My parents and their views on gay/bi relationships - potential trigger warning - I don't know how to act around them now.

[stillsatonthefence]

NC as it has nothing to do with my usual threads.
I don't know if it matters but - I'm straight and this isn't about me personally.

For some reason the subject of being gay/straight/bi has been brought up when I visited my parents recently.I do not feel any different towards people based on their sexual preferences just as I do not feel any different towards anyone based on their skin colour or nationality and I think it's all a ridiculous prejudice to have.

My DM and DF are only early 50s and consider themselves fairly "young" in their mindset but have such a horrible opinion on it and I don't know how to feel about them after it became obvious a couple of weeks ago.
Things my DF said:

• same sex couples should not be allowed to marry or adopt children. I asked him what difference does it make to him and he said it offends him and marriage is for man and woman.
• He said he's ok with the fact some people are in same sex relationships but he doesn't want to see it or witness any PDA.
• children of same sex couples become gay themselves - when I asked even if it's true what's wrong about that he couldn't justify it
• he doesn't like the mannerisms of gay men and the way they behave
• tried implying gay men want to adopt "little boys" for "a reason" - I shot the conversation down there as I was completely incredulous and angry and pointed out he's clearly mistaken and talking about paedophiles not same sex couples.

Interestingly most of his statements were talking about gay men not lesbians.

My DM stayed rather silent in all this then afterwards when it was just me and her she said she doesn't mind what they choose to do but finds the thought of two men together intimately rather repulsive and icky - I was quite wound up by that point and told her that I'm sure they find the thought of a man and woman together "repulsive" too. She also said if she was adopted she wouldn't have wanted to be brought up by two men or two women - I literally had no words, just said that I don't think any child that gets adopted and welcomed into a loving, stable home and family would give two hoots if the adoptive parents gay, straight or two horned aliens with flames shooting out of their backsides.

The thing is I left completely dumbfounded at the ignorance and prejudice. I keep flashing back to the things my DF said and my mind just goes into a spin at the stupid statements.
I haven't seen them since but have had brief conversations over the phone but for some reason I feel weird about seeing them again (due this weekend) after the conversation we had.

In my head all I can think of is if either of my (currently very young) DCs ever come out as gay/bi or whatever they will be ostracised and treated differently by my parents going on their current opinions and I just want to run for the hills.

How do I proceed with this knowledge? Do I just studiously avoid any attempts at the subject next time I see them? Pretend the conversation didn't happen? Set them straight and tell them off?

AIBU to have such strong feelings about this?

@MaggieAndHopey not until they're 18, and not at all if it is sperm donation from a country where there is still anonymity (denmark v popular for this).

As for the latter half if your post, I dont know what to say really. Shocking disregard for the baby's human rights.

@Wolfgirrl not exactly. When the child is 18 they have the right to contact the sperm or egg donor, which seems right to me. Ideally they would know a long time before that and there are lots of resources available to support parents in how to discuss this with their children from an early age, as there are for adoptive parents.

@MaggieAndHopey

I'm sure there is. But that doesnt make it a good thing in my opinion. It just goes some way to remedying the damage.

I'm interested in your use of the word 'damage'. Do you mean the damage caused to a child by the knowledge that they were born as a result of egg or sperm donation?

If that's the case it sounds like your concerns about assisted conception go beyond a child's right to know about their biological heritage.

This thread seems to be taken over by a few posters arguing...

Thank you to everyone that replied about my situation.
I think I will just not talk about it unless I have to - so if it ever comes to a situation where it will actually impact on my or my DCs lives.

My DF actually said that not long ago it was illegal - I pointed out that not long ago it was also illegal for black people go mix with white people. He had this incredulous look on his face and kind of shook his head like I didn't get it.

But PPs are right, it's a male thing for him - I've heard him and his "mates" discuss lesbians and once one person in the group showed a video/pics he had on his phone after a few drinks and comments about it being hot but of course that's only about "hot" and conventionally attractive lesbians the other ones are butch and bloke like.

The more I write and think about it the angrier I get.
I just remember another comment my DM made and I feel like banging my head against the wall..

I think most of our views reflect how we are brought up. We are all indoctrinated from an early age to think and behave in a particular way (e.g. saying please and thank you). We don't think about it - we just do this because we are told to by our parents. Views on homosexuality will change overvtime as we indoctrinate the next generation and add sex and relationships education at ever earlier ages.

My parents never discussed homosexuality with me (didn't say much about sexuality at all actually) but I'm pretty sure they would love me no matter what my sexual preferences are. Probably would have needed some time to come to terms with it. I don't think we should blame people brought up in earlier times.

I think it is still the norm for opposite sex couples so can understand the disappointment of parents who think they will one day have (bioligical) grandchildren and they gave that dream taken away when they know their child is gay or lesbian.

I have worked for a gay boss and with gay and lesbian colleagues and don't think anything of it. I also have a gay cousin who is very happy with his partner of some years. I have no problem with their sexuality.

I do, however, hate camp behaviour. I find it truly revolting whether it is displayed by gay or straight people. I think some people can confuse this for homophobia as often people consider it is only gay people who are camp.

I am also revolted by people in drag. Maybe that is the campness too or maybe it is a similar thing to my revulsion at clowns, Punch and Judy and Halloween masks.

Children born through egg or sperm donation do have the right to know about their biological parentage though - there's been a change in the law to ensure that.
Presumably only if it is by official donors rather than, ahem, informally.

