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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Rude SIL banned from country

234 replies

sergeilavrov · 24/08/2020 17:35

TLDR: My SiL got banned from the country we live in, after she tried to release my address (I have a senior position in a diplomacy/security related field) as she was upset that her son has said he wants to stay with us for longer. AIBU to not exert energy trying (and probably failing) to reverse the decision?

My SiL and I have never been close friends, and I concede that after some bad experiences with her joining dinner parties and family events we hosted (going into our bedroom, refusing to talk to any guests, turning up hours late, leaving hours early, asking to be invited an hour beforehand and requiring menu changes, bad mouthing me, making demands on DH, storming out and screaming) I did stop inviting her. This caused tension between DH and I early on in the relationship, but eventually he came to accept that we don’t have much in common and he has seen for himself that she has been repeatedly and outrageously rude. As such, we don’t do the ‘big family get togethers’ and we don’t know each other very well. Most of our communication goes through DH, and her requests for money are usually denied by him before they get to me. Unfortunately, over the years, she has told my DH and MiL that she finds me to be snooty, overpaid and selfish with money, having ideas above my station, feels like I’ve taken over the family etc. I’m usually not too bothered, and have never hit back with my own opinions beyond my DH, I just would prefer not to engage in the drama over someone I’ve seen a few times in five years.

SiL has a son, he’s a young adult, who she has fallen out with. She has some mental health issues that have worsened after her fashion business failed. We don't know precisely what these issues are, so as not to drip feed. It seems like home became pretty unhappy for my DN, and he asked to come and stay with either my MiL or us, and as my MiL lives in another country and doesn’t have much ability to support him - he came to us (in another country too). I work away, and so only see my family 10 out of the month, but always support him/include him when I’m there, and I know my DH does the same. We make sure he has money, given he can’t work in the country we live, have helped him look at education/business ideas for his next step, and he’s been great in terms of our two children. We haven’t asked how long he will stay, especially given the pandemic, and we’re quite happy for him to stay as long as he would like. He seems to be happy and settled. As it transpires, he recently told my SiL that he doesn’t intend on returning home to see her when flights reopen.

She has not taken this well, and has been sending me abusive emails that are quite explicit, insulting and harsh. In them, she explains that I have stolen her mum, her brother and her son, and left her with nothing. She has said that my children will hate me when they grow up and see me for who I am, and the best thing I can do for her family is to stay at work permanently. I have never replied to these emails, and when she got no response, she began calling DH screaming and crying about how he’s let me hurt her, and how betrayed she feels as his sister. This came to a head when she threatened to reveal my address on the internet. Due to the nature of my work, this isn’t appropriate, and could put my family in danger. As such, I reported this to my workplace who made a formal report to the police. It has since been decided to ban her from entering the country. I had no influence on this decision, it was entirely independent from me.

My DH agrees that I had to report this, as he is also concerned about our children, but the result of the report he feels is very harsh as she will not be able to visit at any point in the future. These bans are never reversed. He would like me to try and have this lifted, if she promises not to continue with the threats and commits to not releasing our personal information. This is particularly important to him, as he thinks she will go to his dad if she finds out (parents are divorced) and he’ll get a hard time from him. I think we can’t trust her to credibly commit to anything, the relationship is beyond fixing, and ultimately the government made a decision based on their own security preferences to ban her from the country. My SiL hasn’t been informed of the ban yet. My DN doesn’t know about this either, and my concern is for how he will react should he find this out. Advice on how to broach this would be well received.

Post edited by MNHQ

OP posts:
dreamingbohemian · 24/08/2020 19:09

OP you asked, What would I have done differently?

I mean I do sympathise, I have a complicated SIL too. I have gone the opposite way though and tried to stay on her good side, because as much as I hate drama, this is actually the easiest way to avoid drama. So I know you can't go back in time, but I think trying to erase her from your life was not a good call.

But given that you did have this adversarial relationship, you should have locked down your address and made sure she never got it. Again, can't change now, but that was ill-advised.

When she threatened to post it, I would have had DH speak to her and try to calm her down and point out how much trouble she would get in, and try to defuse the situation that way. If that did not seem to work, I would only report it then.

I disagree that it would look bad to at least inquire about reversing it. It would only look bad if you knew that's what would happen. You say you didn't know although that's weird if you're in security. It sounds like it would mean a lot to your DH.

