To ask people to show a little more understanding to those not wearing masks

[Fuckinellitsme]

Apologies for another mask thread.

First of all, I'm not an 'anti masker', I absolutely see the need and the importance of wearing them. I'm unable to wear one myself - I have trigeminal neuralgia and when I've tried to wear one, the resulting attack has left me bedbound for days. I want to wear one, but I can't. I also have rheumatoid arthritis so I'm incredibly grateful to all the people who do wear masks, therefore protecting others and especially those in higher risk groups (though not vulnerable enough to be shielding) like me.

However. I've seen some truly awful comments on here in the last few days directed at those who don't wear masks. We should be treated like lepers if we enter a shop without one, for example, or should be banned from them outright. And we ought to stay at home if we are exempt, not use public transport or go shopping or go to work. We have 'made up' health issues and disabilities and are 'woe is me' 'snowflakes'. I've also encountered bus passengers passing comment and tutting about my lack of mask.

Those of us who can't wear a mask (and are acting within the law/guidelines, being exempt) still need to go about our business. It would be lovely if we could do so without fear of comment or judgement. I understand that there will be those who don't wear a mask because they just don't want to - however, please, if you see someone without a mask (particularly if they're wearing a sunflower/exempt lanyard) try to be understanding and give them the benefit of the doubt.

The nastiness and ableist comments on here (and elsewhere) in the past few days have been genuinely upsetting for those of us unable to wear masks. Please don't assume we're all stupid/selfish/conspiracy theorists/don't care about your health, or that it's a choice. For many, choice doesn't come into it.

A bit of empathy goes a long way, especially in these weird times.

@ItsNotJustAboutYou I am so, so sorry this happened to you

@ItsNotJustAboutYou

"So, if you aren't wearing a mask where it's otherwise required stay at least two metres away from everyone else"

You can be sure I would stay much more than two metres away from you.

PPS Ironically I'm also on the shielding list.

Great. Everyone should be staying away so I'm pleased to hear that.

You might genuinely not be able to wear one but there's plenty of people who will be making up excuses because they simply don't want to. Wearing glasses (as I do) makes it very difficult for instance, spec savers put out suggestions but I'm still steaming. I do think that if the government wants high compliance they need to issue official exemption certificates, but not just a blanket disabilities because many can wear masks and it's in their interest. I've had c19 and its still not known if you are then immune

@WitchQueenofDarkness

I've suffered with TN for over 30 years. If I get a flare up I will get multiple attacks every few seconds for hours. Nothing will stop them and painkillers don't work. Even when an attack ends my face is achy for a day or so afterwards.

I am already wearing a mask in shops and giving a very wide berth to anyone I see without one even if I do appear rude.

I am glad you feel able to wear a mask and thank you for doing so. And of course, it's your right to avoid those who aren't wearing masks.

However please understand that everyone - even those with exactly the same conditions - may find their disease affects them differently. My TN is very active at the moment. If I was in a sustained period of remission I wouldn't have this issue with masks - I would wear one, end of. At the moment the slightest stimulus on my face/head/neck/jaw is setting it off. And when I'm not experiencing the 'electric shock'-type pains I have the burning, aching mouth and numb face.

And yes, I forgot to mention when explaining TN earlier - pain killers do not work, not even the strongest opiates. If only they did.

In the Asian country that I live in, there are fines of up to £500 for those not wearing a mask. It is pretty unusual to see anyone not wearing one.

We went back to school in June and even the children in foundation wore one all day. Nobody likes them, but it is just something that needs to be done.

ItsNotJustAboutYou
"So, if you aren't wearing a mask where it's otherwise required stay at least two metres away from everyone else"

You can be sure I would stay much more than two metres away from you.

PPS Ironically I'm also on the shielding list. 
Great. Everyone should be staying away so I'm pleased to hear that.

I actually feel a bit sorry for you hooves as you're really making yourself sound like a horrible uncaring selfish person and you just don't see it. Ironically (again) I would bet a huge number of people reading this thread are judging you far more negatively than anyone else. You're just coming across as so self centred and self important.

@Fuckinellitsme thank you. I did mean to say that of course YANBU "to ask for a little more understanding" and your replies to other posters have actually been lovely and kind (and much kinder than I would have been!) I hope this thread is useful to some people.

Oh I don't know what happened to my formatting/quoting there!

Is your TN being properly treated? I wonder if there is some better treatment out there for you. I know how very painful it can be.

I do see your dilemma, but on the other hand I do not think that people who are advocating that everyone should wear one where there is a risk of spread are being unreasonable. We are in a very dangerous situation at the moment, with a second wave waiting in the wings. I can understand, as I am sure you can, why some people get irritated with the anti-mask brigade, of which you clearly are not a member.

