To think you're not allowed to be proud of breastfeeding any more....

[TheatreJunkie84]

NOT a breast is best thread.

I've had the journey from hell. Tongue tie, painful feeds, thrush, not gaining weight, shitty latch, literally everything except low supply....but here I am 3 months in still going, on a combination of formula, pumped milk and boob.

I posted on a local baby group today a picture of me feeding, with a caption about how proud I was to still be going at nearly 3 months despite all the crap...thanking my local group and its peer supporters for their role in keeping me going and encouraging others to seek their help as they were so lovely and wonderful.

It started off well...messages of congrats and other stories of the peer supporters helping out new mums. Suddenly out of nowhere I got called arrogant and told I should have some respect for all the mums that choose to formula feed and I shouldn't throw be throwing it down everyones necks. Before I knew it loads of other mums all joined in, basically saying breastfeeding is nothing to be proud of and I should shut up. Things along the lines of 'big whoop you can feed your baby I cant so this makes you better than me? Piss off.'

I quickly deleted it, feeling really ashamed of myself. I'm on the verge tears now every time I think about it. Am I being unreasonable here? I honestly wanted to give up so many times....but the local group kept me going and if posting about my success can encourage other mums to seek their help then that's surely only a good thing?

I don't know.

@PrincessBuggerPants she's 14 weeks... so still a young one, hoping she takes a bottle soon!

Formula advertising is what is killing breastfeeding rates and it’s sickening how they are able to get away with it!

Why does this country (where formula advertising is illegal) have a lower breastfeeding rate than the US (where it’s widespread)?

I was on a very small close-knit forum when I had Dd1 (BGH FOR THOSE IN THE KNOW. Dd1 is now 16.5)

I developed severe pnd. Dd1 was born after fertility clinic intervention so I was always a red flag for pnd. After she was born I developed severe pnd. Counselling sessions every week etc. My pnd was absolutely caused by my online support making me feel that my inadequatcy to breastfeed was my inability to love my baby.

2 years of cyber bullying counselling and I had DD2. Her birth was horrific, we had a trillion problems. I always say I have has 3 children but 4 c-sections because DD2 was such a shitshow that they had to take me to theatre And redo my c section.. she was extremely inadequately breastfeed for 10 days.

DD3 was my 4 th c- section and I tried in hospital for 10 days to breastfeed her. Day 9 of my 3rd child was the first time I met the hospital “breastfeeding specialist” who then said I was too far gone.

When I had DD2 at home and phoned the NCT helpline (active nct member that I have national level certification to prove) all the nct phone numbers from my post code area went to. Phone dump that no-one checked. No-one had noticed for a year.

My children are now 16, 14 and 10. They were all formula fed from 2 weeks. No-one has set fire to a bus shelter and (having recovered from guilt induced pnd) I’m genuinely good mum.

BF mums judged me a lot.

I am scarred

@Wolfgirrl
Breastfeeding protects the baby from common infant illnesses it's not protection for life against all illnesses so your point is moot

@pollysproggle what illnesses does it offer complete protection from?

[quote Wolfgirrl]@pollysproggle what illnesses does it offer complete protection from?[/quote]
Is your google broken?

Type that question in and you will get pages and pages of research and articles on the matter.

Here are two from the first article...

“ extraintestinal infections, such as otitis media4–6 and respiratory diseases.”

@AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken

Really? Complete 100% protection?

@Wolfgirrl
Nothing offers complete protection as you know but protections from;
Ear infections, colds, diarrhoea, urinary infections, flu, meningitis...lots of thing look it up.

[quote Wolfgirrl]@AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken

Really? Complete 100% protection?[/quote]
I’d be happy with 1% protection if it was the best I could do. Nothing gives 100% protection. Even vaccines. Your arguments are facile.

@AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken

Well, I asked for what bfing provides complete protection from. As the answer is nothing, google wouldnt be able to help me would it

@pollysproggle yes but can you quantify them?

I think of women realised how minuscule the benefit was, they would be a lot less hung up on it. And realise it isnt worth their mental health/pain/tears/exhaustion at what should be the most magical time of their life.

@plplz

If you're feeding, loving and clothing your baby, you're a good mum and deserve to feel proud. When our babies are adults no one will be able to tell how they were fed as a baby, nor will anyone give a shite. This is anyone of any gender giving women a hard time.

We place so much emphasis on it, but there are positive and negatives to doing both. My DD breastfeeds like a bloody champion and its so nice sometimes, but refuses a bottle of expressed milk, and screams murder when we try so the negative is I am wrecked and sometimes spend the day in tears.

Fed is best.

Fed is not best. It is the absolute minimum we should expect to do as parents.

should we really be accepting fed as a 'best' rather than minimal standard?

'fed is best' is simply putting a sticking plaster over the gaping wound that is our lack of support for breastfeeding and mothering in general. We cannot afford to say that how babies are fed does not matter.

[quote Wolfgirrl]@AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken

Well, I asked for what bfing provides complete protection from. As the answer is nothing, google wouldnt be able to help me would it

@pollysproggle yes but can you quantify them?

I think of women realised how minuscule the benefit was, they would be a lot less hung up on it. And realise it isnt worth their mental health/pain/tears/exhaustion at what should be the most magical time of their life.[/quote]
So what’s your conspiracy theory then?

Why do all the leading health authorities, experts, doctors all agree that breast milk is best and a healthier start for babies? What are they gaining from it?

I’ll get my tin hat ready.