You say you hope your DH will eventually get sick of SIL. But she's his sister and they were close before. I think you need to tread very carefully.

In security terms, you've been tactically successful in distancing from your SIL but your overall strategy has been too focused on short term effects.

JingsMahBucket · 24/08/2020 19:12

@MrsSchadenfreude why the fuck would you post that?

knittingaddict · 24/08/2020 19:12

You have a senior position in a diplomatic/security role and you tell your life story on MN.

Crack on.

I must admit that I read as far as that part and stopped reading. Shock

user1493494961 · 24/08/2020 19:14

When does the book come out OP?

ScorpioSphinxInACalicoDress · 24/08/2020 19:15

This reply has been deleted

This post has been hidden until the MNHQ team can have a look at it.

MrsGrindah · 24/08/2020 19:16

What on earth have I just read?!

BrightYellowDaffodil · 24/08/2020 19:17

Breaking it down, you’ve got three issues here.

One is the decision to ban your SIL from the country by the government of the country you’re in. I wouldn’t be challenging that or trying to intervene - if she was deemed a sufficiently serious security threat then I doubt very much that they’ll change their minds to ease a family argument. In fact, it kind of goes in your favour because you can say it’s out of your hands (which it is).

Secondly is your DP. I agree with a previous poster about him getting in first with his father, instead of waiting until the father has heard the hysterical version from your SIL, but ultimately he needs to put his partner and children first. If your security and safety could have been threatened by the actions of his sister then why is he pandering to her? Throw in the abusive emails and the history of batshit behaviour and I struggle to see what his problem is. It may well be a harsh penalty, but it also sounds like a proportional one. For him to put pressure on you to intervene is just wrong - frankly, he needs to grow a pair.

As for the third issue of your nephew, I’d be honest and upfront - lay out the facts neutrally as to what his mother had threatened, that you had no choice but to report it and that the decision was entirely out of your hands. Make it clear that your intention was never vengeful or intended to keep him away from her, in fact I’d encourage him to be in touch with her to try and head off the “You’ve stolen my son” narrative that your SIL is probably running. Hard as it is, I’d just be honest with him about the general situation without necessarily telling him everything (eg the abusive emails).

RedRec · 24/08/2020 19:18

"This caused tension between DH and I ..."
You have a 'senior position in diplomacy' and don't know the difference between me and I. Yeah.

WhyIsItSoHardToPickAUsername · 24/08/2020 19:18

*You have a senior position in a diplomatic/security role and you tell your life story on MN.

Crack on.*

This

lifesalongsong · 24/08/2020 19:19

@ScorpioSphinxInACalicoDress

This post has been hidden until the MNHQ team can have a look at it.
Is that worse than a deletion?

This thread is crackers

SummerPoppies · 24/08/2020 19:21

@katy1213
Was he on the balcony too? 🤭

JaJaDingDong · 24/08/2020 19:21

The usual rules about jurisdiction are much more blurred here, sovereignty isn't so clear as it is in Europe for example.

Are you on the moon? Or the Antarctic?
I can't think of anywhere else where sovereignty isn't clear.

I'm not sure I'd want a job in a country where it was so dangerous to my family if anyone found out where they lived.

CoronaBollox · 24/08/2020 19:22

Well Bond, if that is your real name...

If I slip you a name please can you work your magic?

Well if its legit then you did the right thing, I would not allow her to know my address and as her child is an adult there is no need to tell her. DH will have to get over it.

livefornaps · 24/08/2020 19:22

Super lol-lo

sergeilavrov · 24/08/2020 19:23

@dreamingbohemian

OP you asked, What would I have done differently?

I mean I do sympathise, I have a complicated SIL too. I have gone the opposite way though and tried to stay on her good side, because as much as I hate drama, this is actually the easiest way to avoid drama. So I know you can't go back in time, but I think trying to erase her from your life was not a good call.

But given that you did have this adversarial relationship, you should have locked down your address and made sure she never got it. Again, can't change now, but that was ill-advised.

When she threatened to post it, I would have had DH speak to her and try to calm her down and point out how much trouble she would get in, and try to defuse the situation that way. If that did not seem to work, I would only report it then.

I disagree that it would look bad to at least inquire about reversing it. It would only look bad if you knew that's what would happen. You say you didn't know although that's weird if you're in security. It sounds like it would mean a lot to your DH.

You say you hope your DH will eventually get sick of SIL. But she's his sister and they were close before. I think you need to tread very carefully.

