To ask people to show a little more understanding to those not wearing masks

[Fuckinellitsme]

Apologies for another mask thread.

First of all, I'm not an 'anti masker', I absolutely see the need and the importance of wearing them. I'm unable to wear one myself - I have trigeminal neuralgia and when I've tried to wear one, the resulting attack has left me bedbound for days. I want to wear one, but I can't. I also have rheumatoid arthritis so I'm incredibly grateful to all the people who do wear masks, therefore protecting others and especially those in higher risk groups (though not vulnerable enough to be shielding) like me.

However. I've seen some truly awful comments on here in the last few days directed at those who don't wear masks. We should be treated like lepers if we enter a shop without one, for example, or should be banned from them outright. And we ought to stay at home if we are exempt, not use public transport or go shopping or go to work. We have 'made up' health issues and disabilities and are 'woe is me' 'snowflakes'. I've also encountered bus passengers passing comment and tutting about my lack of mask.

Those of us who can't wear a mask (and are acting within the law/guidelines, being exempt) still need to go about our business. It would be lovely if we could do so without fear of comment or judgement. I understand that there will be those who don't wear a mask because they just don't want to - however, please, if you see someone without a mask (particularly if they're wearing a sunflower/exempt lanyard) try to be understanding and give them the benefit of the doubt.

The nastiness and ableist comments on here (and elsewhere) in the past few days have been genuinely upsetting for those of us unable to wear masks. Please don't assume we're all stupid/selfish/conspiracy theorists/don't care about your health, or that it's a choice. For many, choice doesn't come into it.

A bit of empathy goes a long way, especially in these weird times.

In settings where face coverings are mandated in England, there are some circumstances, for health, age or equality reasons, whereby people are not expected to wear face coverings in these settings. Please be mindful and respectful of such circumstances noting that some people are less able to wear face coverings

That's not what most of the other threads have been discussing, but if you want to carry on pretending so up to you.

In the Asian country that I live in, there are fines of up to £500 for those not wearing a mask. It is pretty unusual to see anyone not wearing one

^^This. I think there is a lot of fuss around nothing. There are many countries that require you to have a mask. Not sure why the UK public has to fish for every available excuse.

On top of that, you only have to wear them in shops, so its not 24/7. Surely the majority of people can comply. Granted, there will be a select few that can't wear one. But then, I'd ask about the necessity of visiting a shop. More to the point, potentially breathing Corona virus into the environment and the stuff someone wants to buy.

@Dinosauratemydaffodils I'm sorry you have experienced it too. Its such a hard situation at the moment and actually the lack of compassion and kindness from people is one of the worse aspects of this. I hope you feel better.

Maybe it's just that the unkind people shout louder, or shout over everyone else and get heard more. We shouldn't pay any attention really. I genuinely don't care what strangers think of me, it just sort of saddens me really that people are almost proud of their unkindness and won't listen even if you try and engage with good intentions.

The people who matter don't mind and the people who mind don't matter. I think that's the expression anyway!

I genuinely hope you feel happier very soon. Maybe we should stay away from mask threads

The reports from charities for the deaf on how much impact it’s going to have on people with hearing loss are really sad. So many people will suffer from this policy including people who have reasons for not wearing like @ItsNotJustAboutYou. Not only is it going to make life difficult for people with hearing loss, the people who can’t wear them are going to have to put up with judgy idiots.

Wearing a mask may do some good but as Hancock said yesterday it’s about reassurance for scared people as well, a bit of theatre not a guarantee, so mind your own business and get a grip.

*"Unfortunately there are too many people who are treating the requirement to wear a mask as a severe breach of their human rights, or who are bleating loudly about how mean it all is and that the masks are all a bit too hot and stuffy.

Which makes it very difficult for those who cannot wear a mask for legitimate medical reasons"

This is the new "disability benefits have to be cut because of the scroungers" Its because of the scroungers.*

People who need benefits, however - and even the few scroungers - don't usually go around making a big ideological issue about how it is Wrong for people to go to work and earn money; how they are trespassing on other people's human rights; how one ought to take the money away from pensioners to provide benefits for younger people because the older people will die soon anyway, so why should younger people have to sacrifice to adapt to the pensioners' needs. They don't organize rallies with big notices claiming that those in conventional employment, or on retirement pensions, are denying everyone their freedom.

