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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to be peeved that my kids refuse to be tested for Covid!

300 replies

sadpapercourtesan · 14/08/2020 11:45

We've been asked to be part of the testing programme as a family - we'd be tested every week for 5 weeks, then every month for 12 months. DH and I want to do it, particularly the antibody test as we'd like to know whether we've got immunity. Our boys (16 and nearly 18) refuse; DS1 doesn't fancy the nose swab and DS2 says he'd rather not know! So that's that Sad

Obviously it's their choice to make, but I'm peeved that DH and I won't get to participate now, as it has to be the whole family. Grrr.

OP posts:
Mommabear20 · 14/08/2020 17:52

Serious over reaction to the test! It's uncomfortable yes but over quick and not painful at all!

SleepingStandingUp · 14/08/2020 17:53

Bribing children or anyone to do something they have previously rejected is seriously wrong bit I won't wash the neighbours car for free, I would for £50. I don't want to dye my hair green, bit if the research was important and they paid me £50 I might. Fair reward for whatever I have to go through

Hotandknackered · 14/08/2020 17:56

I think it's quite selfish and I'd be dissapointed to see that in any family members. In particular my own children. Selfish because it means you can't do it but also because it's something that helps research into a deadly virus. I'd jump at the chance to take part to contribute to the research.

trappedsincesundaymorn · 14/08/2020 17:59

@Mommabear20

Serious over reaction to the test! It's uncomfortable yes but over quick and not painful at all!
For you but not others.
CeibaTree · 14/08/2020 18:01

@Mommabear20

Serious over reaction to the test! It's uncomfortable yes but over quick and not painful at all!
I agree! We have done 5 tests so far and I really don't understand the fuss some people are making over the tests. Yes they are not pleasant, but it's not like having a tooth out without anaesthetic or something!
vodkaredbullgirl · 14/08/2020 18:01

Everyone view pain differently, it might not hurt you but might hurt others.

PiataMaiNei · 14/08/2020 18:03

I don't understand how people don't understand not everyone feels or experiences things in the way they do. Surely that's a very basic life lesson? Personally I'd choose to have the test if invited to participate, but surprisingly enough other people aren't me.

OnTheFencePaint · 14/08/2020 18:35

There’s loads of things we need to teach/urge our children to do or not to do, that involve their bodies. Going to school, sleeping, eating, peeing in the toilet and not on the floor...

Context matters and ‘bodily autonomy’ is not a full argument.

If there was a fear of pain involved that’s one thing but sounds like they’re just not bothered.

PinkSparklyPussyCat · 14/08/2020 18:36

If there was a fear of pain involved that’s one thing but sounds like they’re just not bothered.

And that's their right.

InDeoEstMeaFiducia · 14/08/2020 18:39

So if one of your dcs would die or be severely impeded in some way if they didn’t have a procedure, you wouldn’t force them? Because that’s the outcome of the line you’re taking.

My dd isn’t having a vaccination this school year (year 8) as forcing her would be a serious boundary issue. It doesn’t sound that way with these older teens and I was wondering if they simply haven’t thought this through. Bribes for something people don’t fancy isn’t manipulation. No one is advocating forcibly testing these boys.

That's correct, Mummy. I would not force them, and provided they meet the Gallick scale and conditions, a court won't force them, either, because they have bodily autonomy after a certain age or when they demonstrate a certain degree of reason. And before you trot out 'Yes, you would', I watched one of my children die from cancer. She was too young to be able to decide treatment options for herself, we had to make those decisions and did, but knew some who were indeed old enough and their decisions were respected. As should be. I would not force my child and could not, that's not how our society works, thankfully, or people would be forced to have all kinds of things 'for the greater good'.

My DD2 turned down the HPV jab at 11. I respected that. She later took it up at 14 of her own accord. She was in no way pressured by the nurse at school either. She said no and that was that. When she wanted to have it, she got in touch with the nurse at her school and had it.

Bribing someone to have a medical procedure or test they have said no to is manipulation. No means no.

InDeoEstMeaFiducia · 14/08/2020 18:44

@PiataMaiNei

I don't understand how people don't understand not everyone feels or experiences things in the way they do. Surely that's a very basic life lesson? Personally I'd choose to have the test if invited to participate, but surprisingly enough other people aren't me.
Exactly! I find smear tests a doddle. I've volunteered to have med students take them on me, they don't bother me at all. But it doesn't take a genius to realise that we are all different and some people find them terribly painful. Same with dental work and having blood drawn. I mean, really? No one is that hard of thinking? It'd be a no go for me without sedation due to PTSD and for DS due to his autism.
InDeoEstMeaFiducia · 14/08/2020 18:47

@OnTheFencePaint

There’s loads of things we need to teach/urge our children to do or not to do, that involve their bodies. Going to school, sleeping, eating, peeing in the toilet and not on the floor...

Context matters and ‘bodily autonomy’ is not a full argument.

If there was a fear of pain involved that’s one thing but sounds like they’re just not bothered.

It is when it comes to medical procedures and tests on one's body, or anyone touching one's body in a way that person does not consent to. Those are nothing akin to teaching a child not to piss on the floor Hmm.

People are allowed to not have a medical procedure or test on them because they do not want to and so don't consent to it. There might be consequences in some cases, such as having to self isolate, but again, they cannot be forced, bribed or coerced, that's a boundary for a good reason. They don't have to give a reason or justification and that doesn't make them a bad person.

OnTheFencePaint · 14/08/2020 19:10

No one is suggesting forcing or coercing.

I don’t see why a parent can’t ask for the child’s reasons, and tell them why they think the test is the right thing to do.

