure she’s well read in the subject. I’ve had 2 c sections (emergency and then planned, due to first emergency). Obviously I can’t compare, but I don’t think c section is the easy option. Yes maybe for the actual ‘birth’ bit .... but the recovery is so much longer and I’ve suffered from a bad back ever since. But provided she has all the info, then it’s her choice.
Only thing that may make her think - I truly regret not being part of the ‘labour’ club. I so wish I was able to experience child birth. I only had a couple of hours of contractions at home, DH drove me to hospital in a little pain and the DD was whipped out within 40 mins of arrival! So I never really got any of the experience. I do feel like I’ve missed out.

@Dee1975

I’m surprised she’s being allowed to have one without medical need? But even so - its her choice. Just make sure she’s well read in the subject. I’ve had 2 c sections (emergency and then planned, due to first emergency). Obviously I can’t compare, but I don’t think c section is the easy option. Yes maybe for the actual ‘birth’ bit .... but the recovery is so much longer and I’ve suffered from a bad back ever since. But provided she has all the info, then it’s her choice. Only thing that may make her think - I truly regret not being part of the ‘labour’ club. I so wish I was able to experience child birth. I only had a couple of hours of contractions at home, DH drove me to hospital in a little pain and the DD was whipped out within 40 mins of arrival! So I never really got any of the experience. I do feel like I’ve missed out.

Anxiety is classed as a mental need in some trusts.

would you let your sister/ friend whatever make the same decision without considering it for longer than a couple of hours and without listening to other 1st hand experiences....its not like picking up paint test pots

It's not a question of me 'letting' them do something - they're adults and make their own decisions. If they ask my opinion I might talk to them about it.

It is interesting that you call her your 'baby sister' and got quite defensive about needing to do this. My brother hasn't referred to me as a baby anything since I actually was one. He used to refer to me as either his little sister or younger sister. Now we're adults he just refers to me as his sister. He cares about me, supports me, offers advice when I ask for it, will provide a listening ear and is generally a great brother. He never calls me a baby - because I'm not.

Did you not consider the burden you put upon your mother when you got pregnant as a teenager?
The rationale choice would surely have been abortion. How would you have felt if they're all rallied round and called you an idiot.

@Dee1975 NICE guidelines state that women have the right to choose method of delivery. Both my csections have not had any medical need. Some trusts are more supportive than others.

Shes adult enough to have a baby, shes adult enough to make her own choices. Yes I do have sisters that I'm close to and they do things I dont agree with but I don't give an opinion until I'm asked. Because you know they are adults. Just tell your sister when you are available and what support you can give and that's it the rest is up to her.

You said you were going to show your sister this thread are you still planning on doing that?

Shes my baby sister

No, she is an adult woman who gets to make her own decisions, with or without your advice, whether you think she is right or wrong. I am sure you mean well but stop trying to infantilise her.

There is no guaranteed "easy option" when giving birth. Your sister will find that out for herself, like everyone else has to. Everyone's experience is different; and you cannot guarantee that she will have an easier time if she does things your way.

You do not have to meet her expectations. What your mother does is up to your mother.

I've called her an idiot because she is refusing to listen to any advice,

Well, welcome to the real world. Being her older sister doesn't make her an idiot for not listening to you. Try thinking of her, not as an idiot, but as an independent adult who is capable of making up her own mind based on the information she's been given without her elder sister's intervention. And who may make better decisions if she isn't having to resist an overbearing older sister at the same time.

expecting a degree of neutrality and objectivity that does not exist in sibling relationships and where families are concerned.

I am not expecting it - the OP may not have it - but she at least needs to try to step back. She is being overbearing and it's not healthy when she starts thinking of her sister as "an idiot" for not agreeing with what she says.

@Dee1975

The guidelines came in about 10 years ago that women have the right to choose a cesarean even without a ‘medical reason’ to do so. I requested and was offered one during my second pregnancy despite having no need beyond the fact I’d felt traumatised by my previous vaginal birth. Changed my mind in the end but it wasn’t a particularly difficult process to ask for one and be granted at my local trust. I’ve heard hospitals can vary on how hard they make it though.