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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

To report this person to their employer for hate speech?

573 replies

NickMyLipple · 03/07/2020 20:39

I've attached a screenshot - I am not friends with this person. She does however display her work on social media and she is in her uniform with her lanyard on display in her profile picture and in other photos which are accessible to the public.

It's NHS Values Week and I feel very strongly that if you're going to publically display your workplace you need to be responsible in not making such racist and hateful comments.

I called her out on it and the post has now been deleted.

AIBU to call the HR department and complain, or should I leave it and hope that she thinks carefully before she posts in future?

To report this person to their employer for hate speech?
OP posts:
mum2b2017 · 04/07/2020 11:20

TBH I couldnt care less if this woman lost her job. A verbal warning and diversity course should be the least of her worries

KitKat2020 · 04/07/2020 11:23

If it’s not a crime why is it down to individuals to start dishing out their own style of social justice?

The employer can investigate the matter. The OP isn’t the employer, so can’t dish anything out.

Professional codes of conduct are not a new thing, nor is anti- discriminatory practice.

Conduct is the key word here, it relates to behaviour- i.e. actions and words.

ClareBlue · 04/07/2020 11:39

Why do those who are saying don't report because she will loose her job etc think she will loose her job?
If she lost her job it would be because the NHS do not want people working for them who make an assumption on someone's legal status based on the colour of their skin and think that a way to deal with potential law breaking is to aggressively expel someone from the Country before their status is even established, based on their skin colour. They are prepared to put this view in a public forum and visibly show what organisation she worked for when holding these views. As she works for an organization that interacts with all communities there is a serious issue in her assumption that anyone of Asian heritage has no legal status in Britain. She holds these views irrespective of it being reported or not. This is not just an out of work opinion, it is a post that shows deeply held racist views and absolutely should be reported. This is why even 3rd generation Asians still get shouted at to go back to their own Country.
Her judgement is so poor that she posts this racist crap in a public forum and does it in a manner that identifies her work place.
If it's just an opinion then the NHS will understand, I'm sure.
I find the apologists citing freedom of thinking really depressing. Normalising aggresive racist posts and saying consequences are disproportionate, WTAF

LadyGAgain · 04/07/2020 11:43

Well said @ClareBlue

StillCoughingandLaughing · 04/07/2020 11:43

And actually you’d be surprised at the court cases that are on going at the moment where ex employees are taking their employers to court over being sacked because of wrong think.

Well, surely this woman can do the same if she gets the sack?

GreytExpectations · 04/07/2020 11:51

And how on earth would you know that? Are you their employee?

Well if I was there employee, then I'd have no power over them. Think the term you are looking for is employer Wink

Also, it's obviously assumed based of similar situations in other workplaces that I am aware of due to being close to the people involved.

Broomfondle · 04/07/2020 11:52

I agree that anti-racism efforts need to be organisation wide and that it’s never enough to just cherry pick the obviously bad eggs. But that doesn’t mean we should turn a blind eye to the people who clearly show themselves to be racists either

I don't agree anyone should turn a blind eye in this case, she should be reported to her employer.

Racism should be challenged and efforts made to reduce it everywhere, to reduce prejudice at it's source. But at the same time you can't depend on a whole workforce having no prejudices as a means for patients to receive best treatment. You need to have a stronger ethical position than that which is that you treat people equally and with respect even if you hold those prejudices.
Otherwise you get into the territory of controlling how people think not how they act.
I don't think anyone would suggest a surgeon has to eliminate all negative views about (for example) a paedophile before they operate on one, but they do have to eliminate any way those views would affect their treatment of them.
Organisations and individuals should address biases against BAME people, women, those with mental health issues etc so there's less to overcome in the first place. But remember a HCP is going to have to treat a neonazi with professionalism too if they're a patient. And for that reason you could argue should also be reported to their employer for saying something like 'all neonazis should be shot'.
Free speech and hate speech in general is one conversation but it is slightly different when we're talking about a HCP.

GreytExpectations · 04/07/2020 12:00

If it’s not a crime why is it down to individuals to start dishing out their own style of social justice?

It's not down to individuals, it's down to the employer which the have every right to. You seem to think the OP is in charge of the actions that take place after a woman chose to make a racist statement, thats not the case at all.

You are right, I don't agree with your attitude that being publicly racist is OK. But the truth is you really don't understand what free speech means nor are you responding to the concept that freedom of speech has never meant freedom of consequences.

