Sexual harassment is an almost universal experience for women

[severeine]

I was having a conversation with a well-meaning male friend who was struggling to believe this. I think it is a case of not realising because he hasn't asked/spoken to enough women and isn't a perpetrator himself. For most women I think it is for to say this starts well before even the teen years and persists for 3 or more decades. I have experienced it myself, from school to work, in random situations and still do now. You don't need to be attractive, I am I suppose what you'd call average, you just need to be a woman, ideally unaccompanied. I was talking to one female friend who was harassed every single day by strangers when she lived in Paris, which is one place I've heard of it happening a lot, only it is everywhere. I wonder what your experiences have been?

I’ve been
CSA’d
Raped

And separate from above,
Proper sexually harassed at work
Had my clothes ripped off me (including bra and knickers) at two concerts
Upskirted
Cat called
Flashed
Groped (Ass, tits, crotch)
Forcibly kissed
Licked
Bumped and grinded against in a crowd
Hair played with and touched
Unwanted verbal advances

I wonder what the age difference is between those who experienced it constantly from age 12 and those who never have? only I am in my 40s and I think it was SO much worse in the 80s/ 90s than today. Men have learned to act more civilised, also builders can get in serious trouble for cat calling on site..

Yes @PlanDeRaccordement men are often violent to each other, as well as being violent to women.

Crikey @iwantmyownicecreamvan doesn’t sound like it has. I remember walking back to the metro on my own one eve (it was twilight and I took a wrong turn and got lost.) I was so scared it was going to get dark and I’d have to walk the mile from the RER station in the dark on my own. I can feel that feeling now I was petrified. This was 2006 though and haven’t been back since. Been on my own in New York, London, Berlin, nothing like Paris.

Totally agree with the OP

If I think of my college years, god yes, most nights you're out in a pub/night club you'd have someone who thought it was acceptable to block you/touch you/get properly in your space. In work/everyday situations, no, I'm lucky to have never experienced it

@HepzibahGreen

"They" have watered down the definition have they? God, it's not like the old days, when a man could comment on a 13 year old girls tits in the street and it was just "a compliment". Especially when he tried to follow her home and offered her money to suck him off. Banter! Or a group of lads could edge a lone woman against a wall and try to get their hands up her skirt "for a laugh". (Their laughs obvs) Or a harmless flasher could expose his penis to a young woman in a secluded place and follow her, wanking himself off. Damn women, re-classifying sexual harassment. Ruins everyone's fun. Political correctness gone mad.

Where did I say it was ok or harmless? I didn’t. They had separate names for these things and sexual harassment was reserved for bad sexual things where your job and not being homeless depended on you complying with the demands. It’s much more serious than other types of unwanted sexual behaviour.

It’s like how rape has been watered down by calling it just a type of sexual assault. Sorry but a pat on the bum or a grope of my tits is a lot less serious than being forcibly ducked.

It does us no favours to combine very serious with plain serious. It diminishes the fact that there’s many serious problems.

And yet I am sure there are men who were groped at age 11, and didn’t feel safe on the train or waking home alone for fear of being attacked
Yeah. My DP was once followed and harassed by a man (obvs) at 16 years old.
That happened, it wasn't nice. It was once. I can't even count mine, it was relentless from 12 to about 35.
If you had a son and a daughter you would know which one is going to get sexually harassed. I wonder what the motivation for trying to deny that sexual harassment and assault is much, MUCH worse for females could possibly be? Oh, and the thread was about harassment of females, not male on male violence. Different topic. Start your own thread.

When I was 12 a guy grabbed me, kissed me roughly with tongues and then walked away laughing.

When I was 15 I was in the store room of my Saturday job when the 23 year old Male worker pushed himself against me saying “this could be sexual harassment...if you want”.

I have so many stories from uni I won’t list them, from unwanted groping to rape.

Mid 20s I used to run and men would always shout things. I’ve also had men run with me uninvited.

I’ve sat on a bus whilst a man wanked under his jacket.

Men making comments about me being too thin, too fat, bouncy boobs.

I ran 3 times last week and men shouted after me on 2/3 runs. Now I’m older and fatter men are usually calling me fat or something. My husband has never had anyone shout at him and he runs anywhere, anytime.

I find it hard to believe a woman hasn’t experience any sexual harassment. Even just a comment.

Yep me too! Harassed in public places frequently - I’m not conventionally attractive - it always felt like a power play.

@gingganggooleywotsit

I wonder what the age difference is between those who experienced it constantly from age 12 and those who never have? only I am in my 40s and I think it was SO much worse in the 80s/ 90s than today. Men have learned to act more civilised, also builders can get in serious trouble for cat calling on site..

