Grown men who can't drive

[madcatladyforever]

AIBU or what! Just had a row with my DS who is not talking to me because he can't drive at 40 years old. There is no good reason why not, he's done all the lessons just can't be bothered to take the test.
His wife ferries him about everywhere despite the fact she's in very poor health and shouldn't even be on the road in my opinion.
He wanted me to collect him for the weekend a 7 hour round trip and I said no, I have slipped discs and I'm on tramadol, I can't drive for 7 hours.
I don't see why we should be unpaid chauffeurs all the time and I'm not doing it any more.
Not being able to drive completely limits their lives, they can't live in a rural area which they want to do, he can only take a job there is public transport too and he can't drive to any big store out of town and pick up furniture or tools or whatever.
It is driving me mad and I said to his wife, stop ferrying him about, he needs to get his license. What happens if you have to go into hospital - who is going to drive you there and back.
Now he is furious with me for "interfering" but if your mother can't say it who can.
I get the test is scary but if we never did anything because we were nervous we'd never achieve anything in our lives.

Our clients are CEOs of large international businesses, they wouldn’t dream of working with a client who drove themself to a meeting

In an argument with the crazy Australian managing to sound like the bigger dickhead is an impressive talent

. It is industry standard for clients to arrange and pay for transport, sometimes that means a private aeroplane.

I couldn't possibly go on your private jet Mister CEO. I'm an independent, skilled and resourceful professional! I'm driving myself there, see you in a week!"

@Chanjer

Our clients are CEOs of large international businesses, they wouldn’t dream of working with a client who drove themself to a meeting

In an argument with the crazy Australian managing to sound like the bigger dickhead is an impressive talent

Why does stating what happens in my industry make me look like a dickhead? Oddly enough I don’t set the industry rules, I just work there.

You have to go pick stuff up from vendors when at a desk job. You still have to go out to clients when you have a desk job. You still have off-site meetings when you have a desk job. No one wants a junior slave who can't go pick up friday arvo pizza and beer working their desk job.

What a dream job! Must have a licence to be the gofer/pizza errand boy for the "higher ups"!

I'm not doing X million pounds worth of whatever cos I heard he's a fucking driver

Pull the other one

Making clients pay for your train tickets and arranging car services to collect you? I'm shocked at the selfishness and laziness and entitlement.

My clients are major international companies, not individuals. Clients paying travel is absolutely the norm in my industry. Totally, totally industry standard. I don’t “make” them do it, I don’t even ask them - it’s something that all clients in my industry do as a matter of course. If I even suggested making my own travel arrangements they would be completely shocked and suspicious.

My partner’s main client pay for him to fly to LA business class about half a dozen times a year. They paid for us to fly to NY for 48 hours just to attend one single party because they thought his presence would be crucial for networking. So I don’t think they begrudge me the occasional return to Birmingham Moor Street on Chiltern Rail.

Sorry you’re an office slave...

I just think that a lot of non-drivers just don't get how they are making decisions based on their restrictions.

You think that as a non driver I am not aware that I factor not being able to drive in decisions where driving ability is relevant? Eh?

yeh agree with @Iwalkinmyclothing, it's ridiculous. I made the conscious decision to have some spare money (to save /to spend) rather than to have a car. I'm less restricted by not having a car than I would be by never having a red cent.

This non stop disparaging of non-drivers is bizarre.

"I just think that a lot of non-drivers just don't get how they are making decisions based on their restrictions."

The fuck does that even mean?

Good Grief.

1. having the responsibility of running your own car brings with it a whole wealth of benefits. For starters, you can dictate and manage the costs.

I can dictate to my local council that they can't levy a low emissions zone tax on me? I can tell an insurance that they have to charge me less than a standard new driver? I can tell a car dealership that the car I would need to have to avoid the low emissions tax/penalty needs to be what I say in price? I can decide whether to pay for the parking permit or not? I can decide whether to replace a tire or not on the basis of cost and not the law?

The only dictating being done is by the various authorities setting fees, taxes and legal requirements for car ownership.

Or I pay £3 a day for a bus to work and back that stops closer than the nearest parking spaces.

1. Convenience.

(fires up bus app, 27 buses coming in the next 27 minutes).

Suppose it might be nice to spend ten minutes in a car rather than 15 by bus, with a whole seven minutes until another one comes along. But not enough to pay out literally thousands for the privilege of that. And it might not take less time, as most of my journey is on bus lanes/no private vehicles allowed, so the traffic is concentrated onto one narrow road that is often bumper to bumper morning and evening.