Fluffytail1 · 04/07/2020 12:02

I suppose it really depends on whether you like/dislike her really doesn’t it? If you kinda liked her you wouldn’t report it. But if she was a complete cow then you would. !

R1R2 · 04/07/2020 12:04

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Duvetdoggy · 04/07/2020 12:07

What has liking her to do with it?
If you make a stand against racism then you make a stand.
I liked my colleague I reported .
I really think that if you have made a deliberate and conscious decision to be ant racist then liking the racist is completely irrelevant. And in fact often means that ierson gets away with it.

We all have that likeable relative with their casual racism but I now say something.

GreytExpectations · 04/07/2020 12:10

I mean if I liked someone and then saw them post something racist I don't think I'd like them anymore so not sure what your point is

academicallyblonde · 04/07/2020 12:15

I was going to say you should definitely report her until I saw that you’d confronted her and she’d taken the offending post down. Hopefully she’ll think before posting in future.

Nihiloxica · 04/07/2020 12:19

Any time you want to indulge your vindictiveness while feeling self-righteous, you should probably have a think.

GreytExpectations · 04/07/2020 12:23

@Nihiloxica

Any time you want to indulge your vindictiveness while feeling self-righteous, you should probably have a think.
Anytime you want to indulge your racist self while feeling entitled, you should probably consider the consequences.
AftonGlen · 04/07/2020 12:25

Agree @ClareBlue and @GreytExpectations

FlyingLoo · 04/07/2020 12:26

That post is so disgustingly racist it’s sickening. “Our country” ?? She can tell by the colour of his skin that this isn’t his country? Please report her op, her employers should be aware of the views she holds.

Nandakanda · 04/07/2020 12:26

This alleged "racist" is as entitled to air her views as the OP who assumes the moral high ground by lecturing us all and holding us to a standard of "racism" that did not really enter the public consciousness until about 40 years ago.

Do people have any idea how Maoist all this "calling people out" etc. actually sounds?

Perhaps the OP may be well advised to spend a few years in less enlightened parts of the world and see how she gets on with her notions of what is and isn't racist.

TooTrueToBeGood · 04/07/2020 12:27

Any time you want to indulge your vindictiveness while feeling self-righteous, you should probably have a think.

And any time you think someone is being vindictive and self-righteous, solely on the basis that you don't share their views, you should probably have a think too (and consult a dictionary).

ClareBlue · 04/07/2020 12:34

And still the apologists go on.
The post was not a nuanced theroetical discussion about the assimilation of different communities and the challenges that poses. It was a blatant racist post that reflected a deep held prejudice that anyone with Asian heritage has not legal status in Britain. It also offered an agressive draconian 'solution' to the problem based on a deep ingrained prejudice. These beliefs manifest their ugly head every day for certain sectors of the community. What would you say if this was a letter published in your local paper?
It's not ok that she took it down and that should be the end of it
It is not a mistake to post this, it is a public outing
Of course this is relevant to her employer who employ and treat all sectors of the community.
Nobody is saying thoughts should be policed. She published a blatant racist post that normalises and validates prejudice and identified the organisation that she represents on a daily basis.
I am beginning to understand some of those posts from the BAME community now on other threads

Duvetdoggy · 04/07/2020 12:38

I really cant believe the apologists either comparing ant racism to Maoist China. I only conclude that posters who do this are racist themselves. Reporting racism is not self righteous, it is unequivocally the right and only thing to do. Otherwise you are supporting racism which always results in the harming of humans.

Stressing · 04/07/2020 12:40

Mumsnet: Purging the world of evil one post at a time.

I like that font.

TheSmallAssassin · 04/07/2020 12:42

I think you should report her, she should be disciplined as it's against social media policy. She's unlikely to lose her job on the first offence and if it's not the first offence then she has had her warning. As others have said, given the poorer health outcomes for BAME people, racism in the NHS needs to be rooted out.

GreytExpectations · 04/07/2020 12:43

@Duvetdoggy

I really cant believe the apologists either comparing ant racism to Maoist China. I only conclude that posters who do this are racist themselves. Reporting racism is not self righteous, it is unequivocally the right and only thing to do. Otherwise you are supporting racism which always results in the harming of humans.
This! Can't believe someone actually made that comparison. And yes, if you are against racism being reported then you support racism, simple as that.
ClareBlue · 04/07/2020 12:44

And this isn't marginal misunderstood culture differences situation which we can work through with education etc. This is blatant racism. She must be a dumb fuck to post it and think nobody might take offense. I would seriously worry about her judgement at work if she thinks she can post that shit and not have consequences.