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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Insulted key worker wage rises don't include nurses

240 replies

nowayhose · 22/07/2020 15:55

Just what it says really, I'm insulted that police/ fire service/ paramedics are all getting a descent wage rise as recognition for their above and beyond efforts during Cornavirus pandemic, but nurses get bugger all as they're still in the process of getting the 3 year gradual wage increase.Angry (even after this 3 year incremental wage increase, nurses pay will be well below what the other emergency services get)

OP posts:
Myothercarisalsoshit · 24/07/2020 00:23

Now you're just being rude sister.
I'm sorry that I appear to have offended you. I understand teaching pay scales because I am one but looking at pay scales from a different industry can be a bit confusing.
I'm glad that you're happy with your lot but I still think that nurses should be paid more in line with other professions. And carers too. I also believe that student nurses should be paid to get their nursing degrees. To me that seems only fair. I'll bid you goodnight and thank you for everything that you do.

Shmurf · 24/07/2020 01:47

My partner's a truck driver. Hasn't mentioned anything about a pay rise.

Frodothedodo · 24/07/2020 07:05

I thought you were mocking that poster to be honest myother. They told you you were wrong about nurses average salary and gave you the official payscales and you still said so is i'lm wrong??? then asked for starting salary when they already posted it twice. I thought you were deliberatelg taking the piss.

Its funny you getting uppitty about rudeness when you spoke to a TA like shit.

Pepperwort · 24/07/2020 09:05

Myothercarisshit. Ok I said I would leave this and I will, but just one last time. I was not just ‘running a few phonics sessions’, although that can be fairly crucial. I was delivering interventions, and assessing, researching, planning and preparing resources at night. If you don’t think that’s anything to do with teachers jobs Id be interested in knowing what you think is. Gossiping on Facebook with other teacher friends about how shit it all is and how you all ought to be on £60k plus perhaps?

Top private sector salaries are not normal. £35k is good wages.

HariboLectar · 24/07/2020 09:17

@BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz

The police haven't had a pay rise in 8 years. They are getting around 3%.

Private sector workplaces five between 1.5 and 2.5 every year

Private sector "keyworker" here March - advised no pay rise this year June - advised of redundancy
Staplemaple · 24/07/2020 09:23

Sorry to hear that @HariboLectar Flowers.

I think a lot of people who have always worked in the public sector have a sense of entitlement, and feel they are always deserving of more, when you could argue that is the case for so many jobs; but pay isn't paid based on worthiness, and there isn't a huge pool of money in a public healthcare system to pay copious amounts. But a graduate job with guaranteed employment, the starting wage that nurses have and increments every year (until a certain point I know) with one of the best pension and sickness/maternity leave benefits there is, it's not that bad. I do think that parking should be free though, and the annual PIN membership should be paid by the NHS. There is a really skewed perception of what people elsewhere earn, and those on high wages in the private sector often have to work well over their hours in unsecure jobs with lesser pensions and other benefits.

yellowsunset · 24/07/2020 09:29

@RunningFromInsanity

I’ll be honest I know quite a few nurses and they are on a far greater wage than me. Band 5/6+ are not the poorly paid workers people think.
And what's your low wage got to do with anything? It's not their fault your employer doesn't value your work.
burninh · 24/07/2020 09:42

But a graduate job with guaranteed employment, the starting wage that nurses have and increments every year (until a certain point I know) with one of the best pension and sickness/maternity leave benefits there is, it's not that bad

Yes this should really be highlighted because it's not the norm in the private sector. My friends in the public sector all had much better maternity pay but crucially could change their hours eg to part time &/or flexi time to fit around elements of dc without impacting on their progression. I couldn't do my old job after dc.

MotherMorph · 24/07/2020 09:42

Private sector workplaces five between 1.5 and 2.5every year

I work in the private sector. Last year myself and colleagues got a 4-5% payrise. It was our first payrise in 10 years. This year some are being made redundant.