But buying milk? Walk out of front door, turn left, turn right, cross over two roads of the junction and I'm at the shop. To do that in a car would mean Get car, start car, drive all the way back to the house because it's one way, only left turns allowed where I'd turn right on foot, down a quarter mile to the roundabout, join queue waiting to enter roundabout, enter next roundabout, wait for space when the main road from the left has priority and a neverending stream of vehicles, go round roundabout, exit roundabout, enter same roundabout I came in through, drive back the quarter mile to go past the end of the street, enter junction, no left turn, so drive along another quarter of a mile, join one way system (often gridlocked), turn off left, find parking space, park, work parking app, walk back to shop, buy milk, walk back to car, more one way streets, so go half mile to main junction, wait for left filter, join main road, drive down to the big roundabout, turn left, join the first roundabout for the third time, drive the same quarter mile again, add thirty yards for no entry sign by house, go around one way street, search for parking space, park up if lucky, if not, back out again and searching for another in the same residents' parking zone, probably go back to just before the second roundabout again, up the hill, find space, park, walk back home.

1. Confidence and skills to learn?

(looks at certificates and various things done in past) Nah, I'm good there.

1. Career. No, I don't want to drive a bus or deliver parcels, thank you very much. I like what I do already.

1. Social. If I go to a pub or restaurant, I sincerely hope none of my friends are driving. It's much nicer to come back by cab anyhow. And how social is it to be locked in your private little metal box?

1. Travel and shopping. Have they not heard of ordering online? And no, if I went to a wedding, I wouldn't be driving.

7.Adventure. What's exciting about 'picking up a purchase from afar'? I'll just click the delivery option, thanks.

1. Independence. Been living away from 'home' since I was 16, thanks. Perfectly capable of using public transport or booking a cab, too, even though I'm old and decrepit.

1. Freedom. Exactly where would I find the money to go on all these so called wonderful experiences after spending thousands on driving lessons, a car, insurance, tax, parking, petrol (no access to electric charging points here), repairs & maintenance?

10. You only live once. Yes, and I'm quite happy without increasing the risk of being involved in a fatal RTA. Public transport has a far better safety record than cars.

FWIW, I can't drive for medical reasons. DP has a license but can't drive for a) financial reasons and b) we don't need to.

Having a car would be entirely unrealistic. Me learning to drive if the DVLA changed their mind about whether it's safe for me to do so, when there's no way on earth we'd be able to afford for me to drive one would be a complete waste of several thousand pounds.

We don't ask for lifts, public transport is fine. And even with cabs, it's still cheaper than a car.

So, no, not all adults have to learn to drive.

Making clients pay for your train tickets and arranging car services to collect you? I'm shocked at the selfishness and laziness and entitlement

When I worked for Highways England many years ago when it was still the Highways Agency, we had to travel by train, they wouldn’t pay mileage over 20 miles. That meant a taxi both ends in most cases. There was nothing lazy, selfish or entitled about it.

@Chanjer

Anyone who can't drive needs to have a word with themselves tbh

My adult son, has had countless lessons but has failed five times. He's desperate to pass but keeps making mistakes. Should I stop giving him lifts just because he finds it tricky? I found it very tricky myself, when I was learning and nearly gave up after three years of trying. Please don't be so disparaging.

OP ... it's really difficult, I'm sure, but maybe your son just can't cope with driving . Maybe he needs to embrace public transport and stop relying on other people.

It's amazing how much everyone relies on cars. You do realise that it is perfectly possible to exist without driving everywhere, right?

Dh and I are in our 40s and have never learned to drive. We have always got by just fine.

We don't have the expense, and we don't have the carbon footprint.

Dh and I are in our 40s and have never learned to drive. We have always got by just fine.

And yet another who lives/works in a city with good public transport.

I think this is the unrealized reality. Non-drivers think they never put anyone out. But the reality is before you invite a non-driver anywhere you've already done the mental gymnastics on how they are going to get there.

I really don't get this.

