Pornhub profit from trafficking of women and girls.

[SmileEachDay]

I’m increasingly frustrated with attitudes to porn on MN - there seem to be 2 main ways people justify it:

1. The liberal feminism defence: “It’s empowering, women are allowed bodily autonomy.

2. I enjoy it, it’s all consensual.

This is obviously bullshit. If you watch porn on a mainstream platform it is very likely that the woman you are watching has been directly trafficked and is being raped. If she hasn’t been, the woman or girl in the next clip may have been. You’re getting your rocks off to the filmed abuse of women and girls.

And that’s before we even start looking at how the commodification of women affects us more generally.

Please read this - it’s really eye opening

you do not know if the woman you are watching is:
Consenting
Not consenting
Trafficked
Being coerced
Off head on drugs
Actually a girl
Being raped
Being abused

Often it is quite possible to know these things.
Take Milena Velba for example, very popular with men and women. Runs her own website, social media etc. Produces her own content.

@BBCONEANDTWO

Is pornhub actually legal? I thought porn online porn was illegal - don't they get people's computers if they are charged and that's how they find out if they have been watching porn?

What?!?

Take Milena Velba for example

Ok. I googled the name. First hit? Pornhub. I’ve attached the photo. See the issue?

I agree with what @DifficultPifcultLemonDifficult has said.

Everybody agrees with the message your trying to get across but the way your saying it is getting people’s backs up as it comes across that your implying anyone who watches porn is in support of abuse - which is obviously not true.

People who don’t like porn for other reasons don’t need convincing/changing their minds but those that do watch it should be your target audience and given information so they are aware and not feel like they are being attacked.

If you were trying to stop circuses using animals, you wouldn’t accuse everyone of going to the circus of animal abuse. You would make it clear you don’t want to stop the circus but just the use of animals as it is abusive. This way people won’t just assume you hate circuses because you’re boring but that you care more about the animals and want other people to help you change it. - I get that this is easier said than done with such a sensitive topic.

Everybody agrees with the message your trying to get across

No, everyone doesn’t.

but the way your saying it is getting people’s backs up

Ok. I’m not sure how you’d prefer me to say “on sites such as Pornhub there is no way of knowing if the woman you are getting your rocks off to is:
Consenting
Not consenting
Trafficked
Being coerced
Off head on drugs
Actually a girl
Being raped
Being abused“

Which is about 75% of what I’ve said.

Ok. I googled the name. First hit? Pornhub. I’ve attached the photo. See the issue?
The issue there is not that Milena Velba is being coerced/raped/abused/trafficked, as you insist all (female) adult performers should be assumed to be.

The issue there is not that Milena Velba is being coerced/raped/abused/trafficked, as you insist all (female) adult performers should be assumed to be.

But this isn't what OP is saying.

OP is saying (and I agree) that while some women act in porn of their own free will, others are coerced and raped on screen - and (the crucial point) that the viewer cannot tell, at the point of consumption, which kind of scenario they are watching.

So - what's your level of acceptable risk for getting your jollies? 50-50 raped to freely participating presumably a no-no. 1 in 100 acceptable? Somewhere in between?

Let's talk numbers here. What percentage of rapes is your orgasm worth?

Can you really not identify the photo?

*the issue with the photo 🙄

@DifficultPifcultLemonDifficult

Honestly op, where I do think you have a point, you are making it really badly.

You care about trafficking- great, but the way you are talking is that you only care about the trafficking that won't have a detrimental effect on your life.

You've answered every point with - "that's whataboutery, you clearly agree with watching women getting raped".

You aren't going to gain any support or provoke an interesting debate or change anyones mind with the way you're going about this thread.

It's an emotive subject, of course, but there are ways to alert people to what goes on in the industry that doesn't brand them in the way you have done.

You're probably doing more harm than good here.

I absolutely 100% agree with you. The op is coming across very badly.

Everybody agrees with the message your trying to get across

No, everyone doesn’t

OP not one person on here has said they agree with girls being trafficked and raped.

But you are implying that they have simply because they have said they watch porn.

OP not one person on here has said they agree with girls being trafficked and raped

But many don’t give enough of a shit about it to stop consuming porn.

