For not wanting to see this child ever again?

[justchecking80]

Today son (6yo) and I met acquaintance mum and her child (4yo) for lunch and play in the park. We are both in a larger group due to go on holiday with kids later in August and mum approached me asking for a playdate so the kids "can get to know each other".
This child is "difficult" and prone to aggressive behaviour and tantrums. We've been out with them a couple of time and child has been very physical, in one instance even wrapping his arm around my son's neck.

Anyway, we met for lunch and things went ok, although towards the end child decided he wanted to lay down on his and son's chair so my son had to stand up while his mum was finishing her meal. Also, at one point the child started screaming extremely loudly with people staring at us.
We then went to the park where child has been:

• throwing sand on my son, aiming to his face
• being disobedient and totally disregarding what his mum was asking him to do/not to do
• invited my son to a race with their scooters, resulting in me and mum losing sight of them for a good 10 minutes, I've never once lost my son before. During this time my son got slightly injured falling from the swing while child was pushing.
• throwing gravel stones at me and my son, and carrying on after his mum asked him to stop
• at the end of the playdate, we were due to leave and by now I was looking forward to it to catch the train home and after I asked the child to return my son's scooter because we needed to run for the train he decided to run away with it while his mum chasing him for a good 10 minute, resulting in us actually missing the train
• when we finally got hold of them (mum was still trying to take the scooter out of child' hands) I told the child he was being naughty and he replied I am a stinky poop
• we then left mum and child behind to try to get the train child was having a meltdown anyway but after realising that was too late we slowed down our pace, resulting in mum and child catching up with us and having to walk together while child kept calling me stinky poop for several times ignoring him mum's plea to stop.

AIBU for not wanting to meet this child ever again and now dreading to have to spend a week with them in August?

My young son is autistic and we often get looks from judgemental adults who should know better then to stand there staring at my poor son while he is having a meltdown because he is struggling to cope.
I bet she is mortified by your message and wishing she wasn’t going away with you, I certainly would be!

I would have spoken up at the chair stealing and definitely at the gravel throwing. You let these things happen to YOUR child. You were as ineffective as she was.
I am cringing myself inside out at your text however. How horrible!! Total blame throwing and completely unnecessary. She will definitely avoid you now so I guess in a way being so Mean Girl by text rather than an effective parent at the time has worked for you. Urgh.

I'd have left after the throwing gravel stones incident. And I wouldn't go on the holiday.

Text wasn't necessary, She knows her 4 yr old is in control, and it sounds like he was in control of the lot of you.?..😱

Kids need boundaries, and a 4 year old who is that unruly definitely needs firmer ones...It sounds like he was begging for boundaries.

Look back to when you were kids... the wet adult who let you run ragged was not respected...But a stricter parent was!

Too many labels these days...Was in a pharmacy a few years ago while a girl {perhaps 8 yrs} demolished shelves and hurled shampoo bottles about while her mother simpered and smiled indulgently...And didn't attempt to clear up the mess...
Just said ''She has Dyspraxia''... with a shoulder shrug...and walked out.

She may well have had Dyspraxia, but a firm ''NO'' and being made to help clear up would have been a step in the right direction?

She looked unhappy, as so many ''naughty'' children do. :(

I think it sounds like the other child has SEN. The mum sounds out of her depth. This will just be the start of it for her and I really hope shes got some proper support and non judgemental friends

I remember the fierce whispered conversations with my own primary school children when they were forbidden to join in with other children running around cafes etc. Generally it started with the "not fair" wail. Why can X do it and I can't.

I would be trying to avoid her child too. If you like her then why not suggest an adults only trip somewhere one day.

You clearly were not supervising your own son if he disappeared for 10 minutes. Your very uptight and unkind.

You are being ridiculous - your language is obvious you are blaming a 4 year old(!) rather than yourself. "not play together ever again..." is your title for the thread. My children haven't always got on with others and we've not met up with specific children for a while (either by circumstance or on purpose) and then the next time they've played beautifully together.

I don't think you should go away with them because of your attitude, not the other child.

My take on this. The mother knows her son is a nightmare and is worried about the holiday. She's picked up that you are a bit of a pushoever ie.e not the sort of mother who will be firm with someone elses' child and is a 'play nicely together now boys' type. She has arranged this playdate so her son will know someone when you get on holiday. She has used your text to say 'yeah both kids were naughty, they copied each other' and believes that isn't a problem. When you get on holiday her son will make a beeline for your son.

In your situation I would arrange play dates with other chidren going on the trip so your son establishes other friendships prior to going otherwise he could potentially end up with this child stuck to him. Besides there is a lot of difference between 6 and 4 so they may be doing different stuff. If he is as naughty and undisciplied as he sounds other parents will see this and want to steer their children away. This may sound mean but no way would Iet this child ruin my and my family's holiday, the mother needs to discipine him.

Lastly I would never have put up with a child doing stuff like throwing sand and stones at my child and I would call another parent out on a chid calling an adult 'stinky poo'. I would have left way earlier in the playdate.

I am struggling to understand why you would ever have agreed to be on holiday with other people when you already know they have a child who can be a PITA.

Holidaying with other people - shudder.

I'm still mystified at op going on holiday with people she wouldn't organise another play date with!

It sounds like his mother doesn't have a clue how to discipline her child, and he's had free rein from her failure to set and hold boundaries.

Child misbehaves, is rude? Child gets one warning, then child goes home if it happens again. No promises, no more warnings. Just follow through.

Child takes something that doesn't belong to him? Mum retrieves the item immediately then takes child home.

Child hurts someone on purpose? Child goes home. Immediately.