Actually, the extreme anti-mask crowd have more in common with those who wish to deny disabled people benefits than those who need to claim them. What they have most in common with, is anti-vaxxers, and there seems to be some overlap between the two. And there is indeed also a group of people who can't have some or all vaccinations for medical reasons, and who are occasionally lumped in with the anti-vaxxers.

I have some invisible disabilities myself, and have been badly hurt on a number of occasions by people making assumptions and blaming me for things that I can't help. But the belligerent anti-maskers, anti-vaxxers, etc. make things worse.

My brother in law is a surgeon. He is also severely asthmatic. He wears a mask all day doing his job as he couldn't do his job if he didn't.

There are definitely people who can't wear masks, but there also seem to be some people who won't even try and declare it impossible for them to do so (I'm not saying that's anyone on this thread). I suffer from claustrophobia, and hate it, but I've managed to do it for the short periods of time I needed to. People really should try where possible leaving only those for whom it's impossible as the non wearers.

@Ylvamoon "Granted, there will be a select few that can't wear one. But then, I'd ask about the necessity of visiting a shop"

Please do tell us more how you're going to ask people and children with certain disabilities, or rape or abuse survivors, about the "necessity" of them visiting a shop? Or are you expecting someone else to ask them? Or is it a rhetorical question and you are just silently judging instead?

Fuck me some people are ignorant and can't see beyond of their own noses even when other people try and help them.

I really am leaving the thread. I am.

Vast numbers cannot wear masks. People seem to have little care for others on these issues. Live and let live. Saying people should stay at home if they cannot wear a mask is not very kind when no one is proposing to do their shopping for them for a start and many cannot get on line slots

Why would it be vast numbers? It doesn't look like vast numbers in Scotland or Germany.

Op

Have you seen my message about the ones that come from the shoulders?

It's called zVerse.

Why would it be vast numbers? It doesn't look like vast numbers in Scotland or Germany.

I'm in Scotland. I'm accepting of the fact that I can't go shopping but I have someone who can. I'm also accepting of the fact that I can't access face to face medical treatment or take my kids to half the things they want to do this summer because those attractions require masks.

What I hate is that dh says roughly half the people he sees in supermarkets have masks on their chins or not all and aren't socially distancing.

Sorry. Z shield.

Doesn't touch the face. Head. Nothing. Comes from the shoulders.

Granted, there will be a select few that can't wear one. But then, I'd ask about the necessity of visiting a shop"

Are you elected as chief of deciding who should be going to a shop or not now?
How will you decide who is deserving of such a basic need accolade?
How will you decide if their disability/health condition/mental health/past experiences are good enough for you or not?

I'm sure some people cannot wear masks but the reality is they should be few and far between. For what it's worth, all of us will be wearing masks, including my son, who has Autism and a learning disability.
Well good for you your medal is in the post.
Do you have an indepth understanding of the hundreds of reasons why someone cannot wear a mask?
Does your son epitomise every single person in the uk with autism and learning difficulties? No? Then him having these problems is absolutely irrelevant.

I bet nobody gives a damm if that person is working and providing a service for them while having a right not to wear a mask but just dont do it in front of me because that offends me!

Disabalism is becoming commonplace on here now its shameful.

Saying people should stay at home if they cannot wear a mask is not very kind when no one is proposing to do their shopping for them for a start and many cannot get on line slots

Yet most people have been very comfortable with posters saying that those who are shielding should just stay at home (usually followed by "you were going to die soon anyway")

Maybe we should stay away from mask threads

Probably. It's becoming almost a form of self harm for me though. I can't help myself. It's making me feel awful, so heightened and sick with it but I need to know what disgusting selfish awful people we are. I want to see people say that we don't deserve medical treatment or food or to live because that's how I currently feel about myself.

twitter.com/AdamBienkov/status/1283392513080995842?s=20

Adam Bienkov
@AdamBienkov
After Michael Gove was pictured without a face covering in a Pret A Manger, Boris Johnson’s spokesman says masks will not be required when buying takeaway food.

Add message | Report | Message poster | Quote | See allHeIenaDove Wed 15-Jul-20 17:50:22
yes its well known that takeaways are a lot bigger than supermarkets so social distancing is so much easier hmm

now the pissheads wont have to worry about going to get their kebabs from the takeaway after leaving the pub or donning a mask to do it because they arent required in either.

