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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Rude or just a normal comment?

163 replies

Redolent · 29/08/2020 23:22

Will try to keep this brief since it’s not really a huge deal - just curious to see what people think.

Brother and sister-in-law recently moved into a new place (rental), from abroad. They have to quarantine - or are meant to, anyway. My sister had the keys and went round the day before and filled up their fridge, but also bought hampers with chocolates, lovely toiletries for both, slices, essential cutlery and dishware, as the kitchen was empty. Brother was immensely grateful and SIL also chipped in on the phone saying the same.

Sister speaks to SIL on the phone again yesterday, and latter mentions that ‘the flat was absolutely filthy and I’ve been cleaning it for three days’. Sister now feels like absolute shit, like she hasn’t done enough, but also pissed off at a rude comment that she would never have thought to make herself.

Thoughts? Have told sister to distance myself as this smacks of a self-entitled attitude.

OP posts:
BovaryX · 30/08/2020 06:28

Hence my own reading of self-entitlement into her character...but perhaps this is just a bridal thing

I think your sister is obsessively determined to find fault with your sister in law. Your sister in law has moved to a new country and instead of being welcoming, your sister is searching for reasons to create arguments. It sounds like not only don't you like your sister in law, but you resent her. Did your brother defy your family's suggestion about who he should marry? Simmering resentment against a woman you have not even met in real life and has only just married your brother? Your sister in law is stepping into a world of manufactured conflict. But I suspect you already know that.

Original poster
Redolent · 30/08/2020 06:33

@BovaryX

Hence my own reading of self-entitlement into her character...but perhaps this is just a bridal thing

I think your sister is obsessively determined to find fault with your sister in law. Your sister in law has moved to a new country and instead of being welcoming, your sister is searching for reasons to create arguments. It sounds like not only don't you like your sister in law, but you resent her. Did your brother defy your family's suggestion about who he should marry? Simmering resentment against a woman you have not even met in real life and has only just married your brother? Your sister in law is stepping into a world of manufactured conflict. But I suspect you already know that.

No as to whether he defied the family. Couldn’t be a more conventional marriage.

This simmering resentment isn’t from me, but my sister who has met her. I mention my own perception of self-entitlement based on her expectation that I fly out for their wedding.

Like I said, there’s no creating of any arguments. At worst, a bit of social and emotional distance for my sister, if she has this feeling of being slighted.

OP posts:
lottiegarbanzo · 30/08/2020 06:34

Incidentally, they're in quarantine, in a newly rented flat. How do you expect them to fill their time? Is cleaning not a normal part of settling into a new home and all the more likely to have time lavished upon it when they're literally confined to the flat for two weeks?

You already hate this SIL, don't you. It's utterly clear from your OP that you think she's not good enough for your brother, or has 'taken him away' from you.

Brother was immensely grateful and SIL also chipped in on the phone saying the same. says it all. In your eyes, his feelings are deep and real. She merely follows his lead, superficially. You attribute to her no true or sincere feelings.

I would go further and guess that you were brought up to believe that your brother was better and more important than you (quite possibly all boys and men were) so, given he's a nice person too, you and your sister feel slightly too much admiration for him, are a little too invested in 'looking after him' as a family priority and feel that no woman will ever match up to your familial expectations for him.

Am I barking up the right tree there? Poor, poor SIL if so.

Original poster
Redolent · 30/08/2020 06:37

@lottiegarbanzo

Incidentally, they're in quarantine, in a newly rented flat. How do you expect them to fill their time? Is cleaning not a normal part of settling into a new home and all the more likely to have time lavished upon it when they're literally confined to the flat for two weeks?

You already hate this SIL, don't you. It's utterly clear from your OP that you think she's not good enough for your brother, or has 'taken him away' from you.

Brother was immensely grateful and SIL also chipped in on the phone saying the same. says it all. In your eyes, his feelings are deep and real. She merely follows his lead, superficially. You attribute to her no true or sincere feelings.

I would go further and guess that you were brought up to believe that your brother was better and more important than you (quite possibly all boys and men were) so, given he's a nice person too, you and your sister feel slightly too much admiration for him, are a little too invested in 'looking after him' as a family priority and feel that no woman will ever match up to your familial expectations for him.

Am I barking up the right tree there? Poor, poor SIL if so.

They’re not quarantining.

No you’re definitely off, sorry.

OP posts:
eatsleepread · 30/08/2020 06:37

I can kind of understand why your sister would have taken this as a dig.
Didn't she notice it was dirty? I wouldn't have cleaned it myself, but would probably have forewarned them so that they could get cleaners in if required.

