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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

If this was YOU on Wednesday, then I’m really sorry.

297 replies

flowergirl24 · 17/07/2020 12:58

Two days ago I was walking in a seaside town in Devon, with two dogs and two children. After a stressful time at work, we wanted to have a few days off. Our break turned pretty hellish with children not sleeping at all and lots going wrong. On this last day, my Labrador tried to attack another dog, knocked over my 2 year old child while doing it and I lost it. I smacked him and shouted at him. It was kind of the last straw. Two women passing by stopped and had a go at me, saying I should never treat an animal like that. My husband told them to back off. He later said that he saw the one crying on the other’s shoulder (they looked like grown up mother and daughter) so they were clearly very upset by the incident. If this was YOU, or you know who this was, then I want to say sorry. I’m ashamed at my behaviour. Hoping to get some help for me to deal with my anger and I’ve already booked some specialist dog training to help with that situation.

OP posts:
Russell19 · 17/07/2020 19:29

@SquishyBones yes I have some advice and have had dogs my whole life.... keep it controlled on a lead like a responsible dog owner then there's no chance of attacking other dogs and knocking over children. Simple really.

Therebythedoor · 17/07/2020 19:31

@KaptainKaveman

Why do you have a dog which tries to attack people?
The most asinine question so far.
SquishyBones · 17/07/2020 19:31

[quote Russell19]@SquishyBones yes I have some advice and have had dogs my whole life.... keep it controlled on a lead like a responsible dog owner then there's no chance of attacking other dogs and knocking over children. Simple really.[/quote]
So the dog was off lead? The OP doesn’t say that.

Karwomannghia · 17/07/2020 19:34

Gosh you really did want to punish yourself coming on Mumsnet to admit to that, did you not feel bad enough already?

AdelaideK · 17/07/2020 19:34

No-one comes out of this tale well including the dog.

Russell19 · 17/07/2020 19:35

@SquishyBones that's why I said controlled on a lead. E.g held properly and by her side. Unless the other dog was off lead came over.... but then in that case it would have been the other owners responsibility to get their dog away. Still no excuses for animal abuse.

SquishyBones · 17/07/2020 19:39

[quote Russell19]**@SquishyBones* that's why I said controlled* on a lead. E.g held properly and by her side. Unless the other dog was off lead came over.... but then in that case it would have been the other owners responsibility to get their dog away. Still no excuses for animal abuse.[/quote]
We don’t know how old this dog is. What’s its history? Has it always been reactive? If the OP has raised a reactive dog and not sought any help from a professional then yes, she’s irresponsible. If they adopted the dog at 12 months old, thought it was ok until this incident then they got caught out and will, hopefully, now get help.

OP how long have you had this dog and when did you realise he or she was reactive?

BanditoShipman · 17/07/2020 19:49

@JRUIN

I really shouted at him and probably smacked him three times on the bottom.

So you didn't just smack the dog you beat the poor thing. If I saw you behaving that like I would be thinking 'God if she can behave like that in public what is she like at home?!!! And yes I would get very upset, and no that doesn't make me a fucking snowflake Hmm

Totally agree with this
MrMeSeeks · 17/07/2020 19:57

Get some perspective

I do, she hit her dog 3 or more times and then yelled at a couple badly enough to make one of them cry.
None of that is ok.
It could happen again unless she takes steps to stop it.
Op admits to having an anger problem.

Crankley · 17/07/2020 20:04

I assume the OP knows that the chances of the woman being on here are miniscule and therefore an apology is pointless. I think what the OP really wanted by posting this was for enough posters to say don't worry hun, it wasn't your fault, be kind to yourself etc which is exactly what has happened. Result.

DiscombobulatedmarkII · 17/07/2020 20:06

Taking out your frustration on a dog is wholly unacceptable. Your dog does not understand why you abused it. You are asking for forgiveness to pacify your own needs. You want us to pacify your mistake and abuse.

SquishyBones · 17/07/2020 20:09

@Crankley

I assume the OP knows that the chances of the woman being on here are miniscule and therefore an apology is pointless. I think what the OP really wanted by posting this was for enough posters to say don't worry hun, it wasn't your fault, be kind to yourself etc which is exactly what has happened. Result.
Yeah because it would have been preferable to see the OP kicked while she was down ... made to feel like shit etc etc .... because we like to do that to our fellow women don’t we? Destroy the bastards! That’s what I say!
carly2803 · 17/07/2020 20:11

jesus christ you posters are awful

OP, if my dog had knocked my child over to attack another dog,it would also get a smack or a boot, depends which was more appropriate

i dontwant a child hurt, and another dog shredded on my watch

SquishyBones · 17/07/2020 20:14

@carly2803

jesus christ you posters are awful

OP, if my dog had knocked my child over to attack another dog,it would also get a smack or a boot, depends which was more appropriate

i dontwant a child hurt, and another dog shredded on my watch

Finally. Someone speaks some sense
nothingcanhurtmewithmyeyesshut · 17/07/2020 20:17

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

SquishyBones · 17/07/2020 20:20

What you should have done OP is allow your dog to kill the other dog ... injure your child and then give it some chicken to reward it for not killing your kid. That’s the positive way!