Saying people should stay at home if they cannot wear a mask is not very kind when no one is proposing to do their shopping for them for a start and many cannot get on line slots

That’s pretty much how late March and April went for all too many shielders - delivery slots all to cock, relying on volunteers (they still exist, you will be OK, ask for help)

You’ll need, if no mask, yo social distancing at 2m, and places where that is not possible will be in effect closed to you. Essential shops (such as supermarkets and pharmacies) will have to remain available

But unequal access to non-essential retail and services is already the norm. It’s shit when you first realise you fall into a category which has less access to goods and services (and consequently greater a greater feeling of exclusion from wider society)

You’ll need, if no mask, yo social distancing at 2m, and places where that is not possible will be in effect closed to you.

Where does the law say that?

I do feel for people who genuinely medically can't wear a mask.

Sadly they will get lumbered in by some with the anti-social wankers who think the rules don't apply to them and will carry on doing what they like as they have throughout. These are the people who get people's backs up but other genuine people get caught up in it.

Hooves - No one is asking for exemptions to be shared are they?

From this and other threads it appears quite a few people think they have the right to know why someone is exempt.

Simply having an official card stating you are exempt, to be shown to a bus driver or shop keeper would be sufficient.

Would it? From your previous posts I got the impression you didn't think there should be any exemptions in the first place.

If I have misunderstood that's great, it seems we are in agreement after all

And I'm afraid I'm not putting my son's health at risk by accepting that everyone who isn't wearing a mask has a good reason for not doing so.

It must be so difficult for many here, from both the ones who need others to wear them, and those who cannot for their own health and cannot avoid going out for whatever reason.

What I am not understanding is..there seems a few on my FB who are saying that unless someone has a disability and thats the reason for not wearing a mask..they are in danger. But as far as I can see, even if someone did have a disability and that was a reason for not wearing one, that doesn't make them less of a risk anyway? Its simply the fact that someone doesn't have a mask on (whatever the reason) thats dangerous surely? Just seems rather odd reasoning.

I cannot see an easy answer tbh.

Personally I am staying in for the foreseeable future. Due to severe asthma making it awful for me, have tried many different ones and still nope. I have a legit reason not to wear one..and really do not want to be inside for even longer tbh, but I don't fancy the many death stares, whispering and insults that seem common these days.

@LangClegsInSpace

Hooves - No one is asking for exemptions to be shared are they?

From this and other threads it appears quite a few people think they have the right to know why someone is exempt.

Simply having an official card stating you are exempt, to be shown to a bus driver or shop keeper would be sufficient.

Would it? From your previous posts I got the impression you didn't think there should be any exemptions in the first place.

If I have misunderstood that's great, it seems we are in agreement after all

I think the number of people not wearing masks should be as low as possible. If they are limited to the people who can't wear them then that's as low as possible. Whether that is practical and low enough to actually keep infections low who knows but that will be for government to monitor. You've only got to look at the number of threads on MN though to see how many people are claiming they won't be wearing them simply because they don't agree with them and will defy anyone to question them as to why - that's just ridiculous. I've seen one poster say they hurt their ears so won't be wearing one.

If non wearers had to provide a document verifying they are exempt hopefully it would deter the people who are just choosing not to wear one.

There are cases where people are unable to wear masks. Should they have their rights curtailed to protect the shielding people?

I don’t think there is an answer. One persons rights interferes with another’s.

It is a problem, but something that govt should produce guidelines on and support for. Ie could say that employer must ensure that there are adequate protections for shielding people - can have a plastic screen at a till and subsidised N95 or monetary support to continue furlough. Or allow business to impose restrictions (eg compulsory mask wearing for all those entering building IF there is an employee who is vulnerable/shielding).

There are some occasions (eg healthcare settings) where I think it is mandatory for employees to have vaccinations. So there is some precedent for requiring conditions to be met (eg masks) for certain situations. What those situations are is up for debate (eg most people would not want their surgeon without a mask even if she/he had trigeminal neuralgia).

I do have great sympathy to those who are shielding. Many people have explained how the lockdown has had an effect on their mental health. But the people who have been shielding May also have mental health issues from shielding for a longer time and perhaps more anxiety on top of dealing with their health condition.