AIBU by not being convinced about moving to Ireland?

[Shedbuilder]

My partner's grandparents were born in Ireland and so she's been able to obtain an Irish passport. I'm English. We're very pro-EU and horrified by Brexit and we hate the current government and direction the UK is taking. We're wondering about putting our money where our mouths are and moving to Ireland. Our parents are all dead, we don't have children, we're on good terms, but not particularly close, to our siblings and their families. We'd plan to come back and visit friends and family in the UK several times a year and we've factored in the cost of doing that.

It would suit my partner well. She's very gregarious, she has the blarney and she also has some family over there already. I wouldn't know anyone. I also worry about what it would be like to be noticeably English in Ireland. I'm not at all posh but I sound a bit Radio 4.

I'm concerned that my partner has some pretty romantic ideas about Ireland. She expects it to be so much better than England. She's just been ranting at the far righters Nazi-saluting at the cenotaph and saying proudly that it wouldn't happen in Ireland. I made the mistake of replying no, it wouldn't happen in Ireland because Ireland stayed neutral during WW2 and then for years persecuted and scapegoated the Irish men and women who volunteered to fight Hitler. That didn't go down well.

The area we would be looking at is probably somewhere within a five-mile radius of Enniscorthy and within relatively easy reach of Wexford and Dublin. Also close to the Rosslare ferry and the coast. The property in that area seems excellent value for money: currently looking at a spacious 4-year-old four-bedroom house on an acre, well away from neighbours, and with a separate double garage and a barn for under £300,000.

We know we'll have to have private medical insurance. We know that we'll have a lot of learning to do and that the chances are I'll be an outsider for the rest of my life. As a lesbian I'm used to that. I'm also aware that Ireland has its own issues around transgender and women's rights, but they seem no worse than they are here.

So tell me, would you move to Ireland if you could?

Nobody will blink an eye at you being in a lesbian relationship.

I'm sorry, but that just is not true!

I think a lot of posts on this thread make good points about Ireland and I can see why the OP is making people spit nails.

But, no, honestly ... no way is Ireland relaxed about lesbians. There is absolutely no way my experience can be a total outlier. I work in Dublin; I work in a big, prestigious place. If there's casual homophobia there, you can be it's everywhere.

Last few places I've worked I have had colleagues who were lesbians, in long term relationships. No one batted an eye that I ever saw (I would have been the one to get the complaints, if there were any).

Can you speak to HR @SarahAndQuack it is not acceptable bigoted fools.
If you feel you can't speak to HR I'd address it as it happens.
I work with a gay lady she discusses her partner like the rest of us. I've 3 niece's one in UCD 1 in hairdressing/beauty 1 doing business they have many gays friends the younger generation are changing things.
I was surprised the vote for same sex marriage wasn't higher but overall the majority of the country voted for it.
Definitely discuss it with HR.

But there are lots of things people wouldn't complain about, that are still depressing.

I've not had anything I could 'complain' to someone in HR about, but it's still a depressing and disgusting amount of homophobia.

I can't report what happens outside work.

I could report the person who persistently fails to hear my when I say my partner is a woman, but what happens when they just say it was a mistake?

I could report HR when they presume my partner is a man, but again ... maybe it's just coincidence, huh?

I could report the young, vulnerable people under my care who make homophobic remarks, but it's my job to teach them.

Etc.

There are many reasons why people don't report homophobia. Doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Cross post (though I may have answered it!).

@EmeraldShamrock, I wish, but it's not easy. A woman from our (admittedly, notoriously crap) HR department recently ticked me off for denying I had a husband, and I was down on her paperwork as married. They have no clue.

My DH works in recruitment . He says it’s really hard for English to do well in most places of work in terms of climbing the career ladder. It’s very much an old boys network that looks after it’s own. So that would put me off.

I see what you mean when it is a passive aggressive dig it is hard to make a case. I'd reply with a sweet passive aggressive answer how said person must be stupid to be so forgetful.
Keep a record of all these incidents little snowballs will create an avalanche on them.