I agree. It was much much worse in the 70/80/90s than it is now. Women born in the 90s have no idea how bad it was. Just going to a house party was a gauntlet of groping, grinding, random forced kisses, hair being tugged, licked on the back of neck, etc I could go on. And it was just to be expected. Even police stopping you would take the opportunity to push you against a wall, kick your legs apart and feel you up.

Yes @HepzibahGreen
Oh, and the thread was about harassment of females, not male on male violence. Different topic. Start your own thread.

I agree start your own thread on Male violence you first dragged male violence into this, not I.

@shamalidacdak

Yep I don't believe there's a single woman on earth who has not received unwelcome attention from men

I agree, though I think there are many who normalise and minimise it to such a degree that they don't even see it.

I remember the first time I had a sexualised comment made to me by a man. I was 13 years old and I was flattered.

I agree start your own thread on Male violence you first dragged male violence into this, not I
Are you fucking drunk?

More men need to understand this and always believe the person saying this. It is prevalent to say the least.

What's also hideous (although the whole thing is utterly hideous) is there are men with daughters who see absolutely nothing wrong with the sexual objectification and harassment of females (I was going to say women but this is disgustingly prevalent towards children), excusing their behaviour with the myriad of bullshit reasons. Then there's the men who raise their sons to do this from a young age. Empowering females and calling out the behaviour is great but until the patriarchal stranglehold on the world is destroyed this shit is going nowhere.

DD overheard a medical professional who'd treated her a few minutes earlier, laughing to his colleague about what he'd like to do to her. She was pissing blood from a head injury. My complaints already in, not that I expect it to lead anywhere.

@HepzibahGreen

I agree start your own thread on Male violence you first dragged male violence into this, not I Are you fucking drunk?

Having a senior moment are you. You first posted about 11yr old boys fearing being groped or attacked on this thread not me...have a page through the thread why don’t you?

Agree, have had encountered a lot of inappropriate experiences... minor through to major. It hasn’t really affected me as I am very thick skinned and resilient but sometimes I think how crazy it is that all these things have happened. Flashers, indecent callers, gropers, rapists, so-called friends over stepping boundaries, senior colleagues who should know better... the list goes on. It is disgusting and if I dwell on it, it makes me feel really annoyed!

She was pissing blood from a head injury. My complaints already in, not that I expect it to lead anywhere.

That’s horrible behaviour the Dr did to your friend, but I hope he checked her abdomen? Because a head injury doesn’t cause you to pee blood, a kidney or uterine injury does.

So many incidences here too. And every one of my friends as well.
I really feel bad for my dd, my dns and all girls/women putting up with this shit.

It started at school where no one seemed to think it was an issue that the teenage boys pinged our bra straps, groped our beasts and smacked our bums in the corridors. It makes me furious now just thinking about it. DD starts secondary school this year, if any boy so much as touches a hair in her head in the school corridors I will be raising hell.

Workmen making comments and whistling. Having my crotch grabbed on holiday and in nightclubs at home. Being asked for a kiss when I was on work experience - I was 15.

It's all so casual and 'just banter' that you're made to feel stupid for being confused or annoyed by it.

I hate the way that it had become the norm at work for women to be kissed in greeting by colleagues in meetings. Men shake hands. Women get kissed. I don't want to be kissed by men at work thank you. It just feels like men always have a reason to touch women.

My boobs started to develop at around age 12 or 13 and that's when the leering, commenting and groping started. It's no wonder, now I think about it, that I hated my big boobs and was desperate for a reduction. This behaviour from men can and does have lasting effects.

Yep, its everywhere, every day.

Society objectifies women.

Luckily I have now let myself go in order to be off radar. So now I am a target of not being a proper woman. I don't care as long as I am not being the target of inappropriate sexual behaviour finally.

I agree with you OP. I think it's a very common experience and men who don't realise that have their heads in the clouds.

@HerNameWasEliza

I agree with you OP. I think it's a very common experience and men who don't realise that have their heads in the clouds.

My DH didn't believe me when I told him just a tiny proportion of the harassment women face on a daily basis, he thought I was exaggerating. We we shopping one day and I was ahead of him (his is a slow poke) a man coming towards me was literally jaw agape staring at my tits. He nearly punched the fella. I told him that that was the least of it and not a unusual occurrence. He believed me then.

Yep, very common. I have personally been flashed at, groped, cat called etc etc on many, many occasions. Close family members and friends have experienced the same, up to and including rape. As for other posters though, the most sustained, horrendous experiences were when I lived in France in the late nineties. Not in Paris and not all with men of North African origin. It seemed prevalent throughout society. I was very, very glad to return to the UK.