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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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To ask people to show a little more understanding to those not wearing masks

999 replies

Fuckinellitsme · 15/07/2020 09:20

Apologies for another mask thread.

First of all, I'm not an 'anti masker', I absolutely see the need and the importance of wearing them. I'm unable to wear one myself - I have trigeminal neuralgia and when I've tried to wear one, the resulting attack has left me bedbound for days. I want to wear one, but I can't. I also have rheumatoid arthritis so I'm incredibly grateful to all the people who do wear masks, therefore protecting others and especially those in higher risk groups (though not vulnerable enough to be shielding) like me.

However. I've seen some truly awful comments on here in the last few days directed at those who don't wear masks. We should be treated like lepers if we enter a shop without one, for example, or should be banned from them outright. And we ought to stay at home if we are exempt, not use public transport or go shopping or go to work. We have 'made up' health issues and disabilities and are 'woe is me' 'snowflakes'. I've also encountered bus passengers passing comment and tutting about my lack of mask.

Those of us who can't wear a mask (and are acting within the law/guidelines, being exempt) still need to go about our business. It would be lovely if we could do so without fear of comment or judgement. I understand that there will be those who don't wear a mask because they just don't want to - however, please, if you see someone without a mask (particularly if they're wearing a sunflower/exempt lanyard) try to be understanding and give them the benefit of the doubt.

The nastiness and ableist comments on here (and elsewhere) in the past few days have been genuinely upsetting for those of us unable to wear masks. Please don't assume we're all stupid/selfish/conspiracy theorists/don't care about your health, or that it's a choice. For many, choice doesn't come into it.

A bit of empathy goes a long way, especially in these weird times.

OP posts:
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MaxNormal · 15/07/2020 21:30

The spite from some of you is sickening.

nothingcanhurtmewithmyeyesshut · 15/07/2020 21:48

I have trigeminal neuralgia too though mine is thankfully not triggered by touch. I don't know how you cope, honestly. I'm exempt on mental health grounds but will be wearing a visor instead and if anyone tries to police me they will be getting a very graphic description, in front of their kids if necessary, of why I can't stand wearing one.

People need to mind their own business.

LangClegsInSpace · 15/07/2020 22:03

Masks are not mainly to protect 'the vulnerable' they are to help lower the infection rate generally so everyone is safer. They do help a bit so everyone should wear one if they can.

Nothing this government has done has been to 'protect the vulnerable'. It's all been about protecting the NHS and protecting the economy.

'Extremely vulnerable' people were told to basically get in the fucking cupboard for several months, only to be allowed back out now they are needed back at work.

Those with 'underlying health conditions' have been made to understand that their deaths do not count. Instead, if they die, their 'underlying health conditions' will be cited to reassure the general public that 'normal' people have little to fear.

Those who cannot wear a face covering because of disability or a health issue or severe trauma are being made to understand that the course of this pandemic is now down to them and it's their fault if another 'vulnerable' person catches the virus or if there is a second wave.

A few years ago there was lots of discussion about the term 'vulnerable' when applied to adults who are disabled or who have care needs. It's horrible to see it making a come back in circumstances where disabled people's rights are under such threat.

Everybody is vulnerable.

We all need to stand together (at a safe physical distance Wink), do what we can to protect each other and stop shitting on anyone for things they are unable to do.

feellikeanalien · 15/07/2020 22:15

@LangClegsInSpace. That was an excellent post. You've summed up exactly what I think but have expressed it much better than I could. A bit of sanity in the mad world which we're all living in at the moment.

Floatyboat · 15/07/2020 22:17

Can you not wear a face shield supported from the shoulders rather than the head?

Floatyboat · 15/07/2020 22:34

www.globenewswire.com/news-release/2020/05/12/2032198/0/en/ZVerse-Unveils-Innovative-Face-Shield-for-Service-Industry-Workers.html

Surely just wear something like this?

A lot of people seemed determined that they can't wear face coverings before actually exploring all options.

LillianBland · 15/07/2020 22:51

As usual LangClegsInSpace, you’ve nailed it. 👏🏼

ItsNotJustAboutYou · 15/07/2020 22:54

I dislike this narrative from some shielders that as they are the most clinically vulnerable absolutely everyone else's rights come second to them. I am not some sort of sacred cow that expects other people to make sacrifices that are beyond them, especially not children (who are over 11 of course as they are exempt below) just because of my bad luck health wise. It sucks but it's how it is. Other people have rights - this is actually mandated in the guidance - I have no idea why people think they know better.