I think of women realised how minuscule the benefit was, they would be a lot less hung up on it. And realise it isnt worth their mental health/pain/tears/exhaustion at what should be the most magical time of their life

Health benefits to the baby, however minuscule you see them, are not the only reason a woman chooses to breastfeed.

I actually think that telling women that the newborn stage 'should be the most magical time in their life' is an even more surefire way to making a lot of women feel shit about themselves than putting them under pressure to breastfeed. I wish we'd stop doing both.

@GreenTiles22 - how others choose to feed their babies is up to them. If both bf and ff want help it should be available. I did my research and decided that ff was best for me and my family. I wasn’t interested in what the statistics are for those that do and don’t choose one method of feeding over another

@AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken

Well of course it is better/more natural. But the question is by how much. I could understand the high emotional/physical cost if breastfeeding if the health benefits were substantial, or even noticeable. But they're just not are they? I breastfed myself, I have no agenda. But I feel a bit sorry for women who wrecked their newborn days trying to breastfeed because they were told 'it raises a baby's IQ', only to find out it raises it by something like 0.7 points. When you crunch the numbers, the benefit is so tiny it is only noticeable on a national level.

@Wolfgirrl
Women breastfeed for many reasons and I'll throw in there that not all women find it a difficult and painful experience that wreaks havoc on their mental health.
It also pretty much carbon neutral and better for the environment.
Minuscule it is not, but I expect you know that already.

@Hardbackwriter

I actually think that telling women that the newborn stage 'should be the most magical time in their life' is an even more surefire way to making a lot of women feel shit about themselves than putting them under pressure to breastfeed. I wish we'd stop doing both.

I agree.

I did not find the newborn stage “magical” and it had nothing to do with breastfeeding my son.

[quote Wolfgirrl]@AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken

Well of course it is better/more natural. But the question is by how much. I could understand the high emotional/physical cost if breastfeeding if the health benefits were substantial, or even noticeable. But they're just not are they? I breastfed myself, I have no agenda. But I feel a bit sorry for women who wrecked their newborn days trying to breastfeed because they were told 'it raises a baby's IQ', only to find out it raises it by something like 0.7 points. When you crunch the numbers, the benefit is so tiny it is only noticeable on a national level.[/quote]
It’s not up to you to decide for other women how much the benefits are worth it. If they want to slog it out and persevere then let them and support them. All my friends stopped breastfeeding within days and I kept my mouth shut (other than complimenting them on how well they and baby were doing) because it’s up to them.
It’s bizarre that you’re arguing the toss about something you did the opposite to. The benefits were obviously worth it to you. God forbid anyone else feels the same way.

Congratulations OP.

There will always be people who will turn your pride in yourself into a perceived insult against them.

If other mums read your post and felt sad that they couldn't bf then that is something they have to deal with without being an arsehole to another person. They need supporting to come to terms with that, but it is not your fault.

With one of my children I wanted to make it work but I had that thing where you get a wave of very dark depression hit you when they latch on and I couldn't/didn't want to deal with that. BF might be 'natural', but fuck me, I had never experienced a feeling like that before and it scared me. Especially when I felt intense anger with it too. I had no idea what it was and I was too worried to tell anyone at the time.

@pollysproggle

I know. I found it incredibly easy. I didnt even get the tiniest bit of soreness.

As for the environmental impact, yes, but it still has some - breastfeeding women tend to buy nursing clothes, nipple cream, disposable/reusable breast pads, breast pumps (electric or manual), bottles, a steriliser, etc.

With formula, you just need 5 or so bottles, a steriliser, and tins of formula (tins and lids are recyclable).

So a breastfeeding woman with all the mod cons might actually create more environmental waste than somebody formula feeding.

[quote pollysproggle]@Wolfgirrl
Women breastfeed for many reasons and I'll throw in there that not all women find it a difficult and painful experience that wreaks havoc on their mental health.
It also pretty much carbon neutral and better for the environment.
Minuscule it is not, but I expect you know that already. [/quote]
Also, it’s free so women may choose to do it for financial reasons.

[quote Wolfgirrl]@pollysproggle

I know. I found it incredibly easy. I didnt even get the tiniest bit of soreness.

As for the environmental impact, yes, but it still has some - breastfeeding women tend to buy nursing clothes, nipple cream, disposable/reusable breast pads, breast pumps (electric or manual), bottles, a steriliser, etc.

With formula, you just need 5 or so bottles, a steriliser, and tins of formula (tins and lids are recyclable).

So a breastfeeding woman with all the mod cons might actually create more environmental waste than somebody formula feeding.[/quote]
I’ve breastfed two babies for 14 months each:

Nursing clothes- two bras
Breast pads- zero
Breast pump- zero
Bottles- zero
Steriliser- zero

Why are you trying to twist yourself in knots to argue against something you did?!? It’s madness

@Wolfgirrl
It's the production of the milk in the tin that causes the carbon footprint not so much the tins and bottles.

[quote Wolfgirrl]@pollysproggle

I know. I found it incredibly easy. I didnt even get the tiniest bit of soreness.

As for the environmental impact, yes, but it still has some - breastfeeding women tend to buy nursing clothes, nipple cream, disposable/reusable breast pads, breast pumps (electric or manual), bottles, a steriliser, etc.

With formula, you just need 5 or so bottles, a steriliser, and tins of formula (tins and lids are recyclable).

So a breastfeeding woman with all the mod cons might actually create more environmental waste than somebody formula feeding.[/quote]
Only if you think the production of formula - and, for that matter, milk, and indeed heating water to the right temperature to actually make formula - is a carbon-neutral process!