AIBU by not being convinced about moving to Ireland?

[Shedbuilder]

My partner's grandparents were born in Ireland and so she's been able to obtain an Irish passport. I'm English. We're very pro-EU and horrified by Brexit and we hate the current government and direction the UK is taking. We're wondering about putting our money where our mouths are and moving to Ireland. Our parents are all dead, we don't have children, we're on good terms, but not particularly close, to our siblings and their families. We'd plan to come back and visit friends and family in the UK several times a year and we've factored in the cost of doing that.

It would suit my partner well. She's very gregarious, she has the blarney and she also has some family over there already. I wouldn't know anyone. I also worry about what it would be like to be noticeably English in Ireland. I'm not at all posh but I sound a bit Radio 4.

I'm concerned that my partner has some pretty romantic ideas about Ireland. She expects it to be so much better than England. She's just been ranting at the far righters Nazi-saluting at the cenotaph and saying proudly that it wouldn't happen in Ireland. I made the mistake of replying no, it wouldn't happen in Ireland because Ireland stayed neutral during WW2 and then for years persecuted and scapegoated the Irish men and women who volunteered to fight Hitler. That didn't go down well.

The area we would be looking at is probably somewhere within a five-mile radius of Enniscorthy and within relatively easy reach of Wexford and Dublin. Also close to the Rosslare ferry and the coast. The property in that area seems excellent value for money: currently looking at a spacious 4-year-old four-bedroom house on an acre, well away from neighbours, and with a separate double garage and a barn for under £300,000.

We know we'll have to have private medical insurance. We know that we'll have a lot of learning to do and that the chances are I'll be an outsider for the rest of my life. As a lesbian I'm used to that. I'm also aware that Ireland has its own issues around transgender and women's rights, but they seem no worse than they are here.

So tell me, would you move to Ireland if you could?

[quote clipclop5]@Evanna13 I completely understand your view. It is the same for me even though I’ve lived here my entire life. I detest the politics of this place and wish people would grow up and get over it.
If you ever get the chance, come and visit the South Belfast Malone Rd area, Holywood or Hillsborough. They are some of the nicest, most cosmopolitan areas of NI, where people don’t feel the need to whip out a flag every 5 seconds.[/quote]
clipclop I will, I would love to travel more in NI. I did not mean to offend anyone with my comments, I would be delighted to see a move away from the politics there. I know there are many lovely people in NI too.

I'm English, I've lived in Dublin for 16 years. One or two comments about brits over the years, but generally because I am accepted and people have forgotten I'm actually English. People are tolerant and kind here, they don't care if you're English. They just judge you as they find you.

Enniscorthy is nice and Wexford town. I really like Gorey.

I'd be lying if I said nobody would take the piss and slag an English person, my English cousin's take an awful slagging at a family wedding, there is no harm meant tbf they're very proud of their Irishness so realise it is in jest but it happens.

and the idea that Irish ex service people were ' persecuted' arises from that offensive lie Probably from people like this speaking out too
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16287211

@MrMorrisReturns - Probably from people like this speaking out too
And the British government would have been so understanding if it was their soldiers who had deserted? Those men deserted the Irish Army in order to join the British army. If they had deserted the British army, they would have been court marshalled and shot. Instead, they were formally dismissed from the Irish army, stripped of all pay and pension rights, and banned for seven years from any employment paid for by state or government funds. It seems to me t that it was a moderate punishment for desertion.

To fight the greatest fascist threat the world had seen? To prevent a genocidal regime that was sweeping through mainland Europe? That murdered millions?

There's never just the one perspective, is there?

Yeah, shedbuilder don’t come to live here. We’re not getting good vibes off you.

To fight the greatest fascist threat the world had seen? To prevent a genocidal regime that was sweeping through mainland Europe? That murdered millions? ODFOD your cloak has dropped put away your dagger and stay were you are.

I've lived a lot of places. Moved to Ireland a couple of years ago, settled in easily - we were looking for a largely English speaking European country (tax n stuff), and Ireland ticked enough of the boxes to give it a go.

I live a fairly standard life - 2 kids in primary, shopping, we just bought a house a bit south of Dublin, and I've not run into any issues at all from being English (at least that I've noticed!). Good things are that Dublin is a capital, but quite small, so within 30 minutes (OK, a bit more at the wrong time of day!) you're in the mountains, or at the airport. Every housing estate has green sections, there's bike paths and parks, and it's just so green and pretty. I would say that it's better set up for living - in that when we lived closer into Dublin, I was within 10 mins drive of multiple small shopping centres, all with supermarket, or within 30 mins walk of 2, and 10 mins of a corner shop etc. It's more evenly spread than most places in the UK (and many other places I've lived).

I wouldn't say there was anything terrible here, or at least no more terrible than other places - paying to see the doctor was a bit of an adjustment, paying for schoolbooks, paying for separate rubbish pickup, and that some services are a little behind on the whole digital self-service, but really nothing major at all. Oh, It's very windy, drivers are terrible middle-lane sitters, and sometimes overly polite - eg stopping on a roundabout to let people out. But if that's the worst I can think of, it's clearly a pretty nice place!

Be aware that a rural property might be on well water, septic tank and oil-fired heating - it's very common here, and you need to know what you're getting yourself into with it all!

Thanks, Treestumps. I guess you're describing what I'd hoped for. I love smaller capital cities. Love being in Cardiff or Belfast or Edinburgh and being able to see the hills or the sea from close to the centre of the city. I've lived on well-water and without gas and mains drainage for much of my life so not a problem for me. If middle-lane-sitters are the worst thing you can think of, that's pretty impressive. I hope you and your family have a good life there.