BovaryX · 30/08/2020 06:38

@lottiegarbanzo

Incidentally, they're in quarantine, in a newly rented flat. How do you expect them to fill their time? Is cleaning not a normal part of settling into a new home and all the more likely to have time lavished upon it when they're literally confined to the flat for two weeks?

You already hate this SIL, don't you. It's utterly clear from your OP that you think she's not good enough for your brother, or has 'taken him away' from you.

Brother was immensely grateful and SIL also chipped in on the phone saying the same. says it all. In your eyes, his feelings are deep and real. She merely follows his lead, superficially. You attribute to her no true or sincere feelings.

I would go further and guess that you were brought up to believe that your brother was better and more important than you (quite possibly all boys and men were) so, given he's a nice person too, you and your sister feel slightly too much admiration for him, are a little too invested in 'looking after him' as a family priority and feel that no woman will ever match up to your familial expectations for him.

Am I barking up the right tree there? Poor, poor SIL if so.

I feel very sorry for the sister in law too. Imagine what it's going to be like if this is the introduction to her life of in laws?
BovaryX · 30/08/2020 06:42

This simmering resentment isn’t from me, but my sister who has met her. I mention my own perception of self-entitlement based on her expectation that I fly out for their wedding

There is a subtext here and the subtext is that both you and your sister seem to actively resent your sister in law. Yet you have not even met her. She said the rental property was dirty and she had the temerity to mention this. Your sister is describing simmering resentment as a response. This is manufactured conflict and its target is your sister in law.

SavoyCabbage · 30/08/2020 06:50

Your sister is in danger here of causing a family argument that may do long term damage. She sounds determined to martyr herself.

Bringing some things to a house to welcome a sibling does not mean that that sibling or his spouse may never say a negative thing about something else.

It's like a trap.

If your SIL had said that the plates were ugly or the spices inferior then your sister could have jumped on that as an actual slight. If your brother hadn't thanked his sister then that would have been something to complain about. But they have been suitably grateful.

lottiegarbanzo · 30/08/2020 06:51

No you’re definitely off, sorry.

That's good news! What are you sorry about?

Original poster
Redolent · 30/08/2020 06:53

@BovaryX

This simmering resentment isn’t from me, but my sister who has met her. I mention my own perception of self-entitlement based on her expectation that I fly out for their wedding

There is a subtext here and the subtext is that both you and your sister seem to actively resent your sister in law. Yet you have not even met her. She said the rental property was dirty and she had the temerity to mention this. Your sister is describing simmering resentment as a response. This is manufactured conflict and its target is your sister in law.

So you’re permitted to deduce social ‘subtexts’ and to authoritatively ascribe sentiments to me, but my sister isn’t allowed to do the same?

The reasons my sister gave for her own sense of simmering resentment are outlined in the previous page.

I don’t ‘resent’ her. Like I said, someone is self-entitled if they have certain unrealistic expectations of others (in this instance, me of attending a wedding abroad). And yes, that shapes my perceptions of her.

OP posts:
BovaryX · 30/08/2020 06:57

You posted on AIBU about whether your sister is unreasonable to have simmering resentment to your brother's new wife because the latter made a comment that the rental property was dirty. Posters are pretty much in agreement that not only is your sister's reaction unreasonable, but that is bound to cause conflict. And you are questioning my right to comment? I suspect I am not alone in feeling very sorry for your sister in law. The resentment from you and your sister is explicit.

Beautiful3 · 30/08/2020 06:57

I dont think the dirty flat comment has got anything to do with your sister. She's been away for a long time so of course its dirty. Think your sisters taking it a little personal.

tara66 · 30/08/2020 07:08

In a rented property - it should be in a good condition including being very clean when handed over to the renter. It is down to the landlord or rental agent to ensure that. So your sister should in no way be offended by SIL comment regarding state of flat and she and you should know that. SIL should have taken photos of flat and complained to landlord/rental agent with the photos. Nothing at all to do with your sister.

GhostCurry · 30/08/2020 07:09

“Have told sister to distance myself as this smacks of a self-entitled attitude.”

So you advise you sister that your SIL is entitled, but then go on to say “I think there’s probably some underlying tensions that I’m not privy to in this case”? Er, no. You don’t get to interfere and make value judgments and then hold your hands up like “oh, nothing to do with ME!”

You then say that, after speaking to your sister, she is adamant that her brother and SIL would expect to arrive to a clean flat. Yet they didn’t. So - by your sister’s logic, she let them down.

You all sound like hard work.

CJsGoldfish · 30/08/2020 07:12

Your poor SIL. She is really up against it isn't she?

