To think you're not allowed to be proud of breastfeeding any more....

[TheatreJunkie84]

NOT a breast is best thread.

I've had the journey from hell. Tongue tie, painful feeds, thrush, not gaining weight, shitty latch, literally everything except low supply....but here I am 3 months in still going, on a combination of formula, pumped milk and boob.

I posted on a local baby group today a picture of me feeding, with a caption about how proud I was to still be going at nearly 3 months despite all the crap...thanking my local group and its peer supporters for their role in keeping me going and encouraging others to seek their help as they were so lovely and wonderful.

It started off well...messages of congrats and other stories of the peer supporters helping out new mums. Suddenly out of nowhere I got called arrogant and told I should have some respect for all the mums that choose to formula feed and I shouldn't throw be throwing it down everyones necks. Before I knew it loads of other mums all joined in, basically saying breastfeeding is nothing to be proud of and I should shut up. Things along the lines of 'big whoop you can feed your baby I cant so this makes you better than me? Piss off.'

I quickly deleted it, feeling really ashamed of myself. I'm on the verge tears now every time I think about it. Am I being unreasonable here? I honestly wanted to give up so many times....but the local group kept me going and if posting about my success can encourage other mums to seek their help then that's surely only a good thing?

I don't know.

“ Not only is breastfeeding a fundamentally important human behaviour that strengthens attachment and psychological outcomes, but the use of breastmilk substitutes – either exclusively or partially – has substantive short, medium and long-term impact on survival, health and wellbeing for babies and women. The use of breastmilk substitutes weakens infants’ immune systems, and impairs their cognitive development, behaviour, and appetite regulation, and it increases women’s risk of developing breast cancer, and probably also ovarian cancer and Type 2 diabetes.[1] There are extensive economic implications for health systems, families, and society as a whole.[2,3]”

From An evidence based studies review found here www.cochranelibrary.com/collections/doi/10.1002/14651858.SC000027/full

It is deficient in both iron and vitamin d, and the studies that show It's better are massively flawed

There should be enough stores of iron in the babies body to last around 4 months where its then recommended an iron supplement is taken until weaning at 6 months. I guess historically women would have weaned at 4 months although that's not recommended anymore. Likewise if the mother is not vitamin d deficient nor will the baby be. Which is why women in pregnancy need to keep these levels up. So potentially breast feeding is better as long as these levels are right, but if not then formula feeding would be a sensible back up.

who cares if offends other people? there is many things I cant do that others can, wouldnt tear them down for it though. breastfeeding can be hard - be as proud as you like. you're not responsible for all those who couldnt or didnt.

@Bewilderbeastie

Stop repeating this tired nonsense. The science does not support it.

Even if it did, what do you think is more important? Breastmilk or a sane mother who is doing what she chooses?

Even if it did, a LOT of things are beneficial for children. Living in the countryside, having a dog...why not go and pick on the people who refuse to have a dog instead?

Well done for making it through those difficulties. It sucks that you've met such negative people & I hope you can find a space where you can openly discuss the highs and lows of parenting. YANBU to feel mothers aren't allowed to be proud, other than it's been this way for decades so it's isn't an 'any more' situation. I'm not sure we've ever been able to, not really.

People go on that our culture shames FF, when really our culture shames mothers for whatever we do and pushes us to keep the pains and triumphs of parenting to ourselves. Hush hush, that's personal, couldn't possibly want to connect with others and build community, no you must only be looking for validation and must be forgetting that nothing we can do as mothers is something we should want to be proud of or discuss the pains of with others beyond a chuckle of having one's hands full and the rascals the kids are. That's why forums like mumsnet are popular, it gives many a space that's not there in-person for many.

I've definitely heard mothers say they're proud to have FF and not bothered with the fuss of breastfeeding. That they're proud to stand up to assholes who suggest they should have done otherwise. I think fair play to them, they know what they want(ed).

I've heard people claim breastfeeding mothers do it for their own sexual gratification. That doing it more than a couple months damages babies as it prevents them from bonding with anyone else. That it's disgusting. I know others who've faced sexual harassment while trying to feed their kid or told to go to the toilets in public or in other people's houses. I'd call all of that shaming.