@Shedbuilder - To fight the greatest fascist threat the world had seen? To prevent a genocidal regime that was sweeping through mainland Europe? That murdered millions?

Firstly, you are using hindsight to view the war. Nobody knew about the concentration camps at that stage. Secondly, you are suggesting that we should have joined with a country who had committed genocide in Ireland (the famine was genocide) as well as the atrocities such as the black and tans and bloody Sunday perpetrated in the decades prior to the war, and committed atrocities in many other countries who suffered from British imperialism? Thirdly, desertion is desertion, no matter what the motive. The USA, while still neutral, had a law making it illegal for their citizens to join the British (or other) forces. The British don't whinge about that. However, Ireland refused to kow tow to the British, whom we had suffered under for centuries and from whom we had only recently gained independence and ye're still complaining about it 90 years later. And yes, I have heard other English (it's always English) people still going on about it.

You really do epitomise the British imperial imperialistic attitude that we dislike so much here in Ireland.

OP, in Ireland and honestly don't care where anyone is from as long as they're not dickheads. Coming over with an attitude and making jokes like 'don't we still own part of you guys, why don't you ever thank us for teaching you English, aren't your old ways quaint' and stuff means you won't be well received. It's your attitude that would hold you back, nothing else.

Also, never mind who was being fought, it was seen as taking up arms and joining our oppressors. I'm saying that as someone who has relatives who served in the British army during world war two.

Yeah, my dad fought alongside some Irish men. He thought they'd done a brave thing. His dad had gone to fight the fascists in Spain. As I said, different perspectives.

Please, please point out to me where I've said this:

Coming over with an attitude and making jokes like 'don't we still own part of you guys, why don't you ever thank us for teaching you English, aren't your old ways quaint' and stuff

His dad had gone to fight the fascists in Spain.

Had his father deserted from the British army in order to fight in Spain?

Do you really think the British government would have been accepting of someone deserting to join another army? Do you think it would be acceptable for a British soldier to desert and join the Iraqi army, for example, today? If not, why not? And why is that different?

I mean attitude in general. They are the most obvious 'jokes' people try and make here. Just don't be an arse and you'd be grand.

@RuggerHug - I mean attitude in general.

Exactly. Although as she doesn't seem to see a problem with her attitude, changing it so she's not an arse may be problematic

Thanks for clarifying that, RuggerHug.

Thanks, Blackhawkdown. We're the volunteering type, so while we don't have children and don't go to church we would hope to be able to get involved in other ways.

@Shedbuilder

Allowing citizens to join a foreign army is problematic. Irishmen did go over to fight in the Spanish Civil war but ..... not all fought against the fascists. Some joined to fight for Franco!

This relates to stances in the Irish Civil war. Irish politics during that period was so much more nuanced than first meets the eye. I studied it at school and it melted my head. Look up the 9 years war.

The deserters weren’t stripped of Citizenship, as can happen elsewhere, but they were not treated well. You can’t expect to be received well after joining the army of a country that has oppressed yours for hundreds of years. I think an other element was that it was seen as selfish and greedy. They would have been paid a wage, while the majority of the population were very poor( due to the above).

Incidentally, Ireland did know Jewish people were being persecuted even before the war. Child refugees fleeing persecution were welcomed by DeValera. He now has a statue in Israel recognising the work he did to keep Jewish people safe.

Unofficially, Ireland did help the UK by allowing planes to pass over and helping soldiers go back over if they crashed. Germans were not offered the same hospitality and were kept.

The island of Ireland would have been a lovely strategic gift to enemy forces has they got involved in WW2. Would have been counterproductive to the fight against fascism. The policy of neutrality was not a bad idea.

Anyhooos.... have you been to Cork? It’s a bit further than Wexford but better weather. if you like cities like Cardiff, it’s worth checking out.

Im irish and i agree with you. If moving to another part of uk doesnt fill her with adventure then it's possible she is romantacising it.

I moved back here and that was right forme, but i have to put the rubbish out. I pay tax.

And while i occasionally got people trying to pigeon hole me in england, the same would occasionally happen to an english person here no doubt.

Unofficially, Ireland did help the UK by allowing planes to pass over and helping soldiers go back over if they crashed. Germans were not offered the same hospitality and were kept.

A policy referred to as biased neutrality. Guests of the State is an excellent book that covers how anyone who crash landed in Ireland was treated. Interestingly, the brits sent an raf pilot who escaped from Ireland back as they thought it wise not to upset a neutral nation.

I go over a lot, with an English friend - Galway, and Dublin a bit lately and always have great fun. One of my best mates lives there (Irish, plus teaches Irish so not politically neutral). Cons are, according to her, things are expensive (WiFi etc) and weather.

Pros are a great place to do business, pubs pubs and more pubs, great food (much better than here) loads of arts of all types, and I really like Irish people as a whole (dads from Dublin so it's sort of familiar).

But I'm pretty sure the Irish get fucking sick of living in some big theme park/stereotype (my great grandfathers from Ireland so I'm Irish even though this is the first time I've left America). I lived in Notting hill for years and it does get wearing.

And no matter how Irish your partner feels she isn't. Having said that it's an incredibly friendly and welcoming place and as long as you don't go starting conversations on politics you should be fine.

But everyone's different. Ireland in many ways has a much higher level of education than the UK so a lot of the people you'll meet will run rings around you verbally so just bear that in mind too.

I just enjoy it, and have a laugh, and as I'm with a local have had nothing but good times. I'd move there if it wasn't for the weather, and the shopping.

@LumaLou totally not being goady but interesting re the Jews. Cause Ireland seems so pro Palestine now! Which I really do not understand. Or is it just certain people? My friend and I can't even discuss it any more. I just take the piss out of her now which ends up with us both laughing. But I don't get it.