Group chats getting out of hand

[CharDee]

God, this is so unnecessarily long and so ridiculous but I think I just need some reassurance that I’m not crazy to be bothered by this.

I am in a few family group chats on WhatsApp. With my family I have one with my immediate family so parents, siblings and their OH’s, one with just me and my siblings. This is fine and manageable. The siblings chat is usually only ever used if we’re planning presents for our parents and everything else e.g. updates on dc or just general chat goes in our family chat. My brother lives abroad so it’s nice to all chat with him and SIL and share photos.

DH’s family on the other hand is something else. He has a sister and BiL as well as another brother, his wife and their children who live down south. With them we have the following group chats:
⁃ All the family (PILs, SIL and her DH, BIL and DW, me and DH)
⁃ Local family (all of the above apart from BIL and DW)
⁃ Updates on Coronavirus (local family)
⁃ Updates on DS (about our son which is just for local family)
⁃ Sibling chat with SIL, her Dh and me
⁃ Just DH and SIL
⁃ Updates on DN (about SIL’s son which is for all family)
⁃ Shopping (local family)
⁃ Food (local family)
⁃ Updates for all the children (shared with all family)

I hardly speak in them unless asked a question or if I have to tell someone something. All of these chats were made by SIL who has some control issues which I’ve spoken in here about before.

Anyway last night it came to a bit of a head. DH shared a photo in the group of all the family of DS. BIL replied and asked me something, I replied and asked SiL a question about DN. She then responded in the “updates for all children” chat reminding me and DH that this was the group from discussing children. DH just replied and said that it was easier to just talk in chats and not compartmentalise every conversation. SIL replied that it was easier for her to keep track of everything we were talking about if everyone just stuck to the groups. I carried on the conversation with BIL in the original group as normal and was then sent messages from SIL asking me to just follow the group chat agreements (?) this will then make sure she can keep track of everything that is being said. I had to reply telling her that it was not up to her to police our conversations and that I will talk about whatever I want with who I want. She replied saying that she was just trying to make sure everyone followed the correct chats and I just replied telling her she was not a moderator of our chats and that this was just another way for her to attempt to be in control and I wasn’t going to put up with this kind of shit any more.

I removed myself from the other ridiculous chats such as food (where she updates us with pictures of food they eat and asks us what we’re eating), shopping (where she tells is what she has been buying and shares discounts), COVID updates (where her and her husband share links to news about it) and the rest of them but stayed in the one of the whole family.

SIL sent a message to that group basically calling me out for trying to take over chats and said that she would no longer be participating in family group chats. I replied to say that this wasn’t true and that I was happy to talk to the family but felt that having so many different chats was excessive and pointless when it was easy enough to have a group conversation in one place. I also said about her attempts to police chats being ridiculous. DH backed me up and said that he felt that it was silly to be talking in a chat and then change to a different one if we want to have a conversation about another topic and that everything he would share in the other groups he would share with everyone so didn’t see the point in having different groups. SIL then removed herself from the group and hasn’t spoken since.

Of course DH got a phone call from his mum asking him to apologise to SIL for both me and him. He asked her what we’d done wrong and she said that we (meaning me) had over reacted to what she was saying and she was really only trying to keep everyone talking. DH said that he thought the whole thing was just a pointless argument over nothing at all and didn’t see what we had to apologise for. He asked mil if maybe she would like to discuss SIL’s control issues with her as he is worried about that need to be in charge has got so bad that she feels she needs to police family group chats on WhatsApp. MIL said that SIL wasn’t the problem here and that they’d be waiting when DH and I were ready to make amends.

I’m not surprised that mil has got involved. I think I may have over reacted slightly but years of anger about SIL needing to be in control of everything or make things about her for no reason other than someone else getting attention have obviously built up! I am low contact with her anyway but feel like I just want to be done with her. I love DN though and she wouldn’t allow me to see him if I stopped talking to her or if I didn’t apologise.

Was I being completely unreasonable to say I was done with this shit and to refuse to apologise? Or is it best to just be the bigger person, apologise and move on? The whole thing seems so high school and trivial so maybe it's just lockdown getting to me!

SIL wants to be the matriarch and clearly has zero life outside her own family! She is insane as well as controlling...

Them waiting for your apology would bring out my inner teenager and like fuck would I be apologizing to them. Actually, I don't think you can apologize without going back to this insane system again as this issue will just reoccur again and again. Now you have taken a stand I think you have to stick to it. One group only. If they refuse to talk to you on it, make a group without SiL and MiL and talk to them instead. I bet SiL and MiL get their heads out of their arses pretty quickly if they think you are all chatting without them.

It doesn't hurt just to follow what she wants if it makes her feel better.

Give over, if SIL has issues then it's her responsibility not to allow that to impact on others and her family certainly shouldn't be enabling her. And she certainly shouldn't be demanding apologies if others choose not to tolerate the effect her batshittery behaviours cause them.

