AIBU to give up a life's work to see my kids grow up

[doctormumoftwo]

I am thinking of leaving my job and I desperately need advice from other people who may have been in my position. I have two children who are 2 and 6. I work as a junior doctor/surgeon and am halfway through my training/exams. My DH is a full time a doctor. I love my job but it is very stressful. We could get by on DH salary alone but it would mean a big change in lifestyle (no holidays etc). I acknowledge I am very lucky to be in this position. I have been part time since I started but I am falling behind on my surgery and I have realised I can't continue part time as I need more surgical experience to gain competency. I also have final exams to take which means many hours of revision. I will be working flat out for the next 5 years minimum (nights, weekends, exams etc). Due to COVID our parents can not longer help regularly. It will be less stressful (but still demanding) as a consultant. DH cannot go part time to help. Despite the long hours we work, we can't afford private school, we live in a small flat with no garden. We will have to put the kids in school/nursery from 0745 - 6pm 5 days a week, or have a nanny for >50hrs for us to both work. My child's school is not great, there is not much community outside the school. My heart breaks for them, especially the 2 year old. I feel like I am sacrificing their childhood for my career. I have worked so hard to get where I am, invested money, time and incredible effort, but it feels like the demands of my job are just not compatible with being a decent mother. I don't know what to do. Our part time nanny recently quit handed in her notice. My child's reading is falling behind and they always ask me to play but I don't have the time to give them. I am thinking of giving up work and being a mum. I feel so guilty to continue leaving them for so many hours. I don't think a part time solution is going to work any longer because of the surgery, as I am falling behind and I spend many of my unpaid days off at work 'catching up'. I enjoy my job but I am incredibly stressed and sad about the toll it is taking on us all- that I know will not end for many more years. What should I do?

I gave up a really good career, didn't think twice when dc came along.
It's each to their own, but I hated leaving mine, sos didn't.
I have no regrets, but we are the type who enjoy living frugally and aren't materialistic in the slightest.
A bag for a tenner out of Primark does me, and I have one.
Not saying that that's the only reason people work, but after our bills were paid it would just be extra money, where as we value time more.

Why can't your partner go PT and you go back FT?

Apologies I have not read the full thread but my suggestion would be to consider switching specialty to one where you can keep your career on 'hold' so to speak for the next few years so your foot stays in the door. That is what I have done and whilst it is frustrating seeing people progress and overtake me, the part time works well for family life and I will go back into training and try progress in a few years when kids are older and need me less.

It is definitely not flawless but for now, my job is a job and DH has the career so I can spend time with children. We came to this decision together and are happy with it

“That said I have every respect for the women who choose to give up their work and be full time mums. “

I work full time - I’m still a full time mum!!!! When the kids are sick the school still calls me - I don’t have the option to say I’m only a part time mum can you look after them please. The sooner we stop this part time mum rubbish the better it will be for all woman.

OP - I've been very impressed with the 5 year training plan and plans for the future from the various surgery training bodies in the UK.

Is there no flexibility within those that would suit your circumstances?

I feel for you, I really do. You sound wrung out.

I would also quit in your shoes. It will make you financially vulnerable no doubt but you can make plans/agreements to minimise this.

For example: isa/savings in your name only, your name on mortgage/deeds, paying into a good private pension, maybe start a small investment portfolio.

Pp are right in that your children will not be small forever but ime children still really need their parents as tweens/teens - just on a different way. (Or maybe that's only my kids!)

However, you don't get these early years back. If your dh is supportive I'd seriously consider it.

Does he have similar guilt regarding the situation?

Don't give up your career totally, you will regret in the end. Is there a possibility to change to GP ? I heard GP's working time and work load is more child friendly. I used to have a friend who is a GP, she works part time and manage quite well.

Also, you may ask information about return to training scheme. I know there are these kind of scheme to get doctors back to work. If you can take one-two years break, then going back to training when childcare is sorted, maybe it will work for you.

Don't give up OP, get your DH to do something to assist you. Do not let your career be sacrificed on the alter of his. Try and throw more money at the nanny situation and see it as an investment.

I don't think you'd have chosen a surgical specialty if you didn't love it. It's not a default choice, afaik.
And it seems like you don't want to leave it, but you also need to find a family balance.
So, find support. Nanny, child minder who can take extra hours, and certainly demand from your OH the same input you've put in while he's advanced his career. It's your time now, and it should be a team effort all considered.

Would he be willing to give up his career if he was in your position? Doubt it.

How did you come to the decision to have children? What was the plan?

Op I'd look at all options. There must be some way to make it work without throwing away your career completely. Your in a guaranteed job for life, few can honestly say that.

Its nuts to give up your career, absolutely nuts, you have no clue what the future holds for you individually or as a family, illness, divorce, death it happens.

Find a way, maybe both of you doing 80% hours, maybe a change of path, but keep your income and future.