We all go through shit. Our society loves to control people through shame (or many that's just a thing certain people love to do and society incentives it). Until it's recognized that we all go through shit in various different ways and not take someone enjoying their different choices and experiences as a personal attack on ourselves, we'll keep having these shaming 'wars'. It's ridiculous.

*it's the idea that because you 'pushed yourself to your limit' that you are better than me, who pushed myself in other ways, but dont post about it all over facebook for the world to see how great I am. In your eyes, you are a better mother than me because you bf and I didnt. People dont want to spend their time being reminded that the general consensus is that bf moms are better than ff moms. No woman is about to say 'I am so proud I ff' because the backlash would be horrific. We are told, mostly by bf mums, that we are less, so to keep our mouths shut and clap for the bf moms.

In reality, a mothers job is to make sure a baby is fed. That's it. That's the main thing. When are we going to stop pitting mothers against each other based on bf. Its infuriating.*

Aren’t you doing the same thing because you assume a perceived slight against your choices when there wasn’t one? Why does someone being proud of something they were able to accomplish through what was for them hard work a slight against someone else who couldn’t or chose not to?

If someone was proud about their weight loss and thanked the local group that helped them, should they be bombarded with messages that they shouldn’t be proud because others are still struggling with their weight?

Where does it end?

Regardless of which topic you want to discuss there are plenty of keyboard warriors out there, even on MN some people are so quick to find fault and be vile.
When I gave birth 30 yrs ago you were encouraged to BF by the midwife bit when you went home you did what suited you and no one could comment, probably helped that there wasnt social media back then.
I'm always surprised how mums are shamed for the decisions on how they feed their own babies.
Rise above it, leavthe group, it sounds like you doing great.

"So potentially breast feeding is better"

"Breast is potentially better if you take supplements" doesn't have quite the same ring.

@Thisismytimetoshine

Of course you're "allowed" to feel proud, don't be silly. But posting pictures on the baby group for public adulation is wanky in the extreme. What response were you hoping for; assuming the other members are at much the same stage that you are?

Hope about say something nice or don't bother posting? A few congratulations, a few people sharing their experiences, someone saying oh great, I'll try them. Honestly anyone who sees someone saying "I'm proud I've stick to do this" as a personal insult, need to deal with their issues

I’m afraid I’m in the honestly who cares camp. Every credit to every mum for whatever choices she makes.

Really don't understand people who post pics of themselves breastfeeding this to me is boasty.
Fair enough positing in a relevant group your achievement and thanking people for their support, but people who post pictures on social media to me is just a step too far.
I'm currently pregnant and not sure how I want to feed yet I don't think either is better than the other just what works for the individual, but I am very against flaunting this all over social media it's so cringe

If I'm honest, I'm slightly impressed by formula feeding as it seems to take such a lot of organisation and you have to make sure you get it right. I felt that I HAD to breastfeed my eldest, not because of any peer pressure but because we lived in a third world country at the time and I was terrified about the water quality for bottle feeding. I had a nightmare getting him established feeding, then I had thrush, he had thrush - it was an absolute nightmare until he started weaning. I fed him for 18 months but the first 6 months were hell on earth. I swore I would never go through that again.

With my second, we were back in the UK, she refused the breast once and I was adamant I would formula feed as I wasn't having the shite that went with the first one. However, by the time the next feed came round, I realised I hadn't even sterilised any bottles, worked out how much formula to use etc etc and realised that I couldn't do that either. Fortunately, she was much easier to feed and other than that one refusal was very straightforward.

So you know, whatever works. I wouldn't bother posting about being proud of it though. This is the problem with social media, you post something you think is nice and it's a bloody great pile on.

I’ve seen first hand, the bitterness and jealousy from mums who couldn’t BF. I couldn’t with my first 2 but did for 2 years with my 3rd.
So many fb status’ from one woman in particular. She was clearly very upset that she couldn’t BF but these ranty and downright nasty status’, aimed at BF mums, just made her look like a bit of a prat!

@DancingCatGif

you're allowed to feel however you want to feel.

Don't expect anyone else to care.

No one ever says they were proud of formula feeding so it does come across as a bit smug.

You fed a baby, it was your choice how you did it so it's a bit whatever really

Totally agree with this.

