AIBU to think how men have got away with this for far to long

[Alex50]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-53064741

Why don’t they pay for their children and think it’s ok?

I will never understand why it's not tested like any other debt.
You don't pay your bills and your credit gets ruined and you get bailiffs at the door.
But the CMS is just a joke.

I'd like to see a USA model brought in.

This doesn’t surprise me at all.
My children are 16 and 20. Their dad has only paid consistently for 12 months.
We separated when my youngest was a newborn.

I know I’m far from the only one in this situation.

It’s worse if they are self-employed, as they can make it look like they earn significantly less than they do.

You forgot a word from your post. Let me fix it for you. AIBU to think how these men have got away with this for far too long.

There are many reasons why men don't pay and it's not all black and white.

I say that as a single mum for many years who didn't get a penny from my ex despite him seeing them eow.

I could have gone through CSA but he was dreadful with money and I knew it would made him even more stressed and depressed which would in turn impact on his relationship on his kids.

He then became self employed and I knew that getting anything through the CDA would just be a lot of stress for little coming in.

I found it easier and less stressful to budget everything with the certainty of what I earned even if at times, it meant being very right and having to do without some things.

I did it all for my kids and them only. They don't remember the things we missed out on (easily forgetable) but do have the memories of good times with their dad, and to me that was priceless.

As to him, he is the one who has to live with his conscience.

We as a society don't bother enforcing the obligations consistently and across the board. We don't fund organisations properly to do it and far too often paying nothing isn't seen as remotely taboo. I shall be watching this legal action with interest.

The CMS is an absolute disgrace (as are the dead-beats scumbags that refuse to pay to support their own children). The Government in this country does nothing to enforce child maintenance, and yet tax evaders are hunted down. I don't get it. We desperately need an American-style system that comes down heavily on the huge number of parents that clearly don't love their children enough to ensure they have food on the table and shoes on their feet. Fucking scum.

I've no personal axe to grind here, but have seen the desperation of single parents (mostly single mothers) when their partners simply walk away and then hide/deny/fiddle their incomes in order to literally take the food out of their children's mouths. They should be outcasts in our society, but they're not, and I don't know why. They should be imprisoned and their assets transferred to their children.

I would happily pay 50% of everything if my mad ex would let the kids live here half the time like they both want to.

But she won’t, and keeps prioritising her wants over theirs so every penny I have and more has gone on fighting her constant lies in court.

End result is I am too ill to work due to the stress and in massive debt because I am trying to achieve the result my children WANT.

Some men are twats and walk away from their kids and should pay their way.

Not all cases are equal, although she loves to tell everyone how I don’t contribute and how they need second hand clothes and the food bank while she leaves them with other people every weekend so she can comfort our with new hair, new nails, eat in restaurants, get pissed and spend £40 on a taxi home.

Two sides to every story

They justify it by saying that the money they pay for the children, actually goes to the mothers and the refuse to pay for the mothers hair/nails/beauty day/ shopping, whatever pisses them off the most.

It’s a last fuck you to the woman who they used to love

@Givenupno

How about instead of prioritising what you want, you pay your CM instead of constantly taking her to court for access

Its shocking. When i rang CMS the bloke on the phone was awful and told me to sort it out myself. I had been ! Hence why I rang them.. i was left wondering, well what are yous for then?
Now I'm left with getting £10 per week from ex (if I'm lucky) I just couldn't be bothered with the shit anymore.
I agree it should be classed as a real debt, they will happy chase you for any other debt but not for mothers raising children on their own.

*How about instead of prioritising what you want, you pay your CM instead of constantly taking her to court for access$

Yeah, this.

The government could sort this out and put systems in place to ensure its paid. Lots of other countries do.

But they don’t want to.

My father paid $30 a month for 3 kids (in the 90’s) and paid for maybe year if that.
Turns out he still owes that money and has be refused exit of home country until he pays off his debt (and it’s been accumulating interest for the last 34 years)

His retirement fund has apparently now been garnished to pay for his debt.

I hope mum enjoys a bit extra after struggling and working hard to provide for her kids alone.

Ummm surely you meant to say men and women? It's not just Dad's that don't pay - there are a fair amount of deadbeat Mum's too.

I can’t see how it would be that difficult to put a system in place to make men pay towards their children. They might think twice before starting another family. I know not all men, my husband of 30 years has always put himself last and his family first, I am very lucky.

Givenupno you need to stop taking her to court, and contribute the money to your children through your ex.

No ifs or buts.

Also, there are two sides to some stories, not all stories.

People who don’t pay for their kids - even to the level of the bare minimum the CSA requests (and it’s barely more than a request) - don’t get to have a side to the story.

I don’t have an axe to grind either as I don’t use the CSA - maintenance is part of the court order that was made on divorce.

@NCforsafety if you read the article 90% of single parents are women, so not all are men but the majority are.

NCforsafety - you know it’s mostly men to the extent that it’s safe to say “men”. Very few women make up part of this group.

Sexism / the patriarchy is part of the reason maintenance isn’t enforced properly and so it’s important to refer to this group of non payers as men. Women NRPs (non resident mothers) who don’t pay would be caught by an improved system too of course.

The CMS was setup (via the CSA) by the 1980s Tories as a mechanism to stop women suing men in court for child maintenance.

They got away with it by a deluge of Daily Mail stories about single mothers living the life of riley on benefits after deliberately getting pregnant by deadbeat dads. It was a sure-fire vote winner. With the benefits bill shrunk as the amount a father should pay was deducted from the eligible amount.

That's a broad brush picture, but I don't think I've missed too much ?

Really the CMS should be scrapped, and women just free to sue in court for child maintenance and use the tools that any other debtor would have of seizing property, garnishee orders, and getting the lads around with baseball bats (I may have made one of those up).

Alternatively, stop electing misogynists.

I really don't understand why the UK isn't tougher on this. You'd think the government would want to save money on benefits, even if they couldn't be bothered to do it just because it's the right thing to do.

In much of the US if you don't pay your child support the government can directly take it out of your paycheck so you have no choice. They can freeze your bank accounts and suspend your driver's license, and non-payment does show up on your credit report.

Also the amount you pay is not directly related to visitation. Even if custody is 50-50, the parent who earns more money still pays child support.

At least, this is how it is in New York (where I'm originally from) it does vary by state.

I have been banging on about this for a while now. CMS have a policy not to enforce currently. I am escalating through their complaints procedure. My Tory MP sent me a load of waffle as to why it's basically a low priority. I am looking to my local Labour Party constituency party for support in raising now and they are consulting the local executive to see how to raise the issue through the best forum.
It's a disgrace that in normal times it's seen as acceptable not to pay and in these times it's being treated as an excuse to not pay for many even if their income hasn't changed or dropped by the required amount. It should be treated like any other debt and go on credit records and be socially embarrassing and unacceptable to not pay.

Why are people surprised? I was told by the cms that despite my ex being on UC he doesn't have to pay ANY maintenance because he has "priority debts" so I don't receive a penny . He's allowed to not pay.

I don’t like a lot of what America does but child maintenance is one thing they do right

You pay your bill or you face jail time

The system in this country is set up to let men get away with it. We live in a society where many people look down their noses at single mothers, but there is no open condemnation of men that don't support their children financially. These men always have an excuse and there are always apologists that will back them up in their bullshit.
As a society, it seems we would rather let men get away with not supporting their children and allow the mothers and taxpayers (in the form of benefits and tax credits) to pick up the pieces.

There are many reasons why men don't pay

Please tell us some of them @dontdisturbmenow