Original poster
Redolent · 30/08/2020 07:13

@BovaryX

You posted on AIBU about whether your sister is unreasonable to have simmering resentment to your brother's new wife because the latter made a comment that the rental property was dirty. Posters are pretty much in agreement that not only is your sister's reaction unreasonable, but that is bound to cause conflict. And you are questioning my right to comment? I suspect I am not alone in feeling very sorry for your sister in law. The resentment from you and your sister is explicit.
No that’s not what I posted in the slightest.

I posted the OP as described. Subsequent posters said the response from my sister was OTT and there may be other things going on. I said that it looked like there was some existent ‘simmering ill feeling’ by my sister towards her, for whatever reason, hence best to distance. I’ve now obtained some clarity on what those reasons are. From those reasons, yes I think my sister is overly invested and this has turned into being all about her previous acts of giving. My response is simply to say, just stop giving if you’re then going to feel bad about it.

I never used the word resentment in my initial posts. No idea why you’re bolding it as though it’s a direct quote.

OP posts:
BovaryX · 30/08/2020 07:22

Er, you initially used the phrase simmering ill feeling and then you said this:

This simmering resentment isn’t from me, but my sister who has met her

You explicitly acknowledge that there is simmering resentment over an absurdly trivial non event. You have not even met your sister in law, but you have judged her entitled for asking you to attend her overseas wedding. And the language you use to describe her; she chipped in she's gallivanting around town without telling us show your resentment. I feel very sorry for your sister in law. It must be awful living as a new bride with this manufactured conflict and resentment.

mummmy2017 · 30/08/2020 07:31

I can understand your Sister if she has in the past had pointed remarks made at her.
Tell her to just smile and never offer to help beyond what she really wants to do.
The nice gifts should have been accepted with grateful thanks.
I think most people clean a new home, so that is your SILs job, maybe she thought she could get free labour and your sister didn't volunteer, so SIL was miffed.
Don't get caught up in trying to please others, just smile and be pleasant.

Original poster
Redolent · 30/08/2020 07:32

@BovaryX

Er, you initially used the phrase simmering ill feeling and then you said this:

This simmering resentment isn’t from me, but my sister who has met her

You explicitly acknowledge that there is simmering resentment over an absurdly trivial non event. You have not even met your sister in law, but you have judged her entitled for asking you to attend her overseas wedding. And the language you use to describe her; she chipped in she's gallivanting around town without telling us show your resentment. I feel very sorry for your sister in law. It must be awful living as a new bride with this manufactured conflict and resentment.

I used the phrase simmering resentment on p2 because you quoted me as saying it... so I assumed that I had, on p1. I then checked, and no I didn’t.

Yes someone is definitely self-entitled if they express overt displeasure, or make you feel guilty at you not attending their overseas wedding. That position I have no qualms with maintaining.

I said that they’re both breaking quarantine and that my sister has spoken to my brother about it. You’re completely overreaching.

The worst thing as a new bride is to have interfering in-laws. Overly invested ones who give in order to control, or who feel unduly slighted if they’re not shown enough appreciation. That’s why I don’t want my sister to do, so I asked her to distance.

OP posts:
Minimumstandard · 30/08/2020 07:33

Unless your sister cleaned or was expected to clean the flat, SIL wasn't being rude. Dropping off some nice things doesn't suddenly magic the flat clean.

SIL may be a bit demanding from what you've said but it may also be a series of misunderstandings.

hardboiledeggs · 30/08/2020 07:35

Your sister is BU here. If the house is dirty then its dirty. She is stating a fact.

BovaryX · 30/08/2020 07:38

I used the phrase simmering resentment on p2 because you quoted me as saying it... so I assumed that I had, on p1. I then checked, and no I didn’t

Do you even realise how absurd this is? If there was no simmering resentment, why would you explicitly acknowledge it existed? Beyond bizarre.

lottiegarbanzo · 30/08/2020 07:39

Practicalities:

Who rented the flat? (The clear inference is your Bro and SIL did this themselves).

Did they ask your sister to collect the key for them? Or did she offer?

Did they ask her, or any family member, to look at or check the flat in any way?

For how long did your sister have the key?

lottiegarbanzo · 30/08/2020 07:42

Oh and if welcoming new SILs is a big deal in your culture, especially one moving country like this, what else do you have planned to welcome her into the family? When will you meet her? Does she know things are planned?

WagnersFourthSymphony · 30/08/2020 07:43

OP, sorry you're getting a hard time here. Would your sister or your SIL regard it as your sister's responsibility to ensure the apartment was in good order as part of the welcome? If so, I can understand why the criticism felt undermining. Particularly difficult if the SIL was expecting this but your sister didn't see it as her responsibility.

Culture clash is so hard to deal with sometimes. Your SIL is going to find things way harder than your sister. It would be a kindness to help her adjust but if she is always so entitled I can see that's easier said than done.