But it's not just passive aggressive digs. It's not trivial. It really matters, when HR are meant to use data about my marital status.

And I still don't see how you could keep track of bigotry outside work and get any useful change by talking to work?

I live in a rural village and can think offhand of at least 7 British families/individuals who have settled in so well here. They are completely involved in the school, GAA and other local activities.

Unfortunately we also have an extended English family who are quite vocal about coming to Ireland for the benefit system and just leach off the Irish state without ever doing days work or giving anything back to the community.

It's not trivial. It really matters, when HR are meant to use data about my marital status You need to challenge this speak to a solicitor for legal advice if necessary or the W.R.C.
And I still don't see how you could keep track of bigotry outside work and get any useful change by talking to work? Well
Know there's no point work has nothing to do with after hours.

I really appreciate you are trying to be helpful.

But this is a thread about whether or not someone wants to live in Ireland.

I don't. I do not in the least want to challenge this homophobia, still less risk my career by seeking legal advice I can't afford. I am not in a position to take this risk.

I am perfectly well aware that the homophobia outside work isn't something I can really challenge - that was why I pointed out that it had an effect.

If I can't work in Dublin, in a big, international company in Dublin, without feeling that being a lesbian is shameful, then it seems clear to me there's a problem for lesbians in Ireland. I think the UK is bad too, and I don't at all defend the UK, but I was still so shocked by my experiences of homophobia in Ireland.

That's shit my DD came to me at 9 to say she wanted to marry a women, now nearly 12 although never had a relationship she is gay.
If I was your colleague or in your company socially and I overheard it I'd challenge them.

Hello - I live about 30 minutes from Enniscorthy. Some really weird and unhelpful answers on here.

Being a lesbian - nobody cares. You might get one or two ribald comments, but probably not even that. There's also a ready-made community to plug into - probably worth checking before you come.

Nobody cares if your parents/grandparents are Irish - you'll just be regarded as English, but that's fine as long as you don't go round looking down your nose at people.

Enniscorthy - very provincial - many people will have lived there for generations and grown up together. You will feel like an outsider, and will probably find you have much more in common with other "blow-ins". There seem to be a lot of Roma there recently. Many people are still decent enough, and usually say hello/strike up a conversation which is nice. It freaks me out now when I go over to (London) and people don't say hello. Summer is beautiful but too short. Winter can be very miserable. The train journey from Enniscorthy to Dublin takes 2 hours and is very beautiful. Tickets about £6 one-way if you buy 5 - 6 days in advance.

Politics here are incredibly dull. I still can't tell the difference between Fine Gael and Fine Fail, although Leo Varadkar handled the covid situation very well. Parties are arrayed from centre to fairly hard left. No hard right to speak of. A large number of politicians (and civil servants) seem to fleece the system for a good living/pension, but the country would probably do just as well to open an EU office and let them run the place, as few big decisions seem to be made here (joke - sort of). Maybe that's just me. It's a bit corrupt, but at least there's a generous welfare system.

Police are very nice but don't do much. There's a terrible drug problem - visible all over central Dublin. Health service can be second rate and dangerous. People die occasionally.

It is beautiful although there are more and more motorways. I drive around Kilkenny, Wexford etc. which is a joy, although the litter strewn along the roadsides is shocking and very sad to see. Biggest surprise for me is it's bloody dirty.

Great if you've got a business - with an English accent you are slightly socially disadvantaged, and will be at the back of the queue for work unless you're a brain surgeon. People who used to live in the UK seem to miss the relative lack of corruption there.

Be prepared for a sense of dislocation which may last a few years if you come here. I suppose that depends on how shit the place you are in now is. Some absolutely love it, and yes, there are English (refugees -LOL) everywhere.

Hope that helps.

Way way too much overthinking going on here. Rent for six months and see how you get on.