He may not even need to go part time, but he could pick up most of the parenting and housework for the time you need to finish.

@Coffeeandbeans

“That said I have every respect for the women who choose to give up their work and be full time mums. “

I work full time - I’m still a full time mum!!!! When the kids are sick the school still calls me - I don’t have the option to say I’m only a part time mum can you look after them please. The sooner we stop this part time mum rubbish the better it will be for all woman.

Well said!!!

I'm assuming you went into this field as it's something your passionate about and are driven by rather than for the money? I couldn't throw that away. I would take the 3 months off, look for a new home and a new school, plus a nanny. Try and get that sorted then return, when your husband is fully qualified see if he can go PT while you qualify so there is less pressure.
OP you've worked so so hard for something that does so much good, your children will be so proud of you when they grow up that mum saves lives.
Good luck and take care

Can you stick at it for another year or so until your DH is qualified then he goes part time until you qualify?

And if you can try and set aside some time every day to sit with them and read/play, even if just half an hour/an hour some days, you'll feel better

Quite right @Coffeeandbeans. Comments like ‘full time mum’ or ‘giving up work to be a mum’ are so misleading! When we have children, we all become mums or dads. We don’t clock on or off being parents. I’m a full time mum who also went to work some of the time. I’ve never heard a SAHM say they stop being a mum When their kids are at school, or when they go to granny’s overnight or off for a play date. We’re always mums or dads whether we go to work or not

I’m a doctor, and I took time out a while ago expecting to be back in 2ish years continuing training... Well here I am 4.5 years later and still no return in sight due to our family circumstances. I haven’t read whole thread so I apologise if I’m repeating anyone.

2 thoughts - firstly, I completely disagree that changing specialties would inevitably result in a similar intensity of workload and expectation to surgical training. This quite simply isn’t true. There are many, many specialties which are infinitely more family friendly than FT surgical training, especially when done LTFT. Most, as I’m sure you’ll know, do 60/80% which immediately reduces your childcare bill but will not necessarily double the length of training. Also, if you have (from memory) 5/6 years to go time, surely even if it was another 6 years before you were fully qualified as a GP, your work/life balance in that time will have been infinitely better and you will have seen much more of your children, so it may well be worth it regardless.

Secondly, don’t underestimate the impact that quitting work completely will have on your own self-esteem, identity, drive and motivation, mental health, autonomy, sense self-worth and ability to have your own headspace from time to time, as well as your ability to return later to the same level (obviously specialty and stage dependent). For me, it’s been a LONG slog, and I’ve made huge personal sacrifices to be at home with my kids, as we don’t have much other choice (my view may be tainted by the fact that I parent alone most of the time week to week). Yes, it’s been a privilege, I wouldn’t have had it any other way on reflection, and I’m sure that I’ll look back at this time fondly in the future, but my God what I would give for a bit of myself back - the confident, successful, intelligent woman who breezed through her medical degree and had the time of her life, who was generally considered to be a pretty bloody good doctor and colleague, and who had the ability to eat lunch or drink a coffee or have a conversation with another adult without being kicked in the face/screamed at/drowned under yet another load of washing/called ‘Daisy’s mum’ by someone who has no idea what my name actually is (name changed for obvious reasons!!)...

My point is, I guess, in your position I would investigate the middle ground a little further before jacking it all in completely.

If you would like, PM me and I can point you in the direction of a couple of resources for docs on career breaks.

Good luck!

Have you considered doing GP training? I know others who have done that and found the ability to manage their hours much easier as a GP.

Haven't rtft but how about quitting and be self employed doing filler and Botox? You could choose to do a few hours a week at a Samson somewhere and imagine you'd make enough for a holiday etc

Develesko Agree totally! We seem to be on a hamster wheel of money /possessions here in UK .Many many people manage on a lot less than we all have in all parts of our world!Coffee and Beans I take your point and of course we are all F/T Mums whether at work or not ,however the SAHMs dont have to think about anything else other than DC /Home life/Hobbies .Whereas Working Mums have a lot more mental energy going into their work.Not saying this is good or bad but a valid point.

(I’m so sorry I misread your initial post @doctormumoftwo - just seen that you’re LTFT already - point one still stands though re. other specialties being much more family friendly!)

I agree with pp it’s not any old job to throw away.

It’s very well done to get this far. You shouldn’t be beholden but don’t underestimate the value of what it brings.

Also most definitely seek out women in same career. There are some posting here but also irl.

be a mom now and in 5 years from now, you comeback as doctor.

That's really not how it works.

In many more demanding careers, 5 year breaks means starting from scratch. With young people who have tons of energy and no obligations, for low pay. Whereas, if you had continued, you would already be in a lot more comfortable and established position offering you family friendly flexibility and enough money to buy in all kinds of help. It's not 'oh just take a little break'.