Staplemaple · 24/07/2020 10:54

Yeah I don't think people realise how good they have it to be honest @burninh. There are issues in nursing, but they won't be solved by a few extra quid a month in their pay.

updownroundandround · 24/07/2020 13:20

@ Sisterwives

''No-ones saying wages are low for everyone, just that nurses aren't badly paid comparatively and certainly not a 'poverty wage'. The average nurses salary is above the national average salary. ''

But that's not the average GRADUATE national salary is it ?

Nurses are very poorly paid compared to other graduate careers IMO.

updownroundandround · 24/07/2020 13:23

@ Sisterwives

''Most nurses I know get a band 6 job within a year or 2 of qualifying so then jump up to £31,365 and increments after that. If you never get a band 7 job (promotion) the max you will earn is top of band 6.''

I don't know where YOU work, but that's NOT how it works in my area, or in any of the other Trust areas I've done bank shifts in, I can assure you.
MOST of the senior (age) nurses I know are still Band 5 with over 25 years service !

OrlandoInTheWilderness · 24/07/2020 13:45

Not saying that nurses don't deserve good money - but if you look at what carers get who travel to their client's houses it's shocking and they don't get all the other benefits. *
*
You can't compare a carer to a nurse. I'm sorry, being a career is a bloody hard, worthwhile job but it isn't the same at all. Nurses are highly trained, educated to degree level and their work can be far more skilled. I do not wish to put carers down and they don't get paid enough for what they do but it is a separate issue.
I agree OP. I have a friend who is an intensive care nurse who feels very much like she has received a large slap in the face.

oo0Tinkerbell0oo · 24/07/2020 13:47

@lifeafter50

Most nurses are not on Covid wards and have had a lighter workload with the shocking abandonment of patients with other ailments.
You know this for a fact do you! What about illnesses due to Covid that were covered by staff from those areas that could no longer operate, eg clinics, and wards that were closed down for months. Covid wards weren't the only wards to have Covid patients, exclusively Covid yes, but to say most nurses are not on covid wards is nonsense.
Sisterwives · 24/07/2020 13:59

If you spend 25 years not progressing in your career at all, there's either something very wrong with where you work, something very wrong with the work you provide or you simply don't want to progress. Take your pick. Being a junior nurse for 25 years? No need for it. There is no trust in the UK where the only jobs ever available are band 5.

I've known people go up to band 6 within 18 mths of qualifying and the fastest track i've known was qualifying to band 8a in 5 years. Those are rare cases but it can be done.

I've known a few stuck at band 5 nurses yes. Some great nurses who didn't want the extra responsibility or whatever of progression. Or they were happy where they were or scared of applying and being rejected. Fine. Hard workers, deserve a lot more pay.

Others that treated me like shit as a student and then were pissy when I overtook them in a few years (one had even written in my student leaving card, good luck but don't think you can come back in a few years and tell me what to do lol). Usually work on the same ward for decades, complain all the time, are off sick a lot, late often, are mean to younger staff, claim to have not had a piss at work since the 90s but don't seem to do very much either.

Because that's another thing about the public sector, bar a serious fuck-up it's virtually impossible to get rid of someone and new managers just inherit the 'problem staff' and it's hard to effect change when there's a culture dating back years and 'oh they've always been like that, so it's easier to just leave them to it'. Plus they were often Union reps and used that to intimidate and get their own way.

The NHS has some of the most incredible staff i've ever met but also plenty of lazy, bullying piss takers that would simply not maintain employment in the private sector. They'd be out on their ear.

Staplemaple · 24/07/2020 14:00

I have a friend who is an intensive care nurse who feels very much like she has received a large slap in the face

Why? These are from the annual pay reviews which were announced and published before covid, and have been spun by the government. Hopefully her nursing ability is better than her ability to read up on accurate information rather than froth over what the media says.

Staplemaple · 24/07/2020 14:02

Still a band 5 after 25 years service, that must be through choice, or through sheer incompetence.

Ontheroadtorecovery · 24/07/2020 14:12

I don't begrudge anyone if those working in the professions a pay rise. But it does feel a kick in the teeth that this isn't for all public service keyworkers

Staplemaple · 24/07/2020 14:26

Payrises are always done at different times for different bundles of those in the public service.