Are we now not allowed to guide our children on ethical matters but must take the child’s lead without questioning?

PiataMaiNei · 14/08/2020 19:12

The pissing on the floor comment is one of those times where you read it and really hope the person is just bullshitting.

Sixgeese · 14/08/2020 19:20

My 11 year old was part of the random selection of the population that was tested a couple of weeks ago.

We thought we were going to have to pin her down for the nose and throat swabs and is a drama queen who screams when I brush her hair.

It was fine, she says unpleasant but not painful, she preferred the throat swab as the nose one tickled.

CouldBeOuting · 14/08/2020 19:21

I want to say that at no point was I saying that OPs DC were wrong to not want to take part or that they should be forced to do so. My “household” is supposed to be tested weekly but DS has SEN and even the thought of the test is distressing for him so I refused to have him tested.

I was prompted to comment by the “painful” comments. I work with a lot of people who all have the test weekly and I know no one who has used the word “painful” to describe it that’s all.

InDeoEstMeaFiducia · 14/08/2020 19:40

@OnTheFencePaint

No one is suggesting forcing or coercing.

I don’t see why a parent can’t ask for the child’s reasons, and tell them why they think the test is the right thing to do.

Are we now not allowed to guide our children on ethical matters but must take the child’s lead without questioning?

When it's suggested to bribe them to do it even though they have said no (and in this case they have given a reason, they don't have to, no is perfectly acceptable), then that is coercive behaviour.

It's a medical test/procedure on their person, not pissing on the floor or going to bed Hmm. And on a 16 and 18-year-old. They can sign up to join the forces and you can tell them you think it's wrong, so what; they can have sex, leave home, vote, drink (well, the 18-year-old), etc.

It's not an ethical matter to them, hence, they said no.

InDeoEstMeaFiducia · 14/08/2020 19:42

@PiataMaiNei

The pissing on the floor comment is one of those times where you read it and really hope the person is just bullshitting.
And yet you know they're not. SMH. Honestly, yes, having your nose and throat swabbed repeatedly when you don't consent is exactly like pissing on the floor. Hmm
romeolovedjulliet · 14/08/2020 19:52

all the i've had it done and it's so easy, can fuck right off, everyone is different and feels pain / discomfort in different ways or are some people so thick they can't get their heads round that simple fact ?

OnTheFencePaint · 14/08/2020 19:57

Re ‘pissing on the floor’ I was making the point that bodily autonomy needs context.

The context here is that the children have not given any impression they‘re worried about the physical test itself or fear of pain or discomfort.

It seems you think they’re not allowed to be questioned or challenged at all on their reasoning by their parents; I disagree.

InDeoEstMeaFiducia · 14/08/2020 20:04

@OnTheFencePaint

Re ‘pissing on the floor’ I was making the point that bodily autonomy needs context.

The context here is that the children have not given any impression they‘re worried about the physical test itself or fear of pain or discomfort.

It seems you think they’re not allowed to be questioned or challenged at all on their reasoning by their parents; I disagree.

When it comes to medical procedures and tests on a person of competence, no, it does not need context at all, a person of such competence will not be forced to undergo a procedure or test he/she does not want. They don't have to give a reason and questioning or challenging them for not wanting a medical procedure or test done on their body and thereby not consenting to it is manipulative. Opinion, fine, but they said NO. That's the end of the matter. One of these children is legally an adult. The other is to all intents and purposes one as well.

Can you imagine? Parent of teen: 'I think you should get the implant, you could get pregnant'. Teenager: 'No, thanks, I don't want it.' 'WHY don't you want it? It only takes a few seconds, it's painless. It's for your own good. How about if I give you £££ or vouchers to have it?' what the reaction would be on here. 'I want my teenager to have the implant/a pregnancy test/a smear test but she said NO' - anyone who suggested bribing her, manipulating her, challenging her, etc would be flamed, quite rightly.

GertiMJN · 14/08/2020 20:09

Why is this research giving hundreds of pounds of vouchers for participants and who is funding this???

PiataMaiNei · 14/08/2020 20:23

@OnTheFencePaint

Re ‘pissing on the floor’ I was making the point that bodily autonomy needs context.

The context here is that the children have not given any impression they‘re worried about the physical test itself or fear of pain or discomfort.

It seems you think they’re not allowed to be questioned or challenged at all on their reasoning by their parents; I disagree.

It was a terrible point. Children need to learn not to piss on the floor, and at a young age too. Teenagers, one of whom is actually an adult in any case and the other highly likely to be Gillick competent, do not need to learn that their desire not to participate in invasive medical research can't be respected for what it is and allowed to happen without then being subjected to urges and challenging (your words). Indeed, that's exactly what you shouldn't be teaching them. Because it's fucking appalling.
missmouse101 · 14/08/2020 20:31

I am currently working on this ONS study and reassurance is often what the children need. It's their natural knee jerk reaction to say no but explaining, encouraging them to watch the technique video and suggesting just trying giving it a go as it's so important, is well worthwhile. Of the children in the households that are participating, NONE have dropped out and none are uncomfortable or bothered by the technique. It's really important to participate for accurate statistics!

CeibaTree · 14/08/2020 20:32

@romeolovedjulliet

all the i've had it done and it's so easy, can fuck right off, everyone is different and feels pain / discomfort in different ways or are some people so thick they can't get their heads round that simple fact ?
Of course I understand that, but there is a certain amount of hysteria running through threads on mn about how awful the test is. It's ok for someone to say they don't understand why some people find it so bad and I'm sure people who hate it can't understand how someone else has had multiple tests and didn't bat an eye lid- it's all a matter of perspective and offering another view point. This is a discussion board is it not?