You do realise that Ireland currently has an openly gay prime minister?

Definitely sounds like grounds for calling people out on it, Sarah. Particularly HR..ask them to explain their Equal Opportunities Policy to you.

On another note, our Taoiseach, who has received his share of homophobic insults, now has an approval rating of 75%!

My husband is English with a very much RP accent. He has lived here for the last 13 years. There are places in inner city Dublin where we used to live that he wouldn't walk down on his own due some of the people that live there.
We now live in a big town about an hour outside Dublin. He is involved with GAA , rugby, athletics in the town. He has had no problem climbing the career ladder in his job. He gets a slagging if we ever manage to beat England in the rugby but he says that he doesn't really get much anti-English reaction apart from the slagging.

My daughter who is 9 on the other hand was told in school that she was bad because she is half English and the English killed Michael Collins. I went into the school and asked the teacher to please ensure they were taught the proper version of history on that point.

English living here for 20 years. Only experienced anti English 3 times in all that time and one time was an English person rambling on in a pub and the others were both people on holiday in our town from the North and pissed up in a local pub. I travel all over the Country and work for the Irish Government and would say the coastal counties are more welcoming of non Irish than the Midland counties. I would never have a political discussion with a random, but this applies in UK too. You should read up on Irish history as it is never taught at English schools and it is nearly all tied up with British history. Certain professions are not really accessible for non Irish but construction and health definitely are. You will find loads of Irish have family in England are married to English people or have children born in England or studying there. Quality of life is subjective, but the air is cleaner, the schools generally better and it is generally less crowded and quieter. Don't let people say healthcare is rubbish. It is no worse than any healthcare system in a developed Country it is just funded to an extent at the point of use, but not exclusively. The biggest cost difference is insurance. 3 times as expensive as UK.

Just want to add that it was not the case that Ireland welcomed Jewish children before WW2.

Some Jewish people were allowed to flee to Ireland but only if they had converted to Catholicism. Some were personally aided to enter Ireland by the writer Hubert Butler who established a route in collaboration with Quaker rescuers, notably American Emma Cadbury, and set up a network of host families in Ireland.

After the war, a hundred or so Jewish children were allowed to settle in Ireland after the intervention of deValera overrode objections from foaming at the mouth anti-Semites such as Oliver J. Flanagan, TD, (FG) and his ilk. Ireland also took in German orphans and orphans of other nationalities.

Ireland held its first Holocaust Memorial Day in 2003, and on that occasion Michael McDowell apologised for a policy that had been “antipathetic, hostile and unfeeling” towards the Jews before and during WW2.

As you hate the UK so much - go. What’s stopping you? Surely anywhere is better than here ...

I am an English person living in Wales where there is a great reputation for English hating. It's just not true. What they hate is layabouts, flag wavers and people who are too arrogant to learn one word of Welsh.

I think the anti-English thing depends on where you go. I didn’t notice it in Dublin or Galway, but I did in Cork.

Question for those that keep bringing up that Ireland has a gay PM as a sign of tolerance (I’m guessing that’s what you’re implying)

Does that mean that because the US had a black president there is no racism in the country?

Thanks, Nandakanda, and all the rest of you whom I haven't acknowledged for your varied insights. I am reading all your posts and I thank you for your time and thought. Overall it seems like a rounded view.

Question for those that keep bringing up that Ireland has a gay PM as a sign of tolerance (I’m guessing that’s what you’re implying) It is a sign of tolerance along with the same sex marriage vote.
From my experience and those in my circle couldn't give a rats ass who loved who.
Does that mean that because the US had a black president there is no racism in the country? Obviously not though it certainly gave many black people hope.
There is no comparison there is so much hate in American purely based on skin colour.

Question for those that keep bringing up that Ireland has a gay PM as a sign of tolerance (I’m guessing that’s what you’re implying)

Does that mean that because the US had a black president there is no racism in the country?

Well, thanks for that brilliant and insightful parallel.