In security terms, you've been tactically successful in distancing from your SIL but your overall strategy has been too focused on short term effects.

Thank you for taking the time to reply. I agree, maybe my reaction in terms of just freezing her out of our social life and limiting our interactions with her to just the three of us was unfair. Unfortunately, however, it's usually my colleagues who come to those events, and I didn't want her to ruin those networks. My DH never invited her to his own events, as he said she'd ruin them, so I do feel like there was a bit of a double standard there. However, we both came to agreement relatively quickly and excluded her. This may have been a time to instead have a frank conversation about our issues with her behaviour.

I really couldn't, however, not immediately report the threat to release our address. I'd be in trouble if they ever found out, and given all communications are tightly monitored - including the email address she sent this to, I definitely would be.

My DH and SIL go through cycles of hating each other, then often an incident sparks him reconnecting with her until he gets fed up again. I suspect that will happen with this too, but you're right not to bank on it. In a way, that relationship cycle is not great for her mental health either. I would never stop him from seeing her, just not in our home. They were close growing up, that's true, and I won't discount that in moving forward, though I won't be asking about dropping the ban.

OP posts:
HeronLanyon · 24/08/2020 19:23

This is all vaguely familiar -am I the only one remembering a similar remarkable thread a few years ago ? I guess a similar remarkable situation can occur in similarly remarkable circumstances remarkably enough. . . .
Hmm
Either way good luck op.

ScorpioSphinxInACalicoDress · 24/08/2020 19:23

Looks like it.
I said that the OP has a lot of identifying info about herself across many threads, so asking for MIL's country to be deleted seems a bit ineffectual and I also said "I'm not saying the OP is a troll but most of the worst trolls on MN build up a posting history" As we all know.
I expect this will be deleted too, but I'm not going down because of this crock.

BrightYellowDaffodil · 24/08/2020 19:24

I meant to add that I’d make it clear to your nephew that he’s not to blame for any of this, he shouldn’t feel guilty for his mother’s behaviour and that you’ll support him whether he decides to stay with you or return home at any point.

Twickerhun · 24/08/2020 19:25

Can you ban my MIL from the uk whilst you are at it? Thanks

nachthexe · 24/08/2020 19:25

Well DN knows exactly what his mum is like, and will likely understand fully why she can no longer be trusted with information (or to enter the country.) if he’s anything like the teenagers I know with parents suffering from complex mental illness, he is likely to find some relief that she won’t be able to turn up unexpectedly. (Disclaimer- I provided residential support for a teen and was told mum posed a considerable risk and to leave town or call the police if she turned up).
Get in first and tell the entire family that SIL caused a huge security risk and it was unforgivable, and that you hope that someone is supporting her with her mental health because she seems to be in a bad place. As a result of her actions you feel you can be in contact at this point as you need to safeguard work/ family.
What’s DN doing then? Just extended holiday, spending your money, and avoiding adulting? No wonder he wants to stay forever, particularly if he isn’t even allowed to work. Ideal! Do note that his mum may well be pissed because his relatives are enabling his louche extended adolescence, and she feels that it is detrimental to his independence.
You have to be very careful with taking in other people’s children. There are lines, however altruistic your intent.

Arthersleep · 24/08/2020 19:25

I feel sorry for her. If she did previously enjoy a very close relationship with your DH, then ultimately, you have come between her and her family, whether intentionally or not. And now you have facilitated a divide between her and her own child. You've not explained what you have done to help encourage a better relationship between the two. Nor have you said how you attempted to help her with her mental health condition. Instead you have put barriers there. You could have warned her of the implications of her threats before shopping her. You were the one to ultimately get her banned. This is very undiplomatic behaviour. And I would have thought it inappropriate to post on a forum rather than attempt to resolve it yourself. Also, I think that your sils assessment of you may well be correct, with the speed at which you wanted to inform others of your seniority and success.

Arthersleep · 24/08/2020 19:26

@Twickerhun

😂

Longwhiskers14 · 24/08/2020 19:26

Surely you've breached your own security posting here? So many identifying details when you add them together, including where your MIL lives.

Funguy · 24/08/2020 19:27

for heavens' sakes . To think people reply to this tosh. I think oif you were in a SECURITY position you would not be posting on blimmin Mum-snot.

CannibalQueen · 24/08/2020 19:27

[Grin]