JRUIN · 17/07/2020 20:26

What you should have done OP is allow your dog to kill the other dog ... injure your child and then give it some chicken to reward it for not killing your kid. That’s the positive way!

If you knew anything about dogs at all you'd know that hitting it usually only serves to make the dog more aggressive.

SquishyBones · 17/07/2020 20:31

@JRUIN

What you should have done OP is allow your dog to kill the other dog ... injure your child and then give it some chicken to reward it for not killing your kid. That’s the positive way!

If you knew anything about dogs at all you'd know that hitting it usually only serves to make the dog more aggressive.

So what should she have done?

I agree she shouldn’t have hit it but to make out that she’s some kind of animal abuser is OTT. She made a mistake ffs. Have you never done that??

JRUIN · 17/07/2020 20:33

So what should she have done?

Trained her dog maybe?

SquishyBones · 17/07/2020 20:37

@JRUIN

So what should she have done?

Trained her dog maybe?

You don’t know the circumstances. Maybe it was a freak incident? Dog has been on with other dogs upto this point? OP hasn’t clarified yet
Mittens030869 · 17/07/2020 20:40

@JRUIN

Yes it sounds as if she should have trained her Labrador better of course. But in that particular scenario, how would you have handled it? You can't start dog training from scratch when the dog is trying to attack another dog and your toddler has been knocked over.

No, she shouldn't have hit her dog. But what would your strategy have been?

MyOldBeansy · 17/07/2020 20:48

@SquishyBones

It’s always the same with “positive reinforcement only” people ... all well and good teaching tricks and simple shit but when it comes to serious issues they haven’t got a word of advice whatsoever.
Of course they don't. Positive reinforcement refers to the addition of something the dog wants in a way that the dog links the reinforcer to an action and is, therefore, more likely to repeat the action. This is operant training and often has no place at all in conversations about changing serious issues. It's good that “positive reinforcement only” people can recognise that.

Reactivity is fear based. What we would be trying to achieve is an emotional shift from fear to neutral or happy and would require classical conditioning. This is where the dog has an involuntary emotional response to a stimulus that you want to change. It's not training, strickly. It's deliberate manipulation of a dog's emotional (hormonal if you prefer a less human-ised term) response. If a dog is fearful of another dog then there are techniques that MAY slowly change that emotion to something less unpleasant, often through slow and steady exposure at distances the dog is comfortable with, and pairing the presence of a strange dog with something the reactive dog enjoys. Over time the sight of another dog makes the reactive dog anticipate nice things and so they become happy to see them, not scared. Not scared leads to not attacking.

Of course, if you hit a dog when he reacts then he is unlikely to link the punshiment with their own actions and more likely to link it to the presence of another dog. Now, the sight of another dog makes him anticipate something bad with happen (ebing hot) and so the fear gets worse. Not always, because dogs are not robots. Sometimes you 'get lucky' and he links the punishment to the behaviour but it is a gamble that is less likely to work than not.

Or so many (maybe even several hundred, genuinly) academic studies would have us believe...

JRUIN · 17/07/2020 20:49

You don’t know the circumstances. Maybe it was a freak incident? Dog has been on with other dogs upto this point? OP hasn’t clarified yet

Perhaps. But still you don't beat the dog. You grab it by it's collar and put it on it's lead. I have already said anyway that if the OP is genuinely sorry and is getting help to change her and her dogs behaviour that's brilliant. It is the posters coming on and having a go at the concerned witnesses that are pissing me off. They were right to say something and they had every right to be upset too. Crying at witnessing animal cruelty is not something to be mocked.

caribooshriek · 17/07/2020 21:06

Sometimes we lose it. While that's not an excuse to hit any living creature, never post on MN looking for approbation or sympathy.

Russell19 · 17/07/2020 21:14

If your kids witnessed you attacking and abusing your dog I hope you have now informed them that animal abuse is wrong. The last thing society needs is children being brought up mistreating animals.