Thirdly you keep wheeling out the H word yet are never, ever able to say what I have said that a) disapproves of same sex couples or b) implies they are inferior parents

This is just such crap. People are saying what the issue is, but you're doing the la la la thing.
It's the exact same mindset as the trans threads. Except homophobia gets called out more instead of encouraged/back slapped.
"Show me what I said! I'm all ears!" People do - "you can't answer, what did I say was wrong? Nope, try again!"
It's just such bigotry bollocks.

@LemonadeAndDaisyChains

So what is the issue? Stop alluding to it and actually say.

*@Komacho yes. My feelings on the matter have nothing to do with the sexuality of the parent. Many parents have children in 'straight' relationships before coming out etc. No issue, kids know both parents. Well if one of them hasn't buggered off or something! *

Then what does it have to do with this thread?

I have never understood why people go out of their way to have such extreme views about something that doesn’t concern them, why on earth have such horrible opinions about gay people when you could just leave them the f alone.
The fact that your Dad is bothered about men than women says more about his own sexuality than the sexuality of LGBT people.

OP, sorry for getting dragged in to the other conversation! I will drop it now as clearly the individual involved doesn’t want to actually engage in the points being raised.

For what it’s worth, in my experience you won’t change your parents’ view overnight. It’s impossible to do so. But you may chip away at it over time by providing them with facts and information that can help them and give them the space to digest. You will know better than us whether they are the sort of people who are open to reviewing their position. But i suspect turning it into a fight will just entrench them in their views - that’s the problem with so much of the debate nowadays: it’s angry and emotional and people don’t allow themselves or others the space to change. But I know it’s not easy to accept people with views so different to your own, so I wish you good luck.

I don't think we should blame people brought up in earlier times.

I quite agree it's rather pointless to hope for, say, eighteenth-century slave traders to recognise the full humanity of their African 'cargo', but the OP's parents are in their early 50s, they haven't teleported in from the Dark Ages.

‘I don't think we should blame people brought up in earlier times.‘

Experiences aren’t carved in stone, I was brought up in the 70s and 80s when casual racism and homophobia were rife but i’m neither. Nor are most of my contemporaries as far as I know.
Ops parents aren’t much older than me.

My mum is in her sixties and has always been fine with me being bi. She knew LGB people at uni, which helped, and I think when we lived in Brighton she had a few LGB friends. My dad would have been as well if he was still around. My brother was a bit weird about it, but he's OK now. Likewise, one of my cousins came out as gay a few years ago and his family were totally cool with it. I'm very lucky and grateful. I've heard horror stories from LGBT friends, people being disowned and all sorts.

Somehow I knew this thread would get taken over by this. Suggesting in a parenting site that donor conceived children shouldn’t exist is pretty shitty. And not at all surprised to see who’s posting either.

OP sorry your thread has been derailed, and I’m sorry for the situation you’re in.

@ItWasNotOK Throwing insults is not exclusive to the left. I could quite happily give you a list of all the things I've been called and accused of by right-wingers. The best one was a Tommy Robinson supporter saying I was pro-rape and pro-paedophilia, all because I disagree with TR.

@PhilSwagielka I don't think that's what I said, is it?

[quote ItWasNotOK]@Wolfgirrl I disagree with you but I don't think you're a troll.

I think it's really sad that many on the left these days are unable to sustain a discussion without dismissing different opinions by resorting to insults.[/quote]
There you go. And sorry, but it's a little bit hard for me to be civil when people think I'm going to molest or rape kids because I happen to be attracted to women as well as men. Same with people who think that because I'm Jewish, I'm somehow responsible for the deaths of Palestinians. Yes, I know I should suck it up and stop being a snowflake or whatever but it does hurt.

@PhilSwagielka I'm not seeing where I said the left either fling insults or exclusively fling insults.

I feel you on the prejudice. Me too.

It’s very clear from this and other threads that one of the favourite hobbies of bigots is tone policing. We get discriminated against daily, we’ve had to fight to have equal rights, people look down on us, tell us our choices are morally wrong, suggest we are selfish, sexual deviants, child abusers, bad parents and god knows what else. But we have to be polite when other people start to debate our basic humanity.

@ PhilSwagielka don’t apologise. You’re not the one in the wrong

@Coldilox the exact problem is that you think you are "right". You assume that because I refuse to condemn someone, I am a bigot. Because I would rather have a discussion in good faith than shove people into boxes of right and wrong.

It shouldn't matter, but I am from a racial minority. I have a mixed race child. I am not heterosexual. So I know all about prejudice. I just choose not to engage on the level of being "right". Of course if someone is outwardly racist towards me, I am not going to be happy. But generally the people who have caused me the most hurt are the supposedly woke, so I am always wary of anyone who starts talking in those terms.

ItWasNotOK I wasn’t actually referring to you.

But yes, with things like racism, homophobia, anti-senitism, disabling and any other form of oppression, it’s not enough to just not be any of those things. I am happy to debate most topics, but not human rights. Some things are absolute.

@Fishisjumpin I dont 'go out of my way' they are just my opinions. You could say that about any opinion on other people.

The reason why I dont leave it alone is because it doesnt just affect the parents, it is about the children. You are taking the decision to create a person who may never know one half of their biology, culture, heritage, extended family. These ethical debates must be had by society as it isnt just about somebody making a lifestyle choice that affects only themself. It alters the fabric of society and the human rights of the children involved.

@PhilSwagielka

How ridiculous. I never said any of that, that is your own projection