I have had a little look at the various TN support associations - amazingly none of them seem to have any advice on this topic. Maybe you might try gingering them up in this as it will be a problem for many. There has to be a solution. I am sure that many fellow-sufferers want to do the right thing, as you do.

OP I don't think many people are shooting disgust at those genuinely unable to wear them, nor are people who post on here likely to approach people and gob off about it. But many people have a ridiculous view that it's a conspiracy, or that they just don't want to, and that's the issue. If a certain % of people in an enclosed space wear masks it makes it safer for everyone, including those who cannot wear them, sort of like vaccines and herd immunity. If people who are being selfish wore them it would help keep you safe too, the claims throughout this thread that everyone who can wear one does is so far off of the mark. I don't see the issue with people discussing it, the threads I've seen have all acknowledged that they aren't including those who can't, or planning on approaching people in public about it.

@MarciaMarciaMarcia

In the Asian country that I live in, there are fines of up to £500 for those not wearing a mask. It is pretty unusual to see anyone not wearing one.

We went back to school in June and even the children in foundation wore one all day. Nobody likes them, but it is just something that needs to be done.

I'm not talking about people who just don't like them, though - I'm talking about disabled people, and those with health/MH issues which mean they can't. Not liking masks is not valid reason to not wear one.

NRFT but I think it is appalling that people still talk about the need for exemption badges or letters or whatever. It is no one else's business why someone is not using a face covering. You don't have a right to know and it is not your place to police ... seriously get a grip.

I actually feel a bit sorry for you hooves as you're really making yourself sound like a horrible uncaring selfish person and you just don't see it. Ironically (again) I would bet a huge number of people reading this thread are judging you far more negatively than anyone else. You're just coming across as so self centred and self important.

Really? And what of those willing to risk the lives of strangers? Is that ok? If you can't wear a mask then why not do everything else in your power to keep others safe - stay well away from other people, etc? I'll wear a mask all day at work despite having oxygen sats of below 90% because I would not want to put anyone else's life at risk. I'll stay over two metres away, I won't wear any jewellery below my elbows so that I can properly wash or sanitise my hands. I could not live with myself if I thought I could have caught it and passed it on to anyone else.

On a thread the other day someone was saying they were (or were going to start) filming non mask wearing people on public transport and putting them up on social media.

You can "judge" me however you want or ask me if you think I owe you an explanation, feel free. I will explain to you that I can't wear anything that covers my mouth and nose as I was raped when I was 14. To stop me screaming he put his hand over my mouth but he was an adult and his hands were big so it covered my nose too and I couldn't breathe. It went on forever and I genuinely thought I would die. So I can't bear anything that covers my nose and my mouth (or even hands near my face unexpectedly).

My story is very similar only I was older. According to my psychiatrist it's sadly extremely common. In my case, he told me he'd kill me unless I complied and I believed him. I thought I was going to die underneath him, gasping for breath. Right now, I wish I had.

On a thread the other day someone was saying they were (or were going to start) filming non mask wearing people on public transport and putting them up on social media.

One person out of many who post on here (who likely wouldn't actually do that anyway)? Okay then, that's an excuse for no one to be able to discuss masks and mask refusers out of choice. I hate it these days that certain topics are out of bounds because people assume x, y and z.

@Hearhoovesthinkzebras

I actually feel a bit sorry for you hooves as you're really making yourself sound like a horrible uncaring selfish person and you just don't see it. Ironically (again) I would bet a huge number of people reading this thread are judging you far more negatively than anyone else. You're just coming across as so self centred and self important.

Really? And what of those willing to risk the lives of strangers? Is that ok? If you can't wear a mask then why not do everything else in your power to keep others safe - stay well away from other people, etc? I'll wear a mask all day at work despite having oxygen sats of below 90% because I would not want to put anyone else's life at risk. I'll stay over two metres away, I won't wear any jewellery below my elbows so that I can properly wash or sanitise my hands. I could not live with myself if I thought I could have caught it and passed it on to anyone else.

Do you know how much of a martyr you make yourself sound. Couldn't live with yourself, won't use a disabled toilet because other people need it more or apply for benefits as you can work etc etc.

You're obviously such a good person. Sadly I am not. Selfishly I am clearly "willing to risk the lives of strangers"

But do you know what, reading your posts, especially your replies to me, I actually think deep down I am a "nicer" for want of a better word, person than you are, certainly more compassionate and kinder to strangers than you are.

I actually don't know why I'm getting embroiled in this with you and shall bow out. I've tried to explain my reasons but you have just totally totally ignored that (and everyone else explaining themselves). No one will ever shake your convictions that you are always the most important person in every room, ever.

Right now, I wish I had.

@Dinosauratemydaffodils I'm so sorry you feel like that, I'm sure there are people who are glad you didn't

Why is it completely wrong for a person who is medically exempt from a mask to have to show a card to a bus driver or shop assistant?

