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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Neighbour in our garden, WWYD?

256 replies

Biscoffscoff · 30/07/2020 19:20

First of all, apologies now for lack of diagram, I have no idea how to upload one! And sorry it's a long one, it's hard to explain...

We live in an area of old miners cottages. It's common in our town for shared gardens, or gardens with rights of way across them (which these days are used for putting wheelie bins out). We bought our house two years ago. Having a private garden was a big plus for this house we chose, or so we thought!

We are in a row of 8 or so terrace houses. Ours, and the houses to the right of us, have longer gardens and parking access at the back to garages that are at the bottom of the gardens. This is via a small lane. The lane originally led to a park. One of our neighbors told us that there was a lot of anti social behaviour with the park/lane opening onto the gardens. So at some point the park land was fenced off and it was agreed the lane could be gated, so those of us that have garages have a key. All our neighbours have lived here since before the land was fenced.

The neighbour on the left of us doesn't have a garage, and his garden is shorter than ours, he backs onto the park. He used to be able to access his back garden from the end of the lane/start of the park. There is a gate in his garden because of this. When it was fenced, the access from the lane ends at the end of our garden. The neighbours gate opens into our garden.

The previous owner of our house was an elderly woman who didnt mind the neighbour cutting across her garden when the fencing went up. Her son was quite savvy and keen for this not to become a right, so he got a solicitor to draw up a licence agreement which ensured it was goodwill only.

When we bought the house this was explained to us by the EA and owners son. The son told us he'd explained to the neighbour the access ended with the sale, and he'd have to approach us if he wanted it renewed. He never did, we never met him, we thought that was that. Not long after we moved in, the other neighbours approached us about putting money in to replace the gate to the lane also, and that gate is locked. We assumed that there was no access for the neighbour.

In lockdown we've been working from home, and in the first few weeks noticed from the window a couple of times someone walking through our garden. We spoke to the neighbour who had arranged the replacement gate and they told us yes, they'd given a key to the neighbour next to us as he's always had access and presumed he needed a key. They were very apologetic as they thought we knew he had access.

In normal circs we would have knocked on to speak to him but as we don't know him at all and this was at the point of lockdown where everyone was very jittery, didn't think it was a good idea to go round.

The old lady didn't use the garden much and we've been using it a lot in lockdown. We hadn't seen him in the garden for a while and thought he must have stopped using it, now that it's very obviously in use (garden furniture out etc)

Today I came in through the garden and found the neighbour in the garden. Not only in the garden, but cutting the hedge - OUR hedge - that runs from the gate across the back of our garden! Presumably he's doing this to keep his access clear!

I would love to be one of those people who blurt things out but I'm not. I was walking through with my heavy shopping and he gave me a cheery wave as though this was entirely normal.
I stopped and stuttered something about how I had been planning to wait until the autumn because of nesting birds. He told me he'd checked them and it was no trouble because he's retired. I walked in the house and unfortunately it was only then that my brain caught up with a WTF!

So not only does he clearly think this is the norm for him to be in our garden, he thinks he's doing me a favour by doing my gardening!

It's really frustrating that because we're out at work so much we had no idea that he was using this access for the first eighteen months we've lived here, and clearly he and the other neighbours (they are friends) think this is entirely normal.

I want to reclaim my garden back but with it being so long and with me making small talk with him I've no idea how to go about this.
Im also aware that if it hadnt been for lockdown we wouldn't have known he was doing this so part of me feels like I'm being a bit petty to say no now, when it's been happening without bothering us before, and will likely be the same again when I'm back in work in September.
But equally I don't want to give up having a private garden due to British politeness.

WWYD?

OP posts:
Grumpymum789 · 30/07/2020 19:24

I think you have to speak to him, approach him nicely and have a copy of the agreement the previous owners son had drawn up, in case he gets awkward.

Aquamarine1029 · 30/07/2020 19:24

I would be telling him that he may no longer access your garden and he has been doing so without your permission. No further explanation necessary.

BettaSplenden · 30/07/2020 19:25

Tell him to jog on and if needed a solicitors letter.

titchy · 30/07/2020 19:26

Just be polite and tell him! 'Hi I meant to talk to you the other day but was rushing out/has gas on/baby been sick, but the previous owners told us they'd explained to you that the licence to walk through our garden ended when they sold. I'm really sorry if they didn't tell you but that's the situation now, the licence has ended. Perhaps you could drop they key back to June when you have a chance.' And smile. A lot.

heartsonacake · 30/07/2020 19:28

You just need to politely speak to him and say he’s perfectly aware the access ended when the sale went through so he has no right to trespass into your garden.

Change the lock on the gate so his key is no longer applicable.