Blimey, I really couldn't be bothered with all that many groups.

Sounds crazy! Lots of my friends seem to have loads of whatsapp group chats with various friends/family. Would do my head in to be honest! Constant beeping of notifications on my phone - no ta. I have no whatsapp groups I just use that and FB messenger to chat to individual people instead of texting. I need my personal space! I'd leave all the groups and leave them to it!

My DC are mid twenties. Once they left home I made it very clear that if they argued (and of course they sometimes do) I didn’t want to be called in to take sides. They have to sort it out between themselves and not involve me. Your MIL should adopt the same policy.

Completely batshit. You did the right thing.

All the different groups reminds me slightly of a couple I once met where the husband insisted on different bank accounts for different expenditure, with a certain amount allotted to each per month. It meant they sometimes had money to go out to dinner but not to do more supermarket shopping

I second the idea upthread to start a counselling group and link to various articles about her deranged ways. I'd simply say, I am sorry you are upset by this, but the way you micromanage everything isn't for everyone. It doesn't work for us, and by the way youve reacted I'm not too sure it works for you either. I don't wish to fall out over this (even if you do), but I'm sure you can understand different methods work for different people.

It needs a politicians non-apology......

"I am sorry if my response made you feel that the number of WhatsApp groups is excessive. It is clearly up to each individual how many groups they wish create. That individual may wish to recommend how those groups are used but other members may wish to exercise their own individual thought processes when messaging on said application"

Hoestly, going from your OP only (no knowledge of backstory), it sounds like you overreacted massively.

She sounds a bit annoying and over-organised. You had a full on tantrum, swore and shouted at her.

The thing is, you've all allowed these multiple chats categories to be set up. You or DH could just have declined to join them and said 'I'd rather stick with just the one, or these two, thanks'. Instead you've allowed all this to develop, to annoy you and then, instead of calmly suggesting a slimming down of the unmanageable number of groups, you've gone off like a rocket - and let SIL know exactly how much you dislike her.

Well done you, eh?

@CharDee Did you have a thread about SIL wanting to keep the sex of her baby from you? It's ringing a bell.
She sounds horrendously controlling.

My family does have separate conversation threads on Facebook, i.e. just me and sister 1, just me and sister 2, just me and my mum (I assume they also have private ones I am not in). And then all the combinations of us in threes and one altogether.

But they aren't about specific topics; it is just so e.g. two people can talk about something they don't want to tell the others about.

Me and sister 1 do get annoyed when my mum and sister 2 ramble on in the family conversation thread (i.e. the one with all 4 of us in) about something we are not interested in when they could easily switch to their own thread so it doesn't fill up the other one and we have to scroll back and read it all to make sure we haven't missed anything relevant.

But I don't think that is the same as requiring people to speak about different topics in different threads, so YANBU.

YANBU

I'm impressed though. It's not often that an OP stands up for themselves AND the husband stands up for his wife.

I had a straw that broke the camel's back moment with my in-laws. No regrets.

OP I'm desperate to hear more about the holiday from hell with her, please!!!!

@SecondStarFromTheRight that was me yes! She calmed down slightly and decided to include me but I haven't been overly friendly with her since and most of our communication has gone through DH. DH is still annoyed at her as she never actually apologised and neither did MiL. It's not something I've dwelled on though and was happy to just let it go for an easier life.

She is absolutely insane
One of my friends opens a new whatsapp chat for every night out/gathering and it drives me nuts. It’s generally the same people everytime but it’s different groups of her friends (which I know she has existing chats for) so always end up in a chat with people I don’t know that well, talking about why they can’t go!!

@Very I couldn't possibly tell you everything about the holiday but here are a few events

1. The journey there

She decided we only needed 2 cars. Car 1 was her, BIL and their 2 dogs in the back. Car 2 was FIL driving, MIL, and then in the back me, DH and DS in his car seat. I get travel sick sometimes and have had to pull over on the motorway in the past so said we'd just drive ourselves and also didn't fancy 6 hours squashed. PIL's refused to accept we'd be driving so turned up anyway at ours as we were getting in our car. DH said thanks but no thanks and FIL was confused as he'd just spoken to SIL who had told him we wanted picking up.

Anyway, we all went on our way and met up at the 1st service station. SIL had arrived first and was fuming when we pulled up in our car as she had planned where we were all parking at the cottage and hadn't factored in the extra car. DH just said that we'd sort it when we got there and there was loads of space so it didn't matter. She said she'd update him on the parking plan at the next service station - oh yeah she'd printed off maps telling us when we were stopping and for how long. DS and I ended up falling asleep in the car so DH decided not to stop and left MIL a voicemail telling her we were carrying on and not to wait there for us.