Eh? A total of no one said that. I said they shouldn't have to justify themselves to you. You would assume they were wrong doers unless you were shown proof.

Op' s right- try to have some consideration for non mask wearers in public, and don't just assume they're arseholes. She probably feels self conscious without one and worried about disapproval.

ItsNotJustAboutYou

I really am not bothered whether you judge yourself to be nicer than me or not.

I couldn't live with myself if I infected anyone else, I won't claim benefits because I don't need them, I won't use the disabled toilets if alternatives are available because someone else might need it more. That doesn't make me nice. I'd expect any decent human being to do the same. I don't need your approval strangely.

@Standardy

On a thread the other day someone was saying they were (or were going to start) filming non mask wearing people on public transport and putting them up on social media.

One person out of many who post on here (who likely wouldn't actually do that anyway)? Okay then, that's an excuse for no one to be able to discuss masks and mask refusers out of choice. I hate it these days that certain topics are out of bounds because people assume x, y and z.

Perhaps if you filter posts you can see I'm certainly not using that as an excuse to avoid discussing the issue, in fact the very opposite as I have actually given my reasons for being a "mask refuser" very clearly a few posts above, in the hope people may take it on board.

Sadly not, I wish I hadn't bothered as it's so fucking depressing that people just don't give a shit about anyone other than themselves. I'm actually laughing a little that I've been accused of shutting down debate.

Just a reminder for ignorant judgy self important people, follow the fucking guidelines!

In settings where face coverings are mandated in England, there are some circumstances, for health, age or equality reasons, whereby people are not expected to wear face coverings in these settings. Please be mindful and respectful of such circumstances noting that some people are less able to wear face coverings.

@SmileyClare

Why is it completely wrong for a person who is medically exempt from a mask to have to show a card to a bus driver or shop assistant?

Eh? A total of no one said that. I said they shouldn't have to justify themselves to you. You would assume they were wrong doers unless you were shown proof.

Op' s right- try to have some consideration for non mask wearers in public, and don't just assume they're arseholes. She probably feels self conscious without one and worried about disapproval.

But the op cannot control how others think. People will judge her. People judge me if I sit in the disabled seat on a bus or train. There judged me when I've walked out of a disabled toilet, when I've used it only because I was going to have an accident otherwise, because I don't look disabled. People do judge. You can't control that.

@Hearhoovesthinkzebras

I actually feel a bit sorry for you hooves as you're really making yourself sound like a horrible uncaring selfish person and you just don't see it. Ironically (again) I would bet a huge number of people reading this thread are judging you far more negatively than anyone else. You're just coming across as so self centred and self important.

Really? And what of those willing to risk the lives of strangers? Is that ok? If you can't wear a mask then why not do everything else in your power to keep others safe - stay well away from other people, etc? I'll wear a mask all day at work despite having oxygen sats of below 90% because I would not want to put anyone else's life at risk. I'll stay over two metres away, I won't wear any jewellery below my elbows so that I can properly wash or sanitise my hands. I could not live with myself if I thought I could have caught it and passed it on to anyone else.

Who is to say people don’t do everything else just because they can’t wear a mask?

As we have done all along most people are still going to be keeping more than 2m away. Infact I have noticed that those in the supermarkets with the masks on seem more likely to get too close to others.

And being able to work all day with sats under 90 isn’t something to be proud of. Infact unless your exaggerating (which given in most hospitals that would be the point you where put on oxygen I am guessing you are) then putting yourself at such risk is nothing short of stupid.

YANBU. There needs to be more publicity given to the fact that some people ARE exempt for genuine reasons. And do not need to have things made harder for them. But I do partly blame the loudmouths who go around saying 'why should I have to wear a mask to protect others, it's against my rights, etc.' I don't have a problem with wearing a mask myself, but a parallel in my own life is that I have co-ordination difficulties, which, among other things, make me unable to stand safely in a moving vehicle. As I don't look obviously disabled, I have had problems with people giving me nasty looks and comments if I don't give up my seat to people who are older than me. I find that really upsetting; but again, the problem is exacerbated by all the people who take the attitude, 'why should I have to give up my seat; I was here first; it's my rights'. So in all these cases, people who refuse to do things out of pure bloody-mindedness make it more difficult for people who have genuine problems with doing these things. Certainly, the government and media, when recommending masks, should also make it clear that some people can't wear them.

And being able to work all day with sats under 90 isn’t something to be proud of. Infact unless your exaggerating (which given in most hospitals that would be the point you where put on oxygen I am guessing you are) then putting yourself at such risk is nothing short of stupid.

I wish I was exaggerating. It's chronic. Low sats, plus carbon dioxide retention. Awaiting investigation but all pushed back, ironically due to Covid. Having respiratory physio over WhatsApp currently. I developed heart failure last year following a big GI bleed and this is one of the effects.