Why do you need to perform these mental gymnastics? It's not you that needs to plan to get there without a car.
Why do people feel the need to do that for their adult friends just because they don't drive? Plan what you want to plan, invite who you want to invite and then if someone can't get there because they don't drive, they don't go? It's their responsibility, not yours and you're removing the option of someone even trying by doing all these 'mental gymnastics' before you've even asked anyone anything, to pick somewhere you think is suitable for them to get to. And if they can't make it, won't pay for a taxi or whatever, then that's them missing out.
Do you do these mental gymnastics when planning something with people who work shifts so may not be able to attend because they're on shift that day? Or need childcare and may not be able to get it that night? Or money's a bit tight so they might not be able to afford it? Do you try and think for them too?

And if these people are so trying then why even bother having them as friends and inviting them anywhere?

And as for defensive as mentioned earlier - yes, I'm defensive to attitudes like the one above. My lack of driving license doesn't inhibit my ability to think for myself, research how I could get somewhere if I'm invited, or turn down an invitation if I can't. I've turned down far more invitations because I'm at work that day or early next morning, or low on funds, than I have because it's somewhere I can't get to.
I manage perfectly well and I live on the edge of a national park and use it regularly. I make use of the public transport services we have, and use taxi's where that doesn't reach to.
I also have an outdoor hobby, get shopping and have held a full time job, several promotions and changes of site over the years. I chose to live somewhere with public transport links. I did all that without a driving license.
But according to people like you, you need to think for me?

Haven't rtft but yes, I agree that anyone (male or female) who chooses not to learn to drive then expects lifts everywhere is taking the p. Excepting medical reasons, etc - before anybody jumps on me.

But could only learn in an automatic

All hybrids and electric cars are automatics so once we do away with petrol/diesel engines everyone will be driving automatics (assuming we don't all have driverless cars by then).

It's amazing how much everyone relies on cars. You do realise that it is perfectly possible to exist without driving everywhere, right

Dh and I are in our 40s and have never learned to drive. We have always got by just fine

It's fine if you don't have kids. But I could not have taken my son to many a football match or athletics meet if I hadn't been able to drive.

And even without kids - as an example I visited my mum the weekend just gone. I'd have much rather taken the train. But because I'd not prebooked, GWR wouldn't tell me if I could get on the train or not (because of covid restrictions on numbers). Rather than take the chance, I drove. OK, if I hadn't had a car, I might have pre-booked, but the National Railways website only said you needed to book for Cross-Country, so I might not and then I wouldn't have had the choice.

And when my father was alive he lived in two places that didn't have railway stations.

I do think you need the ability to drive a car, even if you use public transport or a bike most of the time.

It's fine if you don't have kids everyone I know who didn’t learn to drive or own a car, panic learnt/ bought a car once pregnant. It’s amazing how quickly their strong “I don’t need a car in London” stance melted away.

It bugs me when grown adults are like this. It’s different if there’s a medical condition, but it’s the pathetic hopelessness of it. We know a couple like this, they are always asking for lifts. If you mentioned you were going somewhere they’d invite themselves along to visit town/place/shop. They’re oldest kids drive now, so they’re probably a taxi service to them.
I would never have married my dh if he didn’t drive.
Yanbu to not offer lifts, he’s a grown adult and needs to sort this himself.

@Kazzyhoward

Dh and I are in our 40s and have never learned to drive. We have always got by just fine.

And yet another who lives/works in a city with good public transport.

Or a walkable town/village with good public transport links elsewhere? But either way, yes, people who rely on walking and public transport usually choose to live in places where they can walk or get public transport. Surely this is obvious?

This always comes up on MN in driving threads and I never understand it. “Ah, but some of us live in places where public transport is terrible!” Yes and if you relied on public transport then you wouldn’t be living there, would you? You would live somewhere else.

Not driving depends where you live, what the public transport is like and where you work.
I don’t drive a lot, work, big shop and to DDs activities. I could do the big shop online. I couldn’t work where I do as it’s on an industrial estate and DD would have to give up her activities, we couldn’t physically get there.
I’ve lived in cities and never needed a car or considered one.
Where I live I imagine public transport is about to get even worse after bus companies have taken a hit.

City living without a car isn’t necessarily easy.
I have friend who lives in south west London, I live in south east- to drive to Hers takes 30mins, but the public transport journey isn’t simple, it’s near on an hr. Another friend lives not far from me but to go to specific park that takes 15mins In a car would be nearly an hr with a walk a bus and a walk - too much effort once you factor in the preschoolers.

but it’s the pathetic hopelessness of it

That's a new one.

@OnlyFoolsnMothers I have a child and I don't drive.