I was woken up by SiL shouting down the phone about how she had planned stops for everyone and that we weren't to go in the cottage and speak to the air b&b host without her. I should add here that BIL (who lives nearby) was the one who had booked this cottage so I guess that she wasn't happy about someone else organising. She was really annoyed that we had gone out of our way to get a head start and that we were obviously going to get the better parking space. DH told her he didn't care about the parking and said we weren't going to sit outside. All we needed to do was go in and get the keys as all the other info had been emailed so it wasn't like we were getting a safety tour or anything!

Then we hit traffic, there'd been a crash. I text MIL and bil to let him know as SIL and FIL
were driving and said we were coming off a different exit and going an alternative route. SIL called and said we should stay in the traffic and they'll go the other route that way we should al arrive at the same time. I just laughed and said that was funny, imagine someone seriously suggesting that we keep a 2 year old stuck in a hot car in traffic for no reason and cheerily said we'd see them when they arrived.

1. The food (SIL A is crazy SIL and SIL B is the one married to DH's brother)

BIL and SIL B arrived the next day with their newborn and older children. SIL B is vegan and has been for years so this wasn't new. For some batshit reason, when ordering the food from Asda for a barbecue SIL A didn't include any vegan options. Literally just loads of meat and cheese, potatoes with cheese in, pizza and other stuff that wasn't vegan, but there was salad as SIL A kindly pointed out. I popped to the shop so that SIL B, who was breastfeeding a 3 week old, would have something to eat. I got some vegan cheese, sweet potatoes and some veggie burgers. I got back and started to cook when SiL A came and took over. I just left her to it and got myself a drink. She then shouted me back to the kitchen and had a go at me for not getting oil and said she had to use the fat from the sausages as oil to cook SIL B's food.
The food didn't need oil or anything but I had got some frylight to use which SiL chose to ignore.

So I went and got DH to drive SiL B to the nearest takeaway so she could pick whatever she wanted. She cried in the car and said she felt so embarrassed that everyone had to go to this trouble. DH just said she didn't need to be and that the only person who should be embarrassed was SIL A. SIL A refused to apologise for not thinking of SiL B when ordering food, even though we all split the cost of the order between us or for needlessly ruining the food I had gone out to get.

1. The shower timetable

There was an en-suite room which BIL and SIL B had for 2 nights as it was bigger and could fit the extra beds and cot in for the dc. There was also a wet room downstairs, a bathroom with a bath and shower upstairs and a shower room. FIL suggested that DH and I use the bathroom with the bath and shower for bathing DS , he and MIL would use the wet room and SIL A and BIL could use the other shower room. That made sense. SIL however decided this was unfair as she thought that over the 4 days we should all rotate bathrooms so drew up a timetable with allocated 20 min slots for everyone. Nobody else thought this was a good idea so we stuck with FiL's plan. She was sulking over this for the first few hours we were there. I bathed DS while FIL and DH went to get a takeaway. Then I jumped in the shower when DS was asleep. She hammered on the door and shouted through that DH was back with the food and I needed to get out the shower. I take quick showers anyway and I only wanted to freshen up after being in the car. I got out and she was still hammering saying this was why we needed a timetable as everyone else was waiting for me and I was rude to keep them waiting. I opened the door and told her to stop making so much noise as DS was asleep and I was happy for everyone to start without me but I would be down in 2 mins.
She stomped down the stairs calling me selfish saying how hungry she was. I walked down after getting dressed to find DH had just walked in with the food so she had clearly made up they were back for god knows what reason.

1. The eating timetable

She drew up a timetable around the dogs eating so that we would all have our meals at the same time as them, she had also allocated snack times for when the dogs were out on their walks (coinciding with the dog walk schedule between her and bil). DH shut this down immediately and said that DS will eat at his normal time as it fits around his naps.

There was so much more. We got home and DH booked a holiday to make up for the non holiday we'd just had!

A shower timetable

She is insane. Poor SIL B

Wow that is utterly BATSHIT

Your last update Fucking hell. She’s crazy, absolutely bat shit crazy.

Haha DH has just reminded me - she sent us all an email with "suggested items of clothes" to wear as she was worried that wearing low cut tops would be inappropriate. This was probably directed at me as DH tends to not wear low cut tops but I think I've honestly worn revealing clothes maybe twice since I've known her.

When I got out the shower I threw one of DH's tops on so I could open the door and tell her to stop banging on the door and she said before stomping off "You'd better be putting more clothes on." DH said I should have came down in my towel.

How the fuck have I kept it together this long?!!

Oh wow.

Oh double wow.

Bloody hell, does SIL take minutes too? That would drive me insane, the woman must be seriously bored and be seriously controlling. Let her boo hoo - absolutely ridiculous behaviour!

Utterly batshit!!!

Your vegan SIL will be so relieved that you can have discussions and meet ups without crazy SIL being involved anymore.

She sounds like hard work OP! I probably would have left that holiday on the first night at the hint of her carry on. I'm glad your husband is on your side. I'd be seriously considering telling them to fuck off, who really needs that bullshit in their lives? Life is hard enough as it is.