The "oh you're the reason I will have to stay indoors forever" is fucking ridiculous (for all the reasons so well articulated by @LangClegsInSpace - fabulous posts!) and extremely unpleasant and verges on emotional blackmail.

I am on the shielding list and I am not able to wear a mask for other reasons. I accept that if I don't wear a mask I cant expect others to (which is fine by me, as again, see Lang's posts).

So. My risk of death from CV is just the same as other shielders (generally speaking as a broad spectrum of us all being deemed CEV) yet I would still choose to be mask less - doesn't that give anyone a clue as to how important and difficult this is? Why can't people just respect that?

These aren't exactly light decisions to make and surely my strength of feeling shows how people in my situation are having to deal with this. The government (crap as they are) recognises my reasons for exemption, the guidance recognises my reasons for example - shielding people do not get to override me. You make your choices, that's fine and I'll make my (perfectly legal) choices for me.

I cannot, even years later, bear to have even DH's hands near my face unexpectedly. It's unbearable. And yet I've made so much progress from where I was. I am not going to subject myself to going through all that again because someone thinks they are more important than me.

My mental health is just as important as your physical health. If people can't accept that and think they are more important it says a lot about them.

ItsNotJustAboutYou · 15/07/2020 22:59

And seeing as you seem to be incapable of reading and comprehending posts @Ylvamoon, again I would advise you read back and try it again. I've already explained myself, I'm not "elaborating" anything for you if you are too lazy to do that. I've explained my experience and my position on this, fair enough you can disagree but at least inform yourself first. I'm not going to engage you with any further beyond saying that.

Haenow · 15/07/2020 23:07

Ironically, a significant proportion of the shielding group will legitimately be unable to wear masks and are exempt. I expect them to go around self flaggelating.

Honestly, bunch of twats, some people are...
Don’t worry, OP. Flowers I hear you. It’s only the vocal few who think they have a right to know your medical history.

Haenow · 15/07/2020 23:09

Since the shielding guidance was created, a lot of the immunosuppressive drugs e.g. anti TNFs initially thought to increase risk of CV19 complications are actually a protective factor.

Stefoscope · 15/07/2020 23:50

No judgment here. I work in a shop and couldn't care less if people wear a mask as it's easy enough to stay 2m+ away from another person in my shop. My understanding is that masks were originally intended to be used in indoor spaces where you can't maintain adequate social distancing, which does make sense. There are all sorts of reasons someone may not be able to wear a mask and it's not my business to ask and essentially evaluate whether they're 'disabled enough' to be exempt.

According to Matt Hancock re non mask wearers: "A shop can refuse them entry and can call the police if they refuse to comply". Sorry, but I'm hardly going to turn customers away when business is already slow. Oh and I'm sure the Police will be right round to sort that for us, meanwhile in the real world...

RufustheRowlingReindeer · 15/07/2020 23:57

@Stefoscope

No judgment here. I work in a shop and couldn't care less if people wear a mask as it's easy enough to stay 2m+ away from another person in my shop. My understanding is that masks were originally intended to be used in indoor spaces where you can't maintain adequate social distancing, which does make sense. There are all sorts of reasons someone may not be able to wear a mask and it's not my business to ask and essentially evaluate whether they're 'disabled enough' to be exempt.

According to Matt Hancock re non mask wearers: "A shop can refuse them entry and can call the police if they refuse to comply". Sorry, but I'm hardly going to turn customers away when business is already slow. Oh and I'm sure the Police will be right round to sort that for us, meanwhile in the real world...

Ive two friends who work in a high street shop

Both have been given grief for asking customers to sanitise their hands and only enter the store one at a time...generally ignored

The masks thing is not going to go well for them

Stefoscope · 16/07/2020 00:11

Ive two friends who work in a high street shop. Both have been given grief for asking customers to sanitise their hands and only enter the store one at a time...generally ignored. The masks thing is not going to go well for them.

Yup that's working in a shop for you unfortunately. So far this week I've had one customer get arsey because I refused to take his greasy phone off him to read off and put together a shopping list of items he wanted (we offer online click and collect). Another insist he wanted to use our toilet even though the ceiling in the corridor to the customer toilet is currently visibly falling in due to shitty landlord who won't repair it. Oh and the guy who hasn't received an item he ordered last week even though he can see from the Royal Mail tracking info that we've posted it. Had to politely point out there's a little thing called a pandemic currently going on.