Sisterwives · 24/07/2020 14:38

It's actually embarassing how many nurses don't realise these are long awaited pay reviews for other public sector workers, (just like the NHS one agreed 2 years ago) and seem to believe the government/media spin that its some kind of 'reward' due to CV.

Frodothedodo · 24/07/2020 14:52

@oo0Tinkerbell0oo Of course it's not nonsense, its fact most nurses weren't on CV wards. There are half a million nurses in the UK. Including MH nurses, LD nurses, child nurses as well as RGNs in the community and in numerous other areas of discipline.

The number of CV wards and patients hospitalised in the whole of the UK is absolutely tiny in comparison to the number of nurses in the rest of the NHS.

BBCONEANDTWO · 24/07/2020 17:21

@Sisterwives

If you spend 25 years not progressing in your career at all, there's either something very wrong with where you work, something very wrong with the work you provide or you simply don't want to progress. Take your pick. Being a junior nurse for 25 years? No need for it. There is no trust in the UK where the only jobs ever available are band 5.

I've known people go up to band 6 within 18 mths of qualifying and the fastest track i've known was qualifying to band 8a in 5 years. Those are rare cases but it can be done.

I've known a few stuck at band 5 nurses yes. Some great nurses who didn't want the extra responsibility or whatever of progression. Or they were happy where they were or scared of applying and being rejected. Fine. Hard workers, deserve a lot more pay.

Others that treated me like shit as a student and then were pissy when I overtook them in a few years (one had even written in my student leaving card, good luck but don't think you can come back in a few years and tell me what to do lol). Usually work on the same ward for decades, complain all the time, are off sick a lot, late often, are mean to younger staff, claim to have not had a piss at work since the 90s but don't seem to do very much either.

Because that's another thing about the public sector, bar a serious fuck-up it's virtually impossible to get rid of someone and new managers just inherit the 'problem staff' and it's hard to effect change when there's a culture dating back years and 'oh they've always been like that, so it's easier to just leave them to it'. Plus they were often Union reps and used that to intimidate and get their own way.

The NHS has some of the most incredible staff i've ever met but also plenty of lazy, bullying piss takers that would simply not maintain employment in the private sector. They'd be out on their ear.

OMG - this ^.

It's sickening the managers don't have a chance of getting rid of the crap. No wonder the NHS is in such a mess.

MarmiteCrumpet25 · 24/07/2020 18:09

I was bullied by a healthcare assistant when I was very sick - this was 20 years ago - so hopefully things have changed for the better.

Sisterwives · 24/07/2020 18:34

@MarmiteCrumpet25 I'm so sorry that happened. I had the same with 'established' (aka no other ward would want them so they were there for years with their horrible cliques) nurses and HCAs when I was younger. Sadly, they often bullied the motivation and enthisiasm out of new staff.

Bullying is still a massive problem in the NHS unfortunately but the last few years in my trust at least, they've had dedicated teams to report to so hopefully things are changing. They did a survey and there was a number of staff who reported actual assault from other staff which you would hope would be unbelievable but apparently not.

It's definitely taken more seriously now imo.

There are lots of complaints about NMC fees but they keep going up because of the number of disciplinaries that occur that the NMC have to investigate and quite a lot now do involve staff on staff complaints around unacceptable behaviour, bullying, harassment and assaults in the workplace.

When I started late 90s, it was standard there were a few 'rogue' male nurses or Drs who sexually harrassed and even assaulted new staff nurses or HCAs. Like I said earlier, sometimes it was just 'the culture' and you were advised by older colleagues to avoid being alone with them or just told 'yeah, he's a perv, tell him to fuck off and he'll leave you alone' . Not easy for a young, inexperienced new member of staff.

One got away with stuff for years in my trust. Moved to another trust where it wasn't the 'culture' and not only was he reported to the NMC and struck off, he was reported to the Police and believe it or not, got almost 3 years in PRISON.

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