FelicityPike · 30/07/2020 19:29

You definitely need to tell him to stop it.

fodderbeet · 30/07/2020 19:31

How does he access his garden if he doesn't go through yours? Has the gate been put in the wrong place and is it preventing him from accessing his garden?

puguin86 · 30/07/2020 19:33

Change the lock ASAP

CF he knows the right of access has ended he is relying on you not saying anything

Nip it in the bud straight away

AHF1975 · 30/07/2020 19:35

Our old house was like this. Is he really doing much harm? I assume that since you haven't noticed for 18 months, the answer is probably no. I'd be inclined to let it go for the sake of neighbourly harmony, especially as he is friends with all the other neighbours. Maybe a compromise might be to ask him to avoid coming in when you are clearly using the garden. I'm in the north though, we tend to try and be friendly up here...Wink

Apolloanddaphne · 30/07/2020 19:35

What is he accessing by going through your garden?

bodgeitandscarper · 30/07/2020 19:37

As others have said you need to tell him that his access ended with the sale, then a solicitors letter if necessary. Id also plant hedging in front of the gate after changing the lock, or replace it with fencing. It may mean you fall out over it, but at least you'll have your privacy.

WiddlinDiddlin · 30/07/2020 19:39

Im struggling to imagine this without diagram...

Draw it, take a pic with your phone and use the paperclip icon below the text input window to attach.. or on your computer, upload the file using the 'browse' button below. Tis easy.

As for neighbour... you need to tell him, either he wasn't told, or, he was and has chosen to pretend he wasn't.

labyrinthloafer · 30/07/2020 19:40

Just pay for a new lock, don't give him a key, and drop a note explaining the access was an agreement with previous owner.

I think you just have to get it over with.

We had similar when we had to fence something off, it was awkward, but afterwards it was done.

If you don't tackle it you are saying you accept him doing it, and that can cause issues.

steppemum · 30/07/2020 19:42

OK, so he is accessing your garden through a gate in the fence between your garden and his?

Put a padlock on it on your side.
if he complains because it is 'his gate' then put a fence panel across on your side so he can't open the gate.

When he queries it, be bright and breezy and say "Oh the lady who sold us the house was very clear that the agreement was not permanent, we prefer our garden to be private.
thanks for doing the hedge, don't worry we can do it from now on!"

Mamette · 30/07/2020 19:42

But if he was told the licence had ended, then what is he doing?

Can’t you draw a diagram and take a photo of it and upload the photo?

madcatladyforever · 30/07/2020 19:45

I would tell him to get the fuck out of my garden before I call the police. he knows the situation, he is massively taking the piss.
I've just told a like neighbour that if he parks in my marked car parking space again without my permission I'll be getting his car towed away.
I don't have any time for this nonsense.

NoWordForFluffy · 30/07/2020 19:48

Your solicitor should've been the one who dealt with the paperwork to check it all out to make sure it definitely terminated with the sale / purchase transaction.

Have you checked your title document to see what it says about rights of access across the garden?

category12 · 30/07/2020 19:50

If you continue to let him, you might find he'll end up with a genuine right to do so. Change the lock or chain & padlock it, drop him a note politely saying he no longer has access and he shouldn't be cutting back anything on your property.

LakieLady · 30/07/2020 19:55

What @titchy said. Friendly and diplomatic, but very clear.

Perfect.

2bazookas · 30/07/2020 19:56

Send him a formal typed signed dated letter , recap the message he was told by the son of the old ladt and say that he is no longer to enter your garden for any reason.

With luck that might solve the problem. If you see him in the garden again, you have grounds for a conversation at his front door, socially distanced.

Biscoffscoff · 30/07/2020 19:57

To the PP who asked, his garden starts as usual at the back of his house - what he's doing is going to the bottom of his garden, then cutting through ours to get to the lane. It's a quicker route to the shops. I think he might also park his car that way (beyond the gate) as there's some bays up there, and parking on the street is tight.

I'm a bit worried about falling out with him as it is a friendly street and he and all the other neighbours have lived here 30+ years, we're the only newcomers. Similarly, changing the key to the gate on the lane isn't an option as its shared with the other neighbours who see this as entirely normal. There is no way of locking the gate that comes into our garden from his.

I would have been fine nipping things in the bud if this had come to light when we first moved in. As far as I know he's a nice guy and I do think he's believed us to be in agreement for the last 18 months. I'm starting to wonder whether the previous owner's son did actually go round to say about the access ending, or if he did whether it was taken seriously - owners son didnt have a great reputation and was known to be quite petty. So it's the issue of how to end it this far in, without sounding petty.

I think I'm going to have to just say to him that we're using the garden more and would like our privacy, and that there's no right of way so we are ending the access. Either that or suggest that DH start naked sunbathing!

OP posts:
heartsonacake · 30/07/2020 19:58

I think I'm going to have to just say to him that we're using the garden more and would like our privacy, and that there's no right of way so we are ending the access.

Don’t say you are ending the access, because that implies it hasn’t already ended and he’s had permission until now. He hasn’t - he’s aware the access ended when the house was sold two years ago.

Biscoffscoff · 30/07/2020 20:00

Re a formal letter, I don't even know his name!

There definitely isn't access though. We got a copy of the old licence that he had signed, and solicitors confirmed no right of way. Our other neighbour has a tiny bit of access as we share a ginnel from the street side and that's very clearly marked

OP posts:
Tistheseason17 · 30/07/2020 20:00

You need to do/say something or he'll be creating a new easement before you know it!

category12 · 30/07/2020 20:00

You do need to do something about it, because if he gains the right to use it, you'll be stuck with it forever. He might be a nice old geezer, but if he leaves/dies, who will move in?