HeIenaDove · 16/07/2020 00:29

Oh and I'm sure the Police will be right round to sort that for us, meanwhile in the real world

www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-britain-police/easter-egg-ban-and-lake-dyeing-uk-police-chided-for-overzealous-response-idUSKBN21I0PS

Elsewyre · 16/07/2020 00:37

@Stefoscope

No judgment here. I work in a shop and couldn't care less if people wear a mask as it's easy enough to stay 2m+ away from another person in my shop. My understanding is that masks were originally intended to be used in indoor spaces where you can't maintain adequate social distancing, which does make sense. There are all sorts of reasons someone may not be able to wear a mask and it's not my business to ask and essentially evaluate whether they're 'disabled enough' to be exempt.

According to Matt Hancock re non mask wearers: "A shop can refuse them entry and can call the police if they refuse to comply". Sorry, but I'm hardly going to turn customers away when business is already slow. Oh and I'm sure the Police will be right round to sort that for us, meanwhile in the real world...

Mean while in the real world massive multinationals like Tesco and asda (wallmart) will happily turn people away, will call the police, who will respond

Hopefuly your small shop gets shut down or people avoid your decision to put money before health

Standardy · 16/07/2020 06:35

essentially evaluate whether they're 'disabled enough' to be exempt.

Why to people keep referring to those who are unable to safely wear a mask as disabled?

Floatyboat · 16/07/2020 07:02

Because they're unable to do something I guess.

Fuckinellitsme · 16/07/2020 07:59

Hopefuly your small shop gets shut down or people avoid your decision to put money before health

What a nasty comment.

Shop staff have been told not to intervene by unions and the police, quite rightly. What are staff supposed to do anyway, issue fines? Force masks onto faces? I've seen pieces in the media where shops are saying they'll be putting 'no mask, no entry' signs in their windows, essentially barring those with legitimate reason for not wearing one and raising all sorts of discrimination issues and, technically, risking prosecution themselves. Meanwhile, staff aren't required to wear masks. Will you be avoiding all the shops where staff aren't wearing coverings? Have you been going to shops where the staff/customers are not wearing masks since March (if you're shielding obviously this doesn't apply)? If so, what's changed now - why are you suddenly so upset by those unable to wear them?

OP posts:
Fuckinellitsme · 16/07/2020 08:02

@Floatyboat

www.globenewswire.com/news-release/2020/05/12/2032198/0/en/ZVerse-Unveils-Innovative-Face-Shield-for-Service-Industry-Workers.html

Surely just wear something like this?

A lot of people seemed determined that they can't wear face coverings before actually exploring all options.

Not widely available though, things like that. And not cheap if they are. And very bulky to carry around, in between shops/buses etc - not really something a person who relies on walking aids, for example, can do.

Perhaps, as face coverings are to be made mandatory, ones could be made widely available to suit all needs - or those who cannot wear them should not have to defend their actions or face judgement.

OP posts:
Floatyboat · 16/07/2020 08:27

@Fuckinellitsme

That won't suit everyone's problem but looks excellent for trigeminal neuralgia. And not that bulky, you'd just wear it when out so you don't have to carry it. Could take it off when driving if you wished.

Its available on the internet, they deliver to your door you realise?

I do get the impression sometimes people are determined they can't wear a face covering without actually researching their options.

Hearhoovesthinkzebras · 16/07/2020 08:28

@InsaneInTheViralMembrane

Zebras. What exactly IS your long- term plan given eradication is unlikely and a vaccine not a guarantee. Will you be clicking your heels together three times and chanting “I wish, I wish...”.

Death is going to come to us all I’m afraid.

I'm 50. I don't plan on dying yet thanks so I will avoid it for as long as I can. What an insensitive thing to say.
SockYarn · 16/07/2020 08:29

Shop staff have been told not to intervene by unions and the police, quite rightly. What are staff supposed to do anyway, issue fines? Force masks onto faces?

I'm a volunteer in a charity shop and we're set up for socially distancing in the shop. I will not however be policing mask wearing. For a start, I do believe that people who aren't might well have a good reason and it's none of my business. Secondly I'm not the police!!

Namenic · 16/07/2020 08:33

Having a medical cert for exemption should be ok - is there a problem with this?

What is being asked of people unable to wear masks is just to get an exemption cert. for those who have no medical (including psychiatric) reason, but intensely dislike it, then what is being asked in no worse than what was asked of people who were shielding (though without the added fear of medical issues on top).

Perhaps we could be a bit creative though and have 1 shopping day per week specifically for those who find masks difficult and 1 day per week where everyone should wear one?

BamboozledandBefuddled · 16/07/2020 08:33

Mean while in the real world massive multinationals like Tesco and asda (wallmart) will happily turn people away, will call the police, who will respond

If you're expecting that to happen, I think you're probably going to be disappointed.