Every single time.

She has to regain control. He sounds like a hideous brat. I can't even imagine one of my children calling an adult rude names.

Bloody hell. What a nasty text. Her child does sound like hard work but sending her that text was an awful thing to do.

So the reason I sent the text is that I've noticed the mum tends to offload the child a bit. For example last time we were together before yesterday, she left the child with us to go to back to the picnic, while we were having a walk and the child was a nightmare. I just wanted to make sure she is not planning to offload the child to me and son when on holiday, so by not letting kids playing unsupervised I meant her not supervising her child.

Btw I don't think there is anything going on with the child ( other than being a spoiled brat). We once were at a picnic together, my son asked for an ice cream and child started throwing a tantrum because he wanted one too but his mum was socialising and ignoring him. So I told him he could come with us if he was going to be good. Perfect manners all the way to the ice cream truck and back. He even asked me to tell his mum how good he was. After 10 minutes he was locking his arm around my sons neck...

Btw yesterday I asked him to behave continuously, talking at his level, and hoping his mum would have helped a bit more. The second he started to throw gravel and didn't stop when I asked him to, is where I announced we were leaving. Son and I headed to the toilets and by the time we came back, child was riding sons scooter ( he has his own btw ) and when I asked him to give it back he ran away.

My son is 4 and been diagnosed with ASD and he calls everyone stinky poo! He stands at the gate in the garden shouting stinky poo and people walk past and I’m forever apologising. It’s difficult as my 3 year old picks it up and just says it too.. I don’t do play dates anymore because my 2 boys are enough for me and can’t deal with judgements.. they are lovely boys but yes bit wild. They do wrestle each other 🙄 and I’m forever being referee. My sons do play with other kids but no play dates for me as honestly couldn’t handle the tuts and judgements. It’s not a 4 year old fault. I understand it must be stress for you but to be honest I feel more sorry for the mum of the boy.

But what you don't get is that sending the text was totally out of order and just plain nasty. It was totally unnecessary.

She left her child with you to go back to the picnic? What does this mean?!

And why did you allow it?

Can you explain the holiday a bit more? Is it lots of people staying in the same hotel/ caravan park/ campsite and just planning on doing things together or are you all in a villa/ house etc? I assume it's the former as the latter will probably be against Covid guidelines and mean that if one of you gets a temp or cough you're all stuck inside until they get a test result.

If in individual accommodation just make sure you take your child away if the 4 year old is being a pain- and supervise your child so they don't go out of sight. Your child shouldn't go missing if you're paying attention.

I'm slightly amazed (and somewhat saddened) by the number of people critising the other mother. The OP said she was pulling her child up on the behaviour, it's not as though she was just letting it all go while smiling on in a benign fashion.

With some children it really isn't as simple as "needs better discipline". My delightful little bundle of energy does not respond to discipline. They would rather accept a punishment than do what they are told. Neither do they respond to reward. And yes, we continue to try to implement both in a consistant way.

In my case, I have other children, so I effectively have evidence it's not just me- the others are generally fine on the behaviour front, albeit sometimes the "handful" gets everyone wound up and they look like a totally unruly mob as a group. Taken out individually and the others are delightful and very well behaved.

It's kind of sad to have confirmation from this that so many parents see my exuberant puppy of a child as being a horrendous brat, and see me as being a poor parent. Some children are just difficult, possibly on the cusp of whether an SEN diagnosis is needed or appropriate, possibly just not yet diagnosed. Especially as young as 4, they are still at the "might grow out of it" stage as far as professional help is concerned, and very little sensible help or advice is available, beyond confirming that your child is indeed bloody hard work. ("Have you tried a sticker chart?" Yes I've tried a fucking sticker chart. And if one more professional suggests a sticker chart I know where I'll be telling them to stick it...)

It's not always the parent's fault though- they are probably anxious and utterly exhausted/worn down with the effort of trying to keep their child safe and confirming to basic social expectations, never mind the niceties.

You didn’t need to send a text. It makes you sound like a judgemental twat and was not needed.

I’d have excused myself and my child at the gravel throwing stage.
I certainly wouldn’t be going on holiday with them, especially at this time.

Is this holiday within covid guidelines? Is it wise? In what ways, OP?

Do you think you were as kind and as understanding as you could be, OP?

@justchecking80 after your last message it is very clear that your text was necessary to draw a boundary for you. YANBU at all and it sounds increasingly like the child is spoiled and indulged. It doesn’t matter if he might have SEN or not. His parents are giving him shit boundaries/discipline or none at all. I’d reinforce with your husband that the two children are never to be left alone on the holiday.

A friend of mine has a grown-up daughter who used to display some challenging behaviours when very young - behaviours which are very commonly associated with ASD. Another friend, whose son had been pushed, said to her very nicely, " I think our friendship will be better if, for the time being, our children don't play together." It was kindly meant, and my friend appreciated the sensitive tone and manner she had used. My own son needed a great deal of watching when 4, 5 or 6, and he has ASD, and I completely understood when other parents might find play dates difficult, but I was always on the ball and prevented incidents. It was easier for me to do this, since my son's ASD was very evident and he needed support to engage in play with another child, so there was no question of him leaving my sight.. We don't know if the child you describe has SEN, but it does sound as though he might do. In time, the lady will probably bring a nanny on holiday with them to support and assist play, but until then, all the families will need to be extra watchful around outdoor play. Going out of sight and occasioning awkwardness is difficult enough in the local area, but I would imagine, a complete nightmare on holiday. I hope all goes well if you all go away and that old siblings might be able to help out.