If you feel 'proud' what does that make those who can't/don't want to breast-feed, 'ashamed'? Seems an odd word to use in this context, it makes a judgement of others that is not necessarily justified

Seems the right word to me. Personal achievements should be celebrated. If someone is proud of the fact they can do pull-ups, it doesn’t make me ashamed that I can’t (or don’t want to)

Our culture is woefully deficient in images of and public breastfeeding, leading to a weird and puritanical and sexualised view of this natural behaviour. We need all the images and proud public breastfeeders we can get!
Yes! The main message on this thread seems to be “FGS, don’t TALK about it or share PICTURES of it, it’s PRIVATE.” Why should it be? Any minute we’ll get the “I hate mothers who flop one out to feed” and “Breastfeeding is fine for babies but weird for toddlers imo” comments. Even though the vast, vast majority of babies in the UK are formula fed, with only 1% of six-month-olds still exclusively breastfed, it’s breastfeeding that people are asked to keep under wraps or shut up about.

(Not a particular breastfeeding gong-banger, either [bap banger?], and I don’t think comments like “FF mothers are just jealous” are helpful, kind or true.)

think you can be quietly proud, but posting about your pride on a public forum, not aimed solely at breastfeeding mums could be seen as a bit goady.

It's not goady, that insinuates that OP posted just to try and prove a point, or to make others feel bad; not at all. It is important for society as a whole to try and better support all mums in how they choose/have to feed their baby, and it is emotive, but it's also not fair that those who have struggled through don't get to be proud of themselves.

To be honest, I think that sort of post can upset a lot of people. Those who didnt manage to do it and those who didnt try but dont want to be told they were crap for not doing so. I think it would be better posted on a breastfeeding forum to be honest. It's a bit like A Level successes and when schools post about about brilliant 3 top stars were. It automatically makes everyone else feel like failures.

@DancingCatGif what is 'tired nonsense'? Please be specific - are there actually peer reviewed studies (ie not by formula milk manufacturers) that concise that FF is just as beneficial as BFing?

I did say in my post that in some cases stopping breastfeeding is more beneficial to the wellbeing of the mother. You don't seem to be actually reading what I've written.

I'm not 'having a go'. Please read what I've written.

@DancingCatGif

you're allowed to feel however you want to feel.

Don't expect anyone else to care.

No one ever says they were proud of formula feeding so it does come across as a bit smug.

You fed a baby, it was your choice how you did it so it's a bit whatever really

Lots of people are smug about formula feeding

I'm breastfeeding my toddler (yes, still) and have heard from about 6 weeks 'she'd sleep if you gave her a bottle before bed, mine sleeps 8 hours because we ff' 'dont you want your body back?' 'what does your husband think' 'im so glad I ff, I couldn't walk around with my boobs out'

I actually find FF mums can be (obviously not all!!) Unbelievably smug and unpleasant.

Congratulations OP - it is an achievement and you have every right to be proud of yourself

You can be proud of your achievements without posting it on social media for all the people who were not able to breast feed to see and feel judged by.
I breastfeed my first okay but with my second I had lots of problems. I was told repeatedly that breast is best and to keep going. After three months he had lost so much weight and I switched to expressed milk and formula. He was a different baby overnight, I had obviously been starving him all that time. Not one of the many medical professionals, health visitors or breast feeding support people I saw during that time was prepared to say ‘try him on a bottle of expressed milk and see if that improves things’ because of the attitude that breast feeding should be promoted at all costs.
Maybe for many women choosing to bottle feed is the best thing to do for many reasons.

Hope about say something nice or don't bother posting? A few congratulations, a few people sharing their experiences, someone saying oh great, I'll try them. Honestly anyone who sees someone saying "I'm proud I've stick to do this" as a personal insult, need to deal with their issues
Personal insult?! I don't see it as an insult (), just ridiculously boastful and needy.

it's the idea that because you 'pushed yourself to your limit' that you are better than me, who pushed myself in other ways, but dont post about it all over facebook for the world to see how great I am. In your eyes, you are a better mother than me because you bf and I didnt.
I think you need to deals with your own issues if you see someone being period of themselves as an insult against you.

If someone posts about completing a marathon despite really struggling and thanking the local running group, should I post and angrily tell them how judged I feel because I can't run out don't want to?
What about someone who's learnt a foreign language with help from the local college or to drive? How DARE these people go on Facebook to publicly shame ME by bragging about what they're doing with their lives.

YANBU- It's like telling an athlete they can't celebrate their medal because people without legs will be made to feel not good enough.