YANBU OP.

People can defend porn all they like. Your OP is very specifically talking about particular companies who exploit disgusting porn for their own profit.

It’s all about making money at whatever cost. Even if that means children and women are raped.

Who wants to be associated with that?

But many don’t give enough of a shit about it to stop consuming porn

You will never stop people watching porn ever. It is male dominated and brings in too much money. So having that attitude is not helping the cause at all.

OP I think your anger needs to be directed at the websites and making sure they are regulated.
There are verified pornstars on pornhub and many pornstars are not abused/ trafficked. I'm sorry that you can't see that. You may be against porn and that is fine of course, but it doesn't mean to say that all women involved are being abused.
I don't tend to watch it myself, I have done years ago when I was at uni but haven't for years.
We need to work to toughen the guidelines and put a stop to trafficking/ abuse etc...

YANBU.

Ethical porn may be possible, blah-di-blah, but you can't tell on pornhub. It is factual record that videos of raped women are on pornhub and have remained there in spite of the victims' testimony that it was rape.

I notice car washes being brought up and that's a wonderful analogy. If I see hand car washing being offered for £2.50, I have enough information right there to be suspicious. It is difficult to avoid supporting exploitation and trafficking in multiple areas, but if you are paying nothing or barely nothing, then you know the workers can't be getting fair wages at the other end. Or perhaps any wages.

Frankly, it is inevitable that a site where you watch pornographical content for free (because the producer makes their money through ad revenue) will host videos of rape. As I said before, it is difficult to avoid supporting exploitation and trafficking in multiple areas, but if you are paying nothing or barely nothing, then you know people can't be getting fair wages at the other end.

@PotholeParadise very true.

Do you feel the same way then about youtubers? (And I don't mean you tubers children, as I also disagree with them being plastered on the internet)
But youtube viewers watch videos for free, and make their money from ads.

@PotholeParadise genuine question - if you don’t use those car washes how will they get any money for food etc?

I remember not long ago people stopped shopping at primark because the workers were on low wages but then the charity said to keep using them as this is their only income - so I wonder what you should do if you ever see a cheap car wash. Do you think use them and then report it? Or just not use them and only report it?

I want to see porn made for women (not erotic bs) where I see sex from woman's point of view, men penis, balls and orgasmic face and moans. Mainstream porn is so retrograde.

OP I really can't understand why you've posted on this particular thread.

Surely AIBU implies that the poster seeks a debate, not a soapbox?

Actually, looking at how tiny the income stream in ad revenue could be for a youtube video, and comparing those figures to what the overheads would be for an ethically filmed porn film (proper wages for at least two actors, camera equipment, etc) is exactly what started me down that path of reasoning.

Profit? What profit? This naturally means that those who can make a living easiest are those who aren't paying the "performers" anything because the people on screen were raped.

Can the posters using whataboutery please give their views on the exploited, trafficked and raped women and children?

Car washes? Don't use and report to the authorities. I had one near me. I didn't report it because it was near our police station and I guessed they knew about it. I was totally unsurprised when the press ran an article about the business being raided and the owner being up in courts for infringements of the modern slavery act and having workers who weren't legally entitled to work in the UK.

While there are men on the planet, there will always be porn and exploitation of women unfortunately.

And no she's not a 'prude' and neither is anyone else who doesn't like sex
So you’ve decided I don’t like sex. Ok.

Sorry - that was a (hopefully) obvious mistake where I wrote 'sex' instead of 'porn'.

Honestly OP, I wish you luck if you are trying to get sites like Pornhub to take more responsibility with what they put up on their site and much harsher punishments in cases like the one that a previous poster linked to. However I also know that making sites responsible for everything they show or for what people post, whether that be Pornhub, Youtube or even Mumsnet, would be extremely worrying for the internet and for our freedoms in general, so I'm afraid I don't have an easy answer to policing the internet either.

I do hope though that you can see past your obvious dislike of all pornography and realise that not all of it is violent or non-consensual, and that many people do enjoy it but would also like to see an end to the abuse and coercion that obviously does go on in too many cases. I think you'